Refused the X-ray Backscatter today
Jul 7, 2010 | 7:57 pm
#16
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Considering yourself if you can write email to FSD at [email protected] for any concerns with TSA. Because TSA are not appropriate to ask someone to get through backscatter machines at DL terminal 2. This is not necessary to put in the body scanners. This is not real specific time for me to get through the body scanners. I don't have a solve problems from TSA at all. Or if you want to talks with my friends who work at DL in FLL.
Jul 7, 2010 | 8:13 pm
#17
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We really need a Wikileaks video of the TSA think tank (lol) discussing these things.
Jul 7, 2010 | 9:06 pm
#18
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Considering yourself if you can write email to FSD at [email protected] for any concerns with TSA. Because TSA are not appropriate to ask someone to get through backscatter machines at DL terminal 2. This is not necessary to put in the body scanners. This is not real specific time for me to get through the body scanners. I don't have a solve problems from TSA at all. Or if you want to talks with my friends who work at DL in FLL.
My dealings with him are not positive and I have little good to say about the person.
About par for TSA!
Jul 7, 2010 | 9:32 pm
#19
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I haven't had my bags searched either time I've refused the Nude-o-Scope. I have refused to remove my shoes as well both times, and had my shoes swabbed..
My new strategy is to make sure I eat some stuff that will make me really gassy, and when the screener is running his hands over my butt, I'll let go with a hell of a fart. This is going to take a lot of timing and discipline of course, but it will be great once I get it all right.
My new strategy is to make sure I eat some stuff that will make me really gassy, and when the screener is running his hands over my butt, I'll let go with a hell of a fart. This is going to take a lot of timing and discipline of course, but it will be great once I get it all right.
You should also follow these steps, courtesy of another FTer.
Here's the best way I've found to deal with pat-down searches. The trick is to leverage the TSA guy's own insecurities in order to wind them up as tightly as possible, thus paying them back for performing these unAmerican searches to begin with.
Before anything starts, request the groper to change his gloves. He will do so, albeit begrudgingly.
The pat down always begins with the groper's spiel about how and where he's going to touch you and making sure that's OK with you. This is your que to say, So long as there is nothing sexual involved, then ok.
You are saying this in the knowledge that the groper is most likely a heterosexual with a deep-seated, high school locker-room-like fear of being labeled 'queer'. He will visibly flinch at your saying this. One of two things will then happen. He will either involuntarily blurt-out, "I'm not gay"; or he will say nothing.
-If he says "I'm not gay" or something along those lines, this is your que to talk about how it doesn't matter to you, that certain types are attracted to certain jobs, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
-If he says nothing, talk about how much you love your wife/girlfriend and how you're 'just not that way', that you have lots of gay friends and you respect their lifestyle and they respect yours, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
I cannot stress how important it is to keep a straight face while you're saying all of this. You need to appear to be sincere. Otherwise it just won't be as effective.
Half the time the groper will get so angry that he'll call over his supervisor, something you tell him you wholeheartedly approve of to make sure there is no 'funny business' when he's touching you.
After all is said and done, you'll have seriously ruined a TSA groper's day and you'll feel less gross about being felt up in the name of security theater.
Before anything starts, request the groper to change his gloves. He will do so, albeit begrudgingly.
The pat down always begins with the groper's spiel about how and where he's going to touch you and making sure that's OK with you. This is your que to say, So long as there is nothing sexual involved, then ok.
You are saying this in the knowledge that the groper is most likely a heterosexual with a deep-seated, high school locker-room-like fear of being labeled 'queer'. He will visibly flinch at your saying this. One of two things will then happen. He will either involuntarily blurt-out, "I'm not gay"; or he will say nothing.
-If he says "I'm not gay" or something along those lines, this is your que to talk about how it doesn't matter to you, that certain types are attracted to certain jobs, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
-If he says nothing, talk about how much you love your wife/girlfriend and how you're 'just not that way', that you have lots of gay friends and you respect their lifestyle and they respect yours, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
I cannot stress how important it is to keep a straight face while you're saying all of this. You need to appear to be sincere. Otherwise it just won't be as effective.
Half the time the groper will get so angry that he'll call over his supervisor, something you tell him you wholeheartedly approve of to make sure there is no 'funny business' when he's touching you.
After all is said and done, you'll have seriously ruined a TSA groper's day and you'll feel less gross about being felt up in the name of security theater.
Jul 8, 2010 | 12:25 am
#20
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 381
"Actually they made me take all of the money out of my wallet and hold it in my hand. And I was only 5 feet away from the other agents going through my luggage and I was watching them the entire time my body was being patted down.
Had I witnessed anything out of the ordinary I would have stopped the pat down and demanded a supervisor immediately.
As for telling them why I didn't want to walk through the X-ray unit I felt it is necessary to "educate" them that it is ionizing radiation. They are standing right next to the unit. Where is the lead shielding? By radiation protection standards there is a 6 foot minimum when x-rays are being produced. You see us x-ray techs behind a lead wall when we are taking your x-rays.
Maybe the TSA will start having high incidents of cancer or other radiation health issues and then someone will realize that this type of unnecessary exposure is not worth it.
I will never believe this is safe. As I was being patted down I watched many children being sent through the x-ray unit. That's just asinine.
The whole process probably took less than 8 minutes. They all changed their gloves. Even the TSA doing the pat down changed his gloves in front of me and informed me before he was going to do this and how he was going to touch my body during the pat down.
Not once was I left alone. Someone was around me the entire time.
It will be interesting how many times I will have to go through this at FLL Terminal 2. I have a flight every week until the end of August. I will use the other security lines to see if I get selected to stand in the X-ray unit since I observed that line #1 is set up to use the X-ray unit as the primary scanning.
Had I witnessed anything out of the ordinary I would have stopped the pat down and demanded a supervisor immediately.
As for telling them why I didn't want to walk through the X-ray unit I felt it is necessary to "educate" them that it is ionizing radiation. They are standing right next to the unit. Where is the lead shielding? By radiation protection standards there is a 6 foot minimum when x-rays are being produced. You see us x-ray techs behind a lead wall when we are taking your x-rays.
Maybe the TSA will start having high incidents of cancer or other radiation health issues and then someone will realize that this type of unnecessary exposure is not worth it.
I will never believe this is safe. As I was being patted down I watched many children being sent through the x-ray unit. That's just asinine.
The whole process probably took less than 8 minutes. They all changed their gloves. Even the TSA doing the pat down changed his gloves in front of me and informed me before he was going to do this and how he was going to touch my body during the pat down.
Not once was I left alone. Someone was around me the entire time.
It will be interesting how many times I will have to go through this at FLL Terminal 2. I have a flight every week until the end of August. I will use the other security lines to see if I get selected to stand in the X-ray unit since I observed that line #1 is set up to use the X-ray unit as the primary scanning.
Thanks for taking the time to relay your experience.
Jul 8, 2010 | 5:17 am
#21
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Why would TSA pat down bare feet? Foot fetish?
Jul 8, 2010 | 6:11 am
#22
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Yes they started at the shoulders and touched every area that was only covered by clothing. I was wearing a t-shirt and shorts and socks so I did have to sit down while he patted my feet.
Jul 8, 2010 | 6:30 am
#23
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 3,657
Other TSOs have answered this before. The short answer: force of habit.
The long answer: TSA critics, here and elsewhere, often complain that screening procedures are wildly inconsistent between airports --- or often, between screeners at the same airport. TSA does strive for some level of consistency. It teaches its screeners, when performing a patdown, to perform the same actions, in the same sequence, every time. Ideally, this should lead to a more consistent experience.
Of course, since many passengers choose to wear socks, or are unable to remove their footwear for medical reasons, the standard patdown includes a patdown or wand-scan of the foot area.
Now, here comes a passenger with bare feet (for example, one wearing sandals without socks). Clearly, a patdown or wand scan of the bare feet is not necessary per se. But between force of habit, and the training the TSO received to conduct every patdown the exact same way, it's entirely possible that the TSO will end up patting down or wanding the bare feet.
There is a bit of a contradiction at play here. Many TSA critics (including myself) want TSA to standardize screening procedures across checkpoints, so that everyone knows what to expect from screening every time. On the other hand, many of those same critics (again, including myself) want TSA to deviate from those procedures when it clearly makes sense to do so. It's a little hard to say "always follow the rules, except when we don't want you to."
The long answer: TSA critics, here and elsewhere, often complain that screening procedures are wildly inconsistent between airports --- or often, between screeners at the same airport. TSA does strive for some level of consistency. It teaches its screeners, when performing a patdown, to perform the same actions, in the same sequence, every time. Ideally, this should lead to a more consistent experience.
Of course, since many passengers choose to wear socks, or are unable to remove their footwear for medical reasons, the standard patdown includes a patdown or wand-scan of the foot area.
Now, here comes a passenger with bare feet (for example, one wearing sandals without socks). Clearly, a patdown or wand scan of the bare feet is not necessary per se. But between force of habit, and the training the TSO received to conduct every patdown the exact same way, it's entirely possible that the TSO will end up patting down or wanding the bare feet.
There is a bit of a contradiction at play here. Many TSA critics (including myself) want TSA to standardize screening procedures across checkpoints, so that everyone knows what to expect from screening every time. On the other hand, many of those same critics (again, including myself) want TSA to deviate from those procedures when it clearly makes sense to do so. It's a little hard to say "always follow the rules, except when we don't want you to."
Jul 8, 2010 | 6:31 am
#24
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Quote:
Here's the best way I've found to deal with pat-down searches. The trick is to leverage the TSA guy's own insecurities in order to wind them up as tightly as possible, thus paying them back for performing these unAmerican searches to begin with.
Before anything starts, request the groper to change his gloves. He will do so, albeit begrudgingly.
The pat down always begins with the groper's spiel about how and where he's going to touch you and making sure that's OK with you. This is your que to say, So long as there is nothing sexual involved, then ok.
You are saying this in the knowledge that the groper is most likely a heterosexual with a deep-seated, high school locker-room-like fear of being labeled 'queer'. He will visibly flinch at your saying this. One of two things will then happen. He will either involuntarily blurt-out, "I'm not gay"; or he will say nothing.
-If he says "I'm not gay" or something along those lines, this is your que to talk about how it doesn't matter to you, that certain types are attracted to certain jobs, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
-If he says nothing, talk about how much you love your wife/girlfriend and how you're 'just not that way', that you have lots of gay friends and you respect their lifestyle and they respect yours, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
I cannot stress how important it is to keep a straight face while you're saying all of this. You need to appear to be sincere. Otherwise it just won't be as effective.
Half the time the groper will get so angry that he'll call over his supervisor, something you tell him you wholeheartedly approve of to make sure there is no 'funny business' when he's touching you.
After all is said and done, you'll have seriously ruined a TSA groper's day and you'll feel less gross about being felt up in the name of security theater.
.............................
Hey FriendlySkies...........there is nothing humorous about this quote from another FTer.
First, they made a point of changing their gloves in front of me.
Second, as a CARD CARRYING HOMOSEXUAL and a damn GOOD one ...... to say that the TSA are secretly gay is disgusting. One might say the same thing about people in your chosen profession. And believe me, as a Radiologic Technologist I've seen more parts of the human body and things stuffed in the human body than any TSA will ever see.
Third, as much as I don't want a stranger touching me, I'd rather have them pat me down than stand in a unit that produces X-rays no matter how small the supposed exposure dosage is.
Believe me I am not thrilled our government can't find effective methods to detecting and stopping threats but I won't also let them expose me to radiation in the hopes of finding something. By pissing off one lone TSA agent in the hopes they will stop their pat down isn't where we should be taking our displeasure.
We need to STOP our government from thinking this type of scanning is going to catch the next underwear bomber. Since 9/11 we are not a proactive country but a reactive one. We don't think out of the box like the terrorists have. And until we start thinking out of the box we're doomed to always cause the citizens of this country to be harmed in the name of security.
Here's the best way I've found to deal with pat-down searches. The trick is to leverage the TSA guy's own insecurities in order to wind them up as tightly as possible, thus paying them back for performing these unAmerican searches to begin with.
Before anything starts, request the groper to change his gloves. He will do so, albeit begrudgingly.
The pat down always begins with the groper's spiel about how and where he's going to touch you and making sure that's OK with you. This is your que to say, So long as there is nothing sexual involved, then ok.
You are saying this in the knowledge that the groper is most likely a heterosexual with a deep-seated, high school locker-room-like fear of being labeled 'queer'. He will visibly flinch at your saying this. One of two things will then happen. He will either involuntarily blurt-out, "I'm not gay"; or he will say nothing.
-If he says "I'm not gay" or something along those lines, this is your que to talk about how it doesn't matter to you, that certain types are attracted to certain jobs, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
-If he says nothing, talk about how much you love your wife/girlfriend and how you're 'just not that way', that you have lots of gay friends and you respect their lifestyle and they respect yours, and how it is common knowledge that most TSA screeners are gay, and how you don't care at all because we're all the same no matter who we fall in love with.
I cannot stress how important it is to keep a straight face while you're saying all of this. You need to appear to be sincere. Otherwise it just won't be as effective.
Half the time the groper will get so angry that he'll call over his supervisor, something you tell him you wholeheartedly approve of to make sure there is no 'funny business' when he's touching you.
After all is said and done, you'll have seriously ruined a TSA groper's day and you'll feel less gross about being felt up in the name of security theater.
.............................
Hey FriendlySkies...........there is nothing humorous about this quote from another FTer.
First, they made a point of changing their gloves in front of me.
Second, as a CARD CARRYING HOMOSEXUAL and a damn GOOD one ...... to say that the TSA are secretly gay is disgusting. One might say the same thing about people in your chosen profession. And believe me, as a Radiologic Technologist I've seen more parts of the human body and things stuffed in the human body than any TSA will ever see.
Third, as much as I don't want a stranger touching me, I'd rather have them pat me down than stand in a unit that produces X-rays no matter how small the supposed exposure dosage is.
Believe me I am not thrilled our government can't find effective methods to detecting and stopping threats but I won't also let them expose me to radiation in the hopes of finding something. By pissing off one lone TSA agent in the hopes they will stop their pat down isn't where we should be taking our displeasure.
We need to STOP our government from thinking this type of scanning is going to catch the next underwear bomber. Since 9/11 we are not a proactive country but a reactive one. We don't think out of the box like the terrorists have. And until we start thinking out of the box we're doomed to always cause the citizens of this country to be harmed in the name of security.
Jul 8, 2010 | 6:34 am
#25
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I guess by retaliation I should have stated they didn't do each "search" one at a time. As I was being patted down by one agent 2 others where going through my luggage, computer bag and swabbing at the same time.
So they didn't slow me down.
I'm prepared in case they ever do slow me down on purpose. But I always arrive early to the airport because FLL can be a nightmare with the cruise ships disembarking and general uneducated traveler that loves to come to Florida.
So they didn't slow me down.
I'm prepared in case they ever do slow me down on purpose. But I always arrive early to the airport because FLL can be a nightmare with the cruise ships disembarking and general uneducated traveler that loves to come to Florida.
Second, there's too much chance for theft or slipping something into your bag if you're not right there watching them.
Jul 8, 2010 | 6:49 am
#26
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I would lock my carry on so no one can go through it without me being right there to observe it. I would then tell them I'll be more than happy to unlock it for you to inspect while I am observing them, I'll be right over after I'm done being groped. Seriously, I have my cash, credit cards and expensive camera equipment and you think I'm NOT going to lock it to keep their grubby fingers off of it?
Jul 8, 2010 | 8:08 am
#27
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Jul 8, 2010 | 8:26 am
#28
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Can one of our resident TSOs please explain the reason to me why nude-o-scope decliners apparently have to have their bags searched by hand? Other than the obvious apparent answer of retaliation to discourage declining the nude-o-scope.
Declining the nude-o-scope has absolutely nothing to do with the chance there is WEI in your bag, unless TSA is profiling based on nude-o-scope refusal, which would be an interesting thing to admit.
Oh, and SSI isn't a valid answer either.
Declining the nude-o-scope has absolutely nothing to do with the chance there is WEI in your bag, unless TSA is profiling based on nude-o-scope refusal, which would be an interesting thing to admit.
Oh, and SSI isn't a valid answer either.
/crickets
Jul 8, 2010 | 8:33 am
#29
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.
Now, here comes a passenger with bare feet (for example, one wearing sandals without socks). Clearly, a patdown or wand scan of the bare feet is not necessary per se. But between force of habit, and the training the TSO received to conduct every patdown the exact same way, it's entirely possible that the TSO will end up patting down or wanding the bare feet.
Now, here comes a passenger with bare feet (for example, one wearing sandals without socks). Clearly, a patdown or wand scan of the bare feet is not necessary per se. But between force of habit, and the training the TSO received to conduct every patdown the exact same way, it's entirely possible that the TSO will end up patting down or wanding the bare feet.
Jul 8, 2010 | 7:15 pm
#30
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 381
His feet were not bare. See post#22. Why would you put your foot in your mouth? Don't choke.
An excellent idea and doable. While it may delay those pax behind you, I doubt anyone can fault your reasoning for doing so.
"I would lock my carry on so no one can go through it without me being right there to observe it. I would then tell them I'll be more than happy to unlock it for you to inspect while I am observing them, I'll be right over after I'm done being groped. Seriously, I have my cash, credit cards and expensive camera equipment and you think I'm NOT going to lock it to keep their grubby fingers off of it?"
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Jul 9, 2010 at 4:10 pm Reason: merge consective posts