Vaze,

I will assume that in saying you're playing devil's advocate, that your actual believe is one of greater reason and sensibility.

That is good news.

By the way, I believe when you say "discrimination" you really mean "prejudice"--that is judging someone on a criterion that is not reasonably connected to the decision to be made.

We discrimate and exclude every day and we must--just think of the hiring process. 100 people apply for 1 position, and you peel away the 99 until you get to the 1 very best qualified person.

I don't want to get sidetracked but discrimination is acting prejudicially is it not?

In any event, if you can tell me in what way it's okay to exclude a group of people from an event based on how old they are or their skin color and for no other "important" reasonI'll be happy to switch to your way of thinking (yes, I know the obvious one is going to a bar but you know what I mean, hopefully you are truly going to defend the position you have taken)

I think this thread is very curious.

My two very best shopping/travel/play make-up and dress-up girlfriends are under 30--actually less than half my age and we truly love being together and have an absolutely fabulous time when we go out. Some of you have met them, the amazing and beautiful Christina who attended the Catman Do III and Amanda of the bright red hair and spirit to match who attended a FT dinner party in the Castro a couple of years back.

Many of my very favorite long-term employee/friends (some of them whom I have know for ten years or more and are still half my age) are dear friends with whom I get along fabulously both in business endeavors and socially.

I also have two wonderful children who are both under 30 (less than half my age) and we have a wonderful time together, whether we are sailing, exploring, traveling, dancing, just hanging out, or whatever. My daughter is an alternative musician ( www.krecs.com ) and she always invites us to strange, weird concerts where we are almost always several decades older than the average attendee and then she is absolutely thrilled when we attend and even more thrilled if we bring along other "elderly" friends.

Shoot some of my very favorite Flyer Talk friends are less than half my age and we get along just fine. I love you Chex!

I can even recall a couple of FT adventures where several participants half my age were huffing and puffing climbing up stair sets that were a piece of cake for me and I can guarantee you that I can dance anybody on FT under the table, no matter what their age.

I wonder if maybe this isolationist business isn't just the result of some unfortunate young folks who really don't have very fun or exciting parents/grandparents or older adults in their lives. That makes me sad.

Age is one of the least important factors to consider when making friends. For me it is all about brains, integrity, energy and attitude. Those qualities turn me on (always have turned me on) whether I find them in 5 year olds or 90 year olds. Exciting people of any age always enrich my life.

All I know is that today I was able to get valet parking at LAX for under $10 a day plus one day free, and I'm sending this from the AC at LAX and would not have known about either of these unless other FT's had not posted the info on the boards - do you really think it matters to me if the
person(s) pointing this out were under 30, gay, blue or any of the other catagories Efrem mentioned? exluding people tends to exlude information. By the way, First in classyou can't be serious with your hiring analogy, are you?

Punki,

You ask a good question. Clearly, if the intent of the organizers was to exclude those who were advanced in their years, you may be spot on.

I don't know personally anyone on the board, but based on the tone, I would suggest that it appears that there is a desire to have this younger community event based on some perceived common interests.

I liken it to going to an AARP meeting--sure I am excluded but I appreciate that our senior citizen have some common interests and concerns, and I encourage them to go play together and discuss.

If they wanted to exclude me from all or most gatherings, I'd feel left out, but here we're just talking about the occassional get-together not a rule that says once you attend a Young FlyerTalkers meeting you can not attend or host the other 99% of all-ages gathering.

Everything in moderation.

First in Class, I have no idea on earth what you were trying to say in your last post.

Activity-based get togethers are just fine. If folks self-select to attend or not to attend, for instance, a heavy metal concert, so be it. It is inappropriate, IMHO, however, to place an arbitrary age limit (high or low) on any Flyer Talk activity, except where required by law--those under 21 can't enter bars, etc.

Why on earth would anybody want to miss out on the opportunity to meet anyone else (of any age) who shares a common interest? My life would be less rich if I only wanted events that were attended by folks over 30 because youngsters are shallow, silly and empty headed. Think of all the amazing Flyer Talkers I would have missed--including the astounding TWIZ who at 10 was much more mature than most of us.

Punki,

Thanks for your patience. I will try to be clearer.

I am saying:

(1) Get togethers focused on Young Flyertalkers can co-exist with plans for get togethers of all Flyertakers. Therefore, the dilemma you describe of young and old not mixing is not in any true sense a dilemma. Just look at the FlyerTalk Community events--I don't think those are going away.

(2) Some activities are, inherently, age-associated. College fares, meeting other single people of vaguely similar age, etc.

I hope you find these words clearer.

On a separate thought: I do find it confusing to hear you (and many others) say the following ideas simultaneously:
(1) Base events on activities. If you want young people to come, focus on youth-oriented activities rather than age limit.
(2) Don't restrict based on age because you will lose the rich diversity of background that is so much enjoyed at FlyerTalk.

These points are reasonable, but risk never being able to be simultaneously satisfied. If you focus on #1, you get an event focused on younger peoples' activities (whatever they are) and you miss point #2. If you focus on point #2, by focusing on a broad audience you inherenly can't apply rule #1.

Punki, can you suggest an example of a meeting that would achieve both of your suggestions of focusing on the activity if we want a young-focused get-together, but not losing the diversity of people of all ages? I appreciate any thoughts you have on this.

[This message has been edited by First in Class (edited 05-22-2003).]

I just went to FT Community and am heartened to see that all gatherings are open to anyone who happens to be at the locales at the specific dates. This is how a real, professional travelling community should be. I'm actually really heartened to see doc posting! Anyhoo, openness must continue because once you begin discriminating by something which appears harmless like by age, there is no turning back. One can't be a little bit pregnant. Have a great weekend, everybody.

Analise, dear, haven't I taught you anything?!

Please listen to what you are saying: you are comparing pregnancy to discrimination when they are not analagous.


If you analogy of all-or-nothing discrimination were correct, then you would be saying:

-if you do get a group together based on age (i.e. "YES" to age-based preference) then you must also be in favor or racism and all other discrimination (ethnic origin, religion, etc).

Fortunately, your all-or-nothing pregnancy analogy does not hold true.

Amen.

Have a great Memorial Day weekend!

I am in my 20's but I don't think this kind of gathering is a good idea nor is the intention of the original poster very appealing either.

No thank you.