Question regarding ESTA and names on e-ticket
Apr 27, 2012 | 7:54 pm
#16
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
Personally, I believe you are over-thinking the whole thing.
I have an ESTA and the name on it does not match the entire name on my passport. I have had no problems entering the USA with this ESTA.
Say my name is Mary Jane Jones (not my real name, just an example). Mary Jane Jones is the name on my passport.
On my ESTA application, I put "Mary" as my first name, and "Jones" as my last name - no middle name, as instructed on the web site.
So, my passport says Mary Jane Jones and my ESTA printout says Mary Jones, and that has not caused any problems.
In you case, your passport will say Johan Smith Anderson, and your ESTA could say Johan Anderson, and this should not not cause you any problem.
It doesn't matter to the official who looks at your documentation that, in Scandinavia, "Smith" is also considered to be part of your first name. It is written as a separate word and in the USA it will be considered to be your middle name.
It's the US official who has to be satisfied in this instance, and not your own national custom. So, go by the US rules on this, and put Johan as your first name and Anderson as your last name. Don't include Smith.
Of course, you could probably still put "Johan Smith" as your first name, and still not have any problems!
I have an ESTA and the name on it does not match the entire name on my passport. I have had no problems entering the USA with this ESTA.
Say my name is Mary Jane Jones (not my real name, just an example). Mary Jane Jones is the name on my passport.
On my ESTA application, I put "Mary" as my first name, and "Jones" as my last name - no middle name, as instructed on the web site.
So, my passport says Mary Jane Jones and my ESTA printout says Mary Jones, and that has not caused any problems.
In you case, your passport will say Johan Smith Anderson, and your ESTA could say Johan Anderson, and this should not not cause you any problem.
It doesn't matter to the official who looks at your documentation that, in Scandinavia, "Smith" is also considered to be part of your first name. It is written as a separate word and in the USA it will be considered to be your middle name.
It's the US official who has to be satisfied in this instance, and not your own national custom. So, go by the US rules on this, and put Johan as your first name and Anderson as your last name. Don't include Smith.
Of course, you could probably still put "Johan Smith" as your first name, and still not have any problems!
Believe me I have been through this with immigration a lot of times.
Apr 28, 2012 | 8:28 am
#17
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A middle name can be taken as a given name as far as the US Government is concerned.
Of course I do, to answer your first question. I also have relatives and many more acquaintances whose first and/or middle name(s) are the family name(s) while the given name is the last name or the middle name.
I am familiar with the "problems" such people have with airlines, with government agencies in numerous parts of the world and with other parties, but nothing generally insurmountable when dealing with the US Government, although the TSA is trying to mess up things. [The most asinine name-related problems I have ever seen with government agencies anywhere are in Scandinavia with some of the most reactionary, stubborn name rules of any place in the world that US embassy/consular ACS staff encounters.]
Any insurmountable name problems when dealing with the US Government?
So do you have any relatives that have any names first that are middle names and then the last name is the given?
Do they ever get into trouble?
I have 2 first middle names and the third is my given name. The name erverybody calls me and is on my ID's.
It has caused problems for me.
Do they ever get into trouble?
I have 2 first middle names and the third is my given name. The name erverybody calls me and is on my ID's.
It has caused problems for me.
I am familiar with the "problems" such people have with airlines, with government agencies in numerous parts of the world and with other parties, but nothing generally insurmountable when dealing with the US Government, although the TSA is trying to mess up things. [The most asinine name-related problems I have ever seen with government agencies anywhere are in Scandinavia with some of the most reactionary, stubborn name rules of any place in the world that US embassy/consular ACS staff encounters.]
Any insurmountable name problems when dealing with the US Government?
Apr 28, 2012 | 1:49 pm
#18
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Scandinavia
Programs: KLM
Posts: 12
I just checked the Civil Registration System, I only have a first name which is Johan Smith and a surname which is Anderson (as an example), nothing is mentioned about a middle name.
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
Apr 28, 2012 | 2:49 pm
#19
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
I just checked the Civil Registration System, I only have a first name which is Johan Smith and a surname which is Anderson (as an example), nothing is mentioned about a middle name.
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
What airport are you landing at?
Some airports are more stupid than others. But no it should not cause a problem.
Idiots work everywhere.
Apr 28, 2012 | 4:56 pm
#20
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I just checked the Civil Registration System, I only have a first name which is Johan Smith and a surname which is Anderson (as an example), nothing is mentioned about a middle name.
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
Well, if I write Johan Smith in the ESTA application (in the field first given name), and get an approval, will it still be a problem at check in or when I arrive in the U.S.?
If in your situation -- or with others in your situation in my travel party -- I wouldn't worry about it as things, under your circumstances mentioned above, almost certainly work out fine with the airline and passport control/immigration.
Apr 28, 2012 | 5:31 pm
#21
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Scandinavia
Programs: KLM
Posts: 12
Apr 28, 2012 | 5:35 pm
#22
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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Scandinavia
Programs: KLM
Posts: 12
Thank you. I see, but it should not be a reason to deny boarding or entry?
I cannot really see why they don't want the FULL name in the ESTA application! Very weird! Because they want that the names on the flight tickets should match the names in the passport!
I cannot really see why they don't want the FULL name in the ESTA application! Very weird! Because they want that the names on the flight tickets should match the names in the passport!
It can work fine and generally does, but it won't necessarily be automatic no-issue at departure and/or arrival airport. People travel in such situations generally without any problem, but as tanja mentions there are some idiots who may try to make a mountain out of a molehill.
If in your situation -- or with others in your situation in my travel party -- I wouldn't worry about it as things, under your circumstances mentioned above, almost certainly work out fine with the airline and passport control/immigration.
If in your situation -- or with others in your situation in my travel party -- I wouldn't worry about it as things, under your circumstances mentioned above, almost certainly work out fine with the airline and passport control/immigration.
Apr 28, 2012 | 5:46 pm
#23
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New Zealand/ UK
Programs: NZ, EK, QF, SQ.
Posts: 776
I don't really care what you consider is the difference between a middle name and a given name. As far as most people are concerned, if your name is Bessie Annie Smith, then Annie is the middle name, because it comes between Bessie and Smith. It's the name in the middle, so it is a middle name.
As an aside, I think that all your names are "given" - being given to you by your parents. Are you talking about the name you are usually known by?
My husband has four names, First-name, Second-name, Third-name and Surname. All his life, he has been known as Second-name, but with the introduction of computers and travel requirements, he has to use First-name for all his travel bookings, ESTA etc.
Based on our experience with my names, husband's names, and getting ESTAs, I still think that the OP is over thinking and obsessing about something that will not cause him a problem.
And I still maintain that it is the US criteria he has to satisfy and comply with, not his own country's interpretation of naming practices. And the US will say that any name that comes in between two other names is a middle name.
Apr 28, 2012 | 6:03 pm
#24
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New Zealand/ UK
Programs: NZ, EK, QF, SQ.
Posts: 776
Because my father's name (Smith) is included in my first name, it does not mean that it should be considered as a middle name.
And I don't have any documents that says that (Smith) is a middle name. And the best proof is my passport. It does not consider it as a middle name, only a surname and Given name(s).
Thank you very much for your kind reply
And I don't have any documents that says that (Smith) is a middle name. And the best proof is my passport. It does not consider it as a middle name, only a surname and Given name(s).
Thank you very much for your kind reply
Stop obsessing about this. You won't convince an American authority to follow a Scandinavian perspective on naming practices.
Either put "Johan Smith" or "Johan" as your first name. I don't think it will make a scrap of difference. Once you have got your ESTA (which will happen in a matter of seconds, as long as there is no reason for further investigation, such as a previous criminal conviction) print it out and carry it with you.
Try putting "Johan Smith" as your first name when doing your on-line application. If that is accepted, then you are OK. If that is not accepted, just put "Johan" in that field.
The ESTA is compared with your passport, not your ticket or boarding pass. Most of the time, when the immigration official scans your passport he/she will see that there is an ESTA attached to that passport and they will not even ask to see your printout, your ticket, or your boarding pass.
Apr 28, 2012 | 6:11 pm
#25
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: New Zealand/ UK
Programs: NZ, EK, QF, SQ.
Posts: 776
Thank you very much for the reply.
I see what you mean.
But as mentioned, when I made the booking I wrote Johan Smith as (First name) and Anderson as (Surname). I left the (Middle name) field empty, when I made the booking. So on my e-ticket it is written as:
JOHANSMITH ANDERSON
And it will also be written as JOHANSMITH ANDERSON on my boarding pass (I think).
If I only write Johan Anderson in the ESTA application, it will not match the flight ticket (boarding pass)?
Do you also use Mary Jane when booking flights? Is it shown on your boarding pass?
I see what you mean.
But as mentioned, when I made the booking I wrote Johan Smith as (First name) and Anderson as (Surname). I left the (Middle name) field empty, when I made the booking. So on my e-ticket it is written as:
JOHANSMITH ANDERSON
And it will also be written as JOHANSMITH ANDERSON on my boarding pass (I think).
If I only write Johan Anderson in the ESTA application, it will not match the flight ticket (boarding pass)?
Do you also use Mary Jane when booking flights? Is it shown on your boarding pass?
No, I only use "Mary" and my surname when booking flights and that is what shows on my boarding pass, unless a particular airline's web site asks for other names. All that the USA requires for advance notification from airlines is the first and last names of passengers.
By the way, the printout you make of your ESTA may not even mention your name at all - to stop us from mixing up our ESTAs, I had to write our names on those for my husband and myself.
Apr 28, 2012 | 7:00 pm
#26
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American practices with names has changed over time too, which has led to state and federal inconsistency increasingly becoming an issue even for natural-born US citizens.
Apr 28, 2012 | 7:11 pm
#27
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It generally does not result in being denied boarding or entry, but it may be a YMMV situation sometimes.
Apr 28, 2012 | 7:34 pm
#28
Join Date: Nov 2009
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I have found the above sentence to be false, as will informed consular and other State and DHS officials who pay attention to what goes on when it comes to naming practices of natural-born US citizens, naturalized US citizens and foreigners/foreign persons. It depends on the circumstances.
American practices with names has changed over time too, which has led to state and federal inconsistency increasingly becoming an issue even for natural-born US citizens.
American practices with names has changed over time too, which has led to state and federal inconsistency increasingly becoming an issue even for natural-born US citizens.
When you've just come off a flight and you are seeking entry into the US, it is best to give them what they want, what they expect to see. It is not the time to discuss cultural differences in naming practices.
Apr 28, 2012 | 8:21 pm
#29
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
But it won't be a "well-informed consular and other State and DHS" official who will be looking at the OP's passport and ESTA. It will be an ordinary bloke, who has had a basic amount of training and who will have a US-slanted perspective.
When you've just come off a flight and you are seeking entry into the US, it is best to give them what they want, what they expect to see. It is not the time to discuss cultural differences in naming practices.
When you've just come off a flight and you are seeking entry into the US, it is best to give them what they want, what they expect to see. It is not the time to discuss cultural differences in naming practices.
But before I moved here there could somtimes be issues.
Like I said there are some very well educated immigration agents and there are idiots.
Apr 28, 2012 | 8:23 pm
#30
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
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