cscube

Yes, you can use the old passport at these kiosks. Mine is an old one without the chip, and as I stated earlier, I just went through with it few days ago. All the machine does is scan the page with the photo + ID info.

cscube

This is possibly true, as after I confirmed my identity info on screen, the next screen showed where I'm flying in from and the flight number. You will be asked to confirm if the info is correct or not, before going on the the Customs Declaration questions, which, btw are much shorter than the ones listed on the blue form.

SeriouslyLost

...That can't use the automated gates.

Unless of course, the US has adopted the idea and then crippled the system so as to render it utterly useless for the purpose it exists for. 50/50 chance on that front, IME.


ETA: (Apparently I'm mistaken and CBP are indeed morons and you can use non-chip PP's)

SeriouslyLost

You're kidding?!

You mean they really did adopt an idea from outside the US and then deliberately act to cripple it so as to remove the entire benefit the system offers?! CBP & DHS and whomever else implemented that really are amazingly stupid.

chollie

Not exactly.

IIRC, the chip passports started rolling out in 2007. That means that by the end of 2017, all passports will have a chip.

There are GE folks out there who paid their $, did the checks, but don't have a chip in their passports.

The current GE kiosks apparently work by scanning the passport face page. It's possible that they aren't even equipped to read the chip.

That would be a win-WIN for both holders of pre-2007 issue date passports, particularly those with GE (don't have the inconvenience of paying for a new, chip-equipped passport years early just to get the chip) and the government contractor who supplies the kiosks (if the current ones don't read the chip, then they'll all have to be replaced or upgraded at taxpayer expense).

WilcoRoger

Jeez, "only in America" the land of botched half solutions. No wonder you'll still get a receipt and still have to talk with CBP agents - automated...

But hey, this is the country where cheques are still not in the museums

cscube

That was exactly what was going through in my mind, while receipt in hand waiting for the CBP officer. I was too engrossed with these new machines and the process of answering questions to really examine them carefully. Next time, I will.

GUWonder

Well I have used it a lot at YVR and now the odds of getting a longer discussion are lower, and that is a good thing. Even when getting the X, it tends to be better.

Scannable old passports being included makes sense given there are millions still valid.

There are no automated gates with this.

RadioGirl

As another data point, last week returning to SYD (where US GE members are allowed to use the genuinely automated SmartGate system) I observed four flight crew (maybe United or AA) in the adjacent line. One of the women had missed going to the kiosk (of which there are several between the last Duty Free and the Customs area) to get a ticket, so when she got the machine she was flummoxed. There was a lot of loud discussion among the four of them, with one of the others eventually saying "Are you GE? You have to go back there to a kiosk and get a ticket." And he held her place in line until she got back.

Not a big drama (there were a lot of SmartGate lines and the others were moving quickly) but it was clear that the whole "automated" aspect was confusing to the Americans.

BigFlyer

I didn't realize that one could use a non-epassport in these gates.

Presumably then these machines read the machine readable portion, and then print out the receipt, but DON'T check for a counterfeit passport or modified passport? The epassport machines in Europe compare the photo taken of the passenger standing in front of the machine to the chip, and then open the gate if their is a match.

I can see why they still need the human intervention, as the system is very insecure compared to the European system.

Hyperacusis

Why would you use this 'a lot' when GE is available, as it is at YVR? (Unless you don't have GE)

WilcoRoger

IMO it makes very little sense - install a technology, that solves no problems, because it must be compatible with legacy passports.

How about a fully automated system (as in many other parts of the world) with a sign "only for biometric passports" If the gates speeded up the entry procedure, it might even speed up the renewal of legacy passports, because frequent(ish) travellers would have some incentive to get one. And one could do away with the whole GE thingy for US citizens in a few years - who would need it, when you could enter your own country in 15 seconds? Sounds utopia? It works elsewhere...

etch5895

Sadly, I think that this idea may get pushback from American citizens who don't fly internationally very often and who feel that without actually interacting with a live immigration officer, the floodgates of illegal aliens and terrorists will open. In other words, it's fine as long as someone else is being inconvenienced. Those who travel frequently realize that these fully automated systems are an incredible convenience that save time and money in the long run. Even with the implementation of these systems, there is nothing preventing CBP or any immigration officer from conducting spot checks/interviews on a random basis.

GUWonder

There are reasons to do so, with or without GE; for example, as when the GE people are in the company of some kinds of people who don't have GE.

Personally I am one of those people who like testing systems. For example YVR CBSA refused to admit me using the US Passport Card on Saturday. I wanted to see how it would go over.

They do. At HEL this time last year they did just that. Not sure why, as I never inquired enough to find out what exactly was going on.

The pushback against fully automated admission would come from those who travel way more frequently than the average American: USG employees, elected and otherwise.

BigFlyer

According to Timatic, Canada should accept a US birth certificate, strange the wouldn't accept the more secure passport card.

Have you ever tried using the passport card with US preclearance at YVR?