Passenger pulled from UA flight for misunderstood question?
#31
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,725
#32
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,811
This story bears out my theory that one should avoid all eye or verbal contact with flight attendants until one has observed their behavior for awhile to determine whether or not they're wound properly. I am not kidding. A couple of years ago I had an FA attempt to pull me off a flight for saying good morning -- and indicating, in a friendly way, that I'd seen her and her crewmates in the hotel lounge last evening.
That's the last time I say good morning to any FA without confirming they are not insane.
Unquestionably plausible. Yes.
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Jul 21, 2010 at 12:25 am Reason: merge consecutive posts
#33




Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS Titanium, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,583
#34
Moderator: Travel Safety/Security, Travel Tools, California, Los Angeles; FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: LAX
Programs: oneword Emerald
Posts: 24,797
Has this been reported anywhere other than the blogosphere?
Every blog entry that I read about this incident seems to be attributed to the removed passenger's website, joesugarman.com.
I can't help but wonder if it is an internet marketing ploy.
Every blog entry that I read about this incident seems to be attributed to the removed passenger's website, joesugarman.com.
I can't help but wonder if it is an internet marketing ploy.
#35




Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS Titanium, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,583
I ran across it on Fark, which linked to The Consumerist.
To repeat myself, what's significant to me is that the story is plausible, or do I mean truthy.
To repeat myself, what's significant to me is that the story is plausible, or do I mean truthy.
#36
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Chevy Chase, MD, USA
Programs: UA 1K, MM
Posts: 99
When I saw the blog post's title, "What is America coming to?", I figured this was the pretext for a rant against one or more of the political parties. Didn't see one but like others have said, I'm surprised that someone who flies so much has never run into an incompetent airline employee or a screwed up airline process and then, when it happens, assumes that the country is falling apart.
#37
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M




Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 58,133
When I saw the blog post's title, "What is America coming to?", I figured this was the pretext for a rant against one or more of the political parties. Didn't see one but like others have said, I'm surprised that someone who flies so much has never run into an incompetent airline employee or a screwed up airline process and then, when it happens, assumes that the country is falling apart.
#38




Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS Titanium, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,583
I also wonder what her activities consisted of the night before the flight if she truly mistook "are meals being served" for "are there police on the plane?" 
Pathetic and sadly plausible.
#39

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,730
(hate that phrase). The GA had nothing to do with it. It doesn't sound like the police did anything other than inspect the passenger's ID and probably run a warrant check. While I disagree with that action--cop had no legitimate grounds to demand papers from this passenger--the police had nothing to do with the passenger being evicted, and it doesn't sound like the police detained him for more than a few minutes.The inevitable problem in these situations is that at each escalation level, the person being escalated to (e.g., captian) doesn't stop to think if any of this makes sense. Instead, he takes at face value what the person says, embellishes it a bit in his own mind, and then escalates his own escalated version to the next level. All it would take is stopping to think and asking a few questions, but that goes against the culture of paranoia and "abundance of caution" that has been fostered.
That is how we get passengers thrown off planes for asking about meals, flights diverted because BOB is written on a barf bag, people's personal private property such as laptops detonated by bomb squads, custom-battery packs confiscated by TSA, special-ed teachers with leather bookmarks arrested and threatened with $10K fines.
One of the few ways to stop this BS is to start holding accountable the people who make these ridiculous escalations instead of rewarding them for their paranoia with commendations and awards. The operating rule should be "reasonable caution" not "abundance of caution," and when escalation beyond reasonable caution is evidenced, there should be consequences.
We're hearing one side of the story and while I'll admit a certain bias for the airline crew if it was that simple to get someone kicked off a plane half the passengers on every flight I've ever been on would be asked to leave the aircraft.
I am not saying that the blogger was a legitimate security threat and I am sure a midunderstanding of some sort occurred...but I don't think we've got all of the facts.
I am not saying that the blogger was a legitimate security threat and I am sure a midunderstanding of some sort occurred...but I don't think we've got all of the facts.
#40




Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: UA Gold 1MM, AA EXP, HH Diamond, MR Gold, Avis PC, Hertz PC
Posts: 1,263
Maybe it's just me but "be a meal served" and "police officer" doesn't seem like that big of a stretch. Police officer can easily sound like 4 syllables if spoken fast or with an accent. Add in the loud noise from a CRJ/7 with the door open...
#41
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,857
I ran across it on Fark, which linked to The Consumerist.
To repeat myself, what's significant to me is that the story is plausible, or do I mean truthy.
To repeat myself, what's significant to me is that the story is plausible, or do I mean truthy.

#42




Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: SEA/YVR/BLI
Programs: UA "Lifetime" Gold, AS Titanium, OW Emerald, HH Lifetime Diamond, IC Plat, Marriott Gold, Hertz Gold
Posts: 9,583

Still, consider that just because something doesn't hit, say, the New York Times doesn't mean it didn't happen. @:-)
Then google "Joe Sugarman" and ask yourself why somebody with a profitable career would risk his livelihood by telling some crazy and untrue story. @:-)
#43
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Chevy Chase, MD, USA
Programs: UA 1K, MM
Posts: 99
Then google "Joe Sugarman" and ask yourself why somebody with a profitable career would risk his livelihood by telling some crazy and untrue story. @:-)
#44
Moderator: Travel Safety/Security, Travel Tools, California, Los Angeles; FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: LAX
Programs: oneword Emerald
Posts: 24,797
#45
FlyerTalk Evangelist



Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38,543
No, I believe that a FA who was either ultra paranoid about security or on a power trip decided she wanted him removed, and exaggerated he situation to the captain. Rather than investigating the situation himself, the captain, probably also ultra security paranoid, took the FA's word and decided to remove the passenger "out of an abundance of caution"
(hate that phrase). The GA had nothing to do with it. It doesn't sound like the police did anything other than inspect the passenger's ID and probably run a warrant check. While I disagree with that action--cop had no legitimate grounds to demand papers from this passenger--the police had nothing to do with the passenger being evicted, and it doesn't sound like the police detained him for more than a few minutes.
(hate that phrase). The GA had nothing to do with it. It doesn't sound like the police did anything other than inspect the passenger's ID and probably run a warrant check. While I disagree with that action--cop had no legitimate grounds to demand papers from this passenger--the police had nothing to do with the passenger being evicted, and it doesn't sound like the police detained him for more than a few minutes.(This is also assuming it's a real incident at all.)

