Refused the X-ray Backscatter today
#31
Join Date: May 2010
Location: FLL - Nice and Warm
Programs: TSA Disparager Gold
Posts: 1,025
The real danger from these Scanners
The Health Physics Society (HPS) reports that a person undergoing a backscatter scan receives approximately 0.05 μSv (or 0.005 mrems) of radiation; Rapidscan reports 0.09 μSv (0.009 mrems).
According to a draft standard on the FDA website:
http://www.fda.gov/OHRMS/DOCKETS/AC/...3751b1_06b.pdf
the allowable dose from a scan would be 0.1 μSv, and that report uses a model whereby a 0.01 μSv dose results in a 510−10 additional risk of death by cancer. Since the dose limit is ten times higher than 0.01 μSv, their model would predict one additional cancer death per 200 million scans. Since the airports in the UK handled 218 million passengers in 2009, if all passengers were scanned in the UK at the maximum dosage, this would produce on average one additional death every year. Is this acceptable?
Further, if you believe the nuclear physicists:
http://www.npr.org/assets/news/2010/05/17/concern.pdf
and the dose is 20 times as great, or greater, than we are frying more people than the terrorist could have ever imagined.

Exercise your RIGHT TO OPT-OUT. Tell your friends and relatives.
According to a draft standard on the FDA website:
http://www.fda.gov/OHRMS/DOCKETS/AC/...3751b1_06b.pdf
the allowable dose from a scan would be 0.1 μSv, and that report uses a model whereby a 0.01 μSv dose results in a 510−10 additional risk of death by cancer. Since the dose limit is ten times higher than 0.01 μSv, their model would predict one additional cancer death per 200 million scans. Since the airports in the UK handled 218 million passengers in 2009, if all passengers were scanned in the UK at the maximum dosage, this would produce on average one additional death every year. Is this acceptable?
Further, if you believe the nuclear physicists:
http://www.npr.org/assets/news/2010/05/17/concern.pdf
and the dose is 20 times as great, or greater, than we are frying more people than the terrorist could have ever imagined.
Exercise your RIGHT TO OPT-OUT. Tell your friends and relatives.
#32
FlyerTalk Evangelist


Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: An NPR mind living in a Fox News world
Posts: 14,343
I would lock my carry on so no one can go through it without me being right there to observe it. I would then tell them I'll be more than happy to unlock it for you to inspect while I am observing them, I'll be right over after I'm done being groped. Seriously, I have my cash, credit cards and expensive camera equipment and you think I'm NOT going to lock it to keep their grubby fingers off of it?
#33
Join Date: Dec 2009
Programs: TSO, AS MVP, AOPA member, Private Pilot ASEL
Posts: 571
This has happened to me 2-3 times while wearing sandals. In each instance, I asked the screener, "Did it ever occur to you how stupid you look wanding bare feet?" One guy clammed up, got red in the face, and didn't say anything in response. The other two agreed with me.
#34
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,702
#35
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 15,788
"money" is the least important component of this process. If you mean cash money, you left them with your CC numbers and the home address you were not at. Typical TSA theater while ignoring actual threats. I hope you have real-time notification of any charges to your credit cards.
#36




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Sydney (for now), GVA (only in my memories)
Programs: QF Lifetime Silver (big whoop)
Posts: 9,340
Suppose I'm driving down a street in the shopping district looking for a large department store, peering at building names or street numbers. If at some point I realize that all the buildings on both sides of the road, ahead of me and for the last six blocks, are suburban houses, wouldn't you think I'd stopped paying attention my search?
#38
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,702
Before SATTSO says "told ya so", I'm not saying that TSO1973 should do his job perfectly, but at the least it would seem that someone doing a search is concentrating, to some extent, on what they're searching for. If you're patting someone down to find something that's (possibly) concealed, shouldn't you be aware of whether the area is question could conceal something? If you're patting down someone's bare arms, legs, feet, are you really thinking about what you're doing?
Suppose I'm driving down a street in the shopping district looking for a large department store, peering at building names or street numbers. If at some point I realize that all the buildings on both sides of the road, ahead of me and for the last six blocks, are suburban houses, wouldn't you think I'd stopped paying attention my search?
Suppose I'm driving down a street in the shopping district looking for a large department store, peering at building names or street numbers. If at some point I realize that all the buildings on both sides of the road, ahead of me and for the last six blocks, are suburban houses, wouldn't you think I'd stopped paying attention my search?
I believe I do my job well - not perfect
I have caught myself accidently wanding bare feet. But that was not because I was not paying attention. Habit can be a hard thing to break, even if you are paying attnetion.And then, of course, there are the times your mind wanders. That is true. I would no of no one, in any profession - including you!
- who has not had a wandering mind from time to time at work.But I would argue that mostly it's habit regardless of who well a screener is paying attention.
#39
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 15,788
You and the rest of FlyerTalk know your job is a joke, but once you start admitting it you should really think of resigning. @:-)
#40
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 90
which is more dangerous if you take one flight everyday for a whole year?
A: radiation received as a result of going through the nude-o-scope 365 times
B: the 365 flights that you took
C: the 365 airline meals that you ate(assuming all flights served hot meals)
A: radiation received as a result of going through the nude-o-scope 365 times
B: the 365 flights that you took
C: the 365 airline meals that you ate(assuming all flights served hot meals)
#41
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,702
what kind of food?
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Jul 9, 2010 at 4:02 pm Reason: merge consective posts
#42




Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Sydney (for now), GVA (only in my memories)
Programs: QF Lifetime Silver (big whoop)
Posts: 9,340
)Your colleague Dean is on another thread describing how he found something surprising in a leather folder because he was alert. Your management describes you as being on the front line in the war on terror.
I've had screeners pat me down from shoulder to wrist when I'm wearing a light blouse with sleeves that stop well above the elbow. How can you say you're searching for the 1-in-a-trillion hidden bomb and not be aware that you're searching someone's bare arms for it?
#43
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend




Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 72,322
Of course, choosing to work for TSA sort of defines the whole equation, once you think about it.
#44

Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,730
(B) and (C) are things that one voluntarily agrees to do with some potential gain for themselves. You either travel for work, for fun, or even for mileage run. But you are gaining something for the travel. You eat airline meals because you're hungry, or are too lazy to bring your own food, or like the hot airline food better than the smashed sandwich you could pack or meal you could get from the food court.
(A) is something that airport security (particularly the UK and any place that is making the strip search mandatory or giving the impression that the strip search is mandatory, including some "rogue" TSA stations) is imposing on the passenger with no gain for the passenger undergoing the risk. I know 100% for certain that I am not a terrorist. And I know that someone has not secretly concealed a weapon/explosive/incendiary on my person. So I gain nothing by going through a backscatter. The only person who gains anything are the nervous nellies who want to see everyone else get x-rayed so that they "feel safe," and for that matter, want to see anything and everything done for the sake of making them "feel" safe.
Take medical x-rays for instance. In general, an x-ray will not be ordered unless there is a benefit to the patient that outweighs any risks. So I might have dental x-rays to see if I have cavities. Or an x-ray of my leg to see if it's broken. Or even a CT scan (quite large dose) to diagnose an organ plan. But nobody has x-rays for grins and giggles. And nobody has an x-ray ordered for the benefit of someone else, not the person receiving the x-ray.
#45
Join Date: Dec 2009
Programs: TSO, AS MVP, AOPA member, Private Pilot ASEL
Posts: 571
I understand what your saying, but can also tell you most people wear socks. After you have wanded hundreds (thousands in many cases) of people it's not that you are nit paying attention, but that habit is hard to break.
I believe I do my job well - not perfect
I have caught myself accidently wanding bare feet. But that was not because I was not paying attention. Habit can be a hard thing to break, even if you are paying attnetion.
And then, of course, there are the times your mind wanders. That is true. I would no of no one, in any profession - including you!
- who has not had a wandering mind from time to time at work.
But I would argue that mostly it's habit regardless of who well a screener is paying attention.
I believe I do my job well - not perfect
I have caught myself accidently wanding bare feet. But that was not because I was not paying attention. Habit can be a hard thing to break, even if you are paying attnetion.And then, of course, there are the times your mind wanders. That is true. I would no of no one, in any profession - including you!
- who has not had a wandering mind from time to time at work.But I would argue that mostly it's habit regardless of who well a screener is paying attention.
And to the other poster who mentioned brain surgeons, test pilots, race car drivers, yes you are right. However, any time, in ANY profession, you have a human element involved, there is the possibility of mistakes. If surgeons made no mistakes whatsoever, then there would be no need for malpractice attorneys. Stock brokers? How about that guy a few weeks ago who meant to trade a million shares and punched in a billion and the Dow dropped 1000 points? Mistakes will happen.

