I know it was asked before but after reading a lot of post and getting a understanding about everybody, things seriously need to change, but how?

I personally agree there should be no secondary screening of passengers if they don't ring. But what if a shoe or something contains explosives or another part of the body, how can we go about finding it?

I personally like the idea of a full body Xray but understand that its something a lot of people will never like done, so proably will never see it in airports.

A lot of the problem is people's loss of freedom's. And I agree with it, but its been suggested that we go overseas and get examples, heck, I've said that would be a good idea. Now after some thought, it might not be, because some things done overseas infringe on your American rights, so that might be out of the question to.

Another thing was Proable cause. Again I understand but I would like a better definition. Do you mean like we the screeners should prove your intent with a said item in your bag, or if something in your bag triggers interest, its ok for us as screeners to check it at that point?

But I must say, I like and support the idea of counties bag checks. Meaning we should be allowed to pick a bag, eletronic item, or box and screen it with a ETD. It isnt really a waste of your time and it does help improve security. (ETD is the machine used to take samples of items on your bag, with a swab and tested.)

And of course that freaking list, it needs to be redone and i completely agree with that.

So pretty much, what ideas do you folks have that could help keep you folks safe, while upholding your civil rights?

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-03-2003).]

As I have said many times, I don't mind being forcibly searched if the search...

1. is only for aircraft security, and

2. looks the other way completely and totally with regard to anything that does not directly affect aircraft security, e.g. bodies, porn, drugs, rock 'n' roll, whatever,

3. is totally private and NEVER used by law enforcement in any way, shape or form.

As I've said, the principle is used in the USA tax return system that mandates you sign under penalty of perjury...this does not violate your right against self-incrimination as the info on your return is ONLY used to collect taxes, its narrow purpose.

So pretty much while a screener is on duty and it doesnt involve aircraft/airport security, that screener should not report it, pretty much?

Thank you, Screener, for your positive approach.

My thoughts are as follows:
1. The shoe obession has got to stop. Even after a press release from the TSA saying that shoes can stay on, we're still having to take them off or face secondary screening. This has gone on far too long. After all, nobody got hurt on the "shoe bomb" flight.

2. Likewise, photo identification doesn't do much for security. Nobody should have to show ID two and three times just to get through a checkpoint. As a passenger, I don't care that the last person who saw my ID was a "Huntleigh Agent" and now the TSA has to see it. It's crazy. The September 11 hijackers had to show photo identification, so how does this help anybody?

3. As technology develops, maybe there's a way to swab a bag immediately before it is x-rayed, making the screening process a single-step endeavor for the passenger.

4. Turning on an electronic device doesn't do anything. The radio that blew up Pan Am flight 103 worked, so turning it on wouldn't have prevented the tragedy.

And most importantly...

5. Overly-sensitive screening tools can reduce security. If the metal detector is set at such a sensitive setting, screeners spend all their time on distractions and cannot concentrate on finding actual problems. I know, screeners can't adjust this setting, but it's worth mentioning.

Mats,

1) Do you mind if screeners suggest taking off certian shoes? Such as ones we know will make a person ring or we know meet the 1" rule. I know the 1" rule is a little much but has to be enforced for the time being. But we should tell you why we're making the suggestion on why you should remove them though.

2) It's really weird that photo idea has to be shown so many times. At my airport, you might show it to the ticket checker but you will show it at the gate to the ticket agent. The ID is only asked for once in the checkpoint and its only when a ETD alarms.

I dont know much about why so many airports ask for ID, so I cant really comment on that, but Im willing to ask about it.

3) I would say no, because it would make it worse. At that point they would want us to sample every bag. So xray, then random bag it proably the best way.

4) Eletronic arent supposed to be turned on to my understanding and I havent read the SOP in about two months, so I should review but I could have sworn that it said not to do that. Of course at my airport we do have you turn on cameras you want taken around if it has to be on to see through it, but other then that, items arent turned on.

5) Could you maybe give me a better idea of what your saying here. I really don't understand.

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-03-2003).]

What Mats is saying is the TSA's emphasis on turning up the sensitivity of metal detectors so that underwire bras and pants zippers set it off defeats the purpose of the metal detector: A prelim screen of the pax so you know who really needs more scrutiny.

If the WTMD is set so sensitive that it alarms on 90% of the pax, even after they completely divest of all divestable metal, then you shouldn't bother with it, since you are going to wand those 90% anyway.

OTOH, if it is returned to a more rational setting, you may miss an occasional pocketknife but the lines will again move; the lines will look less like former USSR bread lines and more like the USA.

Of course, individual screeners can't do anything about this - the Jackass Loy must change.

Other changes that must occur:

1. Alarms at the WTMD need not get the full treatment - that rule is a silly Mineta holdover from September 13, 2001. It was infantile then, and is infantile now. Just ask the pax to empty pockets and walk thru again. Again - Jackass Loy needs to change.

2. Norm Mineta's obsession with small pocketknives must also end. Millions of people carry them and a juvenile rule that the TSA will ask you to "surrender" them is assinine. Just like the rule discussed above. Yet again, Jackass Loy.

3. TSA screeners should remember that most people they encounter each day are frequent flyers and tire of the screeners' assumption that everyone in the line is a once-a-year vacationer on their way to MCO. Frequent flyers probably constitute 50% to 75% of your pax load each day (unless you are based at MCO or another vacation destination). Most of the public only flies occasionally - but most flyers on any given day are in the air frequently. Why does this matter? Stop yelling about emptying pockets and laptops. Just leave the pax alone.

There are more, but these are good starters.

[This message has been edited by FWAAA (edited 09-03-2003).]

The only place that Ive ever since zippers and underwire bra's picked up, is during a handweld. Does a underwire bra set if off itself, no. It will be a combination of metals that do it.

And Personally if I start talking to someone about what to do and they seem to get upset I will shut my mouth and move on to the next person in line. I dont know who is and isnt a frequent flyer.

But something I get upset about that I wish other airports would stop enforcing is the use of 4 or so bins at the xray. If your bag zips close, it doesnt need a bin. Only a laptop and metal items should be in a bin, oh and jackets. Shoes can go directly on a belt.

The reason I say that, is most passengers leave the bins on the belt forcing either the bag checker or xray operater to get them so more bags can come through.

Now as a frequent flyer do mind a screener asking at the WTMD or the entry if your shoes have ever made you ring? I know that early in the morning even the most seasoned frequent flyer can't remember everything hehe, I sure cant.

A lot of stuff, yes has to be changed by Mr. Loy and his admin. but as a screener we can give ideas to Supervisors or Management and see if they would process that up to Washington.

Thats why Im asking to get some ideas. And I do completely agree with the pocket knife thing.

But should the larger swiss army knives be allowed on?

And some quick info for you all:
1) If your in a hurry, and are getting ready to come through the WTMD, do not walk really fast through it, it most the time will alarm or the screener has to be forced to call for a secondary screening, walk like you would usually.

2) The policies you folks hate, we as screeners have to inforce. And a lot of screeners get tired of the remarks to us personally or the faces. We didnt make the policies and we shouldnt get the attitude for them.

The worst thing we usually do at my airport with someone like this is let them do everything themselves and if they ring, there fault not ours. Sorry but if you get mad because of suggestions we make to help you, then we wont make them.

We know our machines better then you folks and we know what makes them ring and what doesnt. And may be different from airport to airport to.

3) The people who work at the airport and have access into secure areas with "SIDA" badges do have background checks. If you dont have your SIDA badge, you don't get access outside, period.

4) We're not Mcdonald's rejects like a lot of you love to state. 75% of the crew I work with is retired military or police officers that wanted to stay in the government system. I was just out of High School myself and the only job higher at the time was security so I had no choice. Now I do and military here I come.

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-03-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-03-2003).]

And just a little add on....

All of my 54 post made by up till now and later on are of my own opinion and not that of TSA.

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-03-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Screener (edited 09-04-2003).]

Appreciate your helpful attitude. I agree that a lot of things are outside of your control, but if you can move things up the chain it will be helpful.

With that said, here are some of my suggestions:

-allow passengers to lock their checked luggage. If their luggage needs to be checked, do it in the presence of the passenger.

-if you're going to do a full body wand, then allow that person to collect his/her luggage first, so that it doesn't sit unattended, and then wand the person.

-have a secure area at the check point, where passengers can't just walk off unchecked. I don't know how many stories I've read where entire airport terminals have to be evacuated just because some passenger walked off before secondary screening.

-there needs to be at least one armed airport security personnel at the check point. When I flew in the UK they had police officers with sub-machine guns. While I feel that the paranoid level in general has to go down, the security should have some bite to ensure a terrorist doesn't rush the security check point and kill passengers or TSA personnel.

-make better use of our tax dollars. I believe the current security can be made more effective with less dollars. There's no need to over-spend on airport security, when there's so many other areas in our lives that could use the money. The TSA is a bloated agency. This agence must reduce and still be more effective than it is today. We can not afford the current level of TSA over-spending, when teachers are getting laid off, and there are rampant energy issues.

-create and publish a passenger bill of rights. When a passengers suffers some type of inappropriate TSA treatment, provide a formal and quick, and effective complaint process and resolution. Today I don't believe there is any formal, impartial process for passengers to go to complain.

-as you stated, the list of prohibited items needs to change. Little scissors, small knives, and miniature letter openers should not be prohibited. I have stopped travelling with a small scissor, and it's a real pain because many of the hotels do not have scissors in the rooms. Scissors can be used to open packages, trim loose fabric, etc etc...

Screener,
Thanks for your feedback.

There's nothing wrong with telling someone, "Your shoes will set off the alarm." That's both polite and appropriate.

What I was saying about the ETD is that there should be some way for conveyor belt x-ray systems to integrate ETD. Right now the machines are too slow, so the technology isn't ready yet. It's just a pain to go through the x-ray then go over to the ETD, wait for the swabbing, wait for the ETD machine to respond, etc.

The shoe and electronic device issues underscore the continued inconsistencies that outrage frequent flyers. Yes the TSA is new and big, but it's not brand new...

At some airports I've been snapped at for taking off my shoes. Sometimes I get reprimanded for not using a bin, sometimes because I used the bin. Sometimes I have to show my ID at the WTMD and get my boarding card initialed by the screener; in other cases I'm told that my boarding card and ID have to go through the x-ray machine. No wonder I get frustrated!

-Interesting idea about the ETD and Xray. Problem is, barringer and rapiscan would have to get together to do this.

The ETD doesnt take that long to bring back a response, usually about 30 to 45 seconds in most cases.

-Checked luggage is another thing I truthfully cant address because I havent been crossed trained to do so. But I agree you should be present.

But here is a case that is a problem, smaller airports and some larger ones couldnt put Xrays in public view because of lack of space so they were put underground.

If a bag has to be checked but the passenger doesnt respond to calls or something , what should be done?

-We can't allow you touch luggage but we've been told at my airport that the items are to be idenitifed by you so we can carry the items over to the screening area. But Ive noticed that isnt done at all airports which I think would be against SOP since if you say you can't see your stuff, then the screener has to find a way for you to do so.

-A lot of checkpoints now, were always like that, unsecure. Problem is, TSA has to fight the airport for more space or for improvements. The only thing that be able to be done is to post screeners at possible breach places, and watch that area. And if a person is seen breaching, allow a screener to follow that person, until a LEO can get to you.

We're not allowed as screeners to physically restrain passengers. So we basically have to allow someone to breach.

-They took all armed LEO's from the checkpoint a few months back and we were never told why. They should put the air marshall's at the checkpoint maybe, the sane ones that is.

-Can't say much on the Tax Dollars but we do have a security council and I could propose the idea of a Passenger Bill of Rights to them, I really like that one.

-We were told to be more aware of eletronic items on the xray now, in bags and out. Thats why we have a increase in reruns of bags at my airport, to get different angles on eletronic items. I think that is something that could be done to tell if something is in a said eletronic item.

-The thing that gets on my nerves is the use of bins. At my airport we perfer the use of one bin or two. The use for them is Laptop and jacket or metal objects. Are supervisors have allowed us to place laptops and metal from pockets in one bin cutting down on the number of bins left on the belt. It makes it easier for most folks to have one bin, that way they can pick it up and carry it off to the back and reload.


- If you folks are sick, could you make a point not to cough or sneeze in a screeners face?

I'm not sure its an improvement on security, but certainly it won't decrease it: remove the interrogation faced by international pax coming into the US. Since it isn't carried out on any internal N American flights (including US/Canada), it's window dressing.

A lot of the security things within the US I personally think are down to poor equipment selection, which the screeners on the ground have little control over.

And yes, I'm a frequent flyer who knows the drill, but can't remember what all the differences between airports (especially US/European), so maybe more signs earlier warning me what it is I am to do will stop people yelling at me? To someone who travels in the US only infrequently, I feel that there is a great deal of assumption that I will know what the current rules are - yet strangely, I don't spend my time trying to find them out

Thing about the signs is that a lot of people fail to pay any attention to them. We have signs up with what you do when you get to the Xray but no one reads them, and if they do, they half read them.

People have come up and put there bags containing laptops in them and when we have to check the and then inform them what to do next time, they make comments like "Someone should have told me!" or "Maybe if you had signs!".

Oh and my new email doesnt work so I can't access my Screener account name hehe

Some of the airports I went through last week were very good and had signs (EWR was best - just a shame nothing about shoes until I got to the front wearing hiking boots ), some didn't have any signs(YVR - yes I know, not TSA!). And I do look for signs, unless particularly zombified by an overnight flight.

You would be happy to know we have about 7 signs. One with the prohibited items list. One with the Federal law about firearms in airports( big big sign).

Then 5 that tell you about film and your opitions, another telling you to remove your laptop, another telling you to place at metal objects on your person in your carryon or a provided bin. And the last two have to do with jackets and pacemakers.

But like I said, most passengers, like as many as about 80% dont take the time to read them and come up and ask us what they need to do, forcing us to yell, hehe are checkpoint doesnt carry sound to well.