oneworld xONEx online booking tool [merged threads]
Sep 5, 2008, 11:34 am
#31
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Well that's not how it should be, but all the issues around country of purchase were a key question raised when oneworld4u announced the service here. Others included choice of airline ticket stock, availability of seats by POS, ability to book open segments, and some others.
It's been very quiet since we raised these questions...
It's been very quiet since we raised these questions...
Sep 5, 2008, 1:39 pm
#32
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me too I can't wait to see the booking tool as I would be using it to book a LONE4 starting in January.
like this I have been following everything oneworld said about it and in this message they said:
this was on august 12th so I guess we might not be too far away from the release but still, "the coming weeks" is pretty unprecise.at least it appears to be a shorter span of time than "the next few months" as they announced it on june 2nd.
like this I have been following everything oneworld said about it and in this message they said:
this was on august 12th so I guess we might not be too far away from the release but still, "the coming weeks" is pretty unprecise.at least it appears to be a shorter span of time than "the next few months" as they announced it on june 2nd.
Sep 5, 2008, 2:32 pm
#33
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New York
Programs: Starwood, SQ PPS, BA EXEC
Posts: 136
Agreed with Kiwi Flyer...If you need to handle a trip, don't wait for the on-line booking tool as the prices could further increase
As for the pricing, there is NO reason why this system should allow a traveler in North America to pay the Asian based priced (i.e. BKK fare vs U.S.) if they don't have a BKK billing address. If you call AA RTW desk , they will be more than happy to construct an RTW starting in any country you want but will have the fare raised to the price where the reservation is made
As airlines are looking anyway they can to increase margins and shave off costs, this on-line booking tool , I believe is being developed to increase productivity and the scalability of their RTW products without rellying on humans or agents. From a business perspective, it makes no sense for them to all of the sudden open the flood gates to allow Euro/USD based passengers an on-line tool to cut their margins and pay lower fares.
In summary, the tool will allow you to book on-line but the underlying fare rules will remain which is
WHEN TRAVEL ORIGINATES IN A COUNTRY FOR WHICH A
SPECIFIED LOCAL CURRENCY FARE IS PUBLISHED AND
THE TICKET IS SOLD IN ANOTHER COUNTRY THE FARE
WILL BE THAT PUBLISHED FOR THE COUNTRY OF ORIGIN
CONVERTED TO THE CURRENCY OF THE COUNTRY OF SALE
AT THE BANK SELLING RATE. THE RESULTANT FARE
MUST NOT BE LOWER THAN THAT FROM THE COUNTRY OF
SALE.
As for the pricing, there is NO reason why this system should allow a traveler in North America to pay the Asian based priced (i.e. BKK fare vs U.S.) if they don't have a BKK billing address. If you call AA RTW desk , they will be more than happy to construct an RTW starting in any country you want but will have the fare raised to the price where the reservation is made
As airlines are looking anyway they can to increase margins and shave off costs, this on-line booking tool , I believe is being developed to increase productivity and the scalability of their RTW products without rellying on humans or agents. From a business perspective, it makes no sense for them to all of the sudden open the flood gates to allow Euro/USD based passengers an on-line tool to cut their margins and pay lower fares.
In summary, the tool will allow you to book on-line but the underlying fare rules will remain which is
WHEN TRAVEL ORIGINATES IN A COUNTRY FOR WHICH A
SPECIFIED LOCAL CURRENCY FARE IS PUBLISHED AND
THE TICKET IS SOLD IN ANOTHER COUNTRY THE FARE
WILL BE THAT PUBLISHED FOR THE COUNTRY OF ORIGIN
CONVERTED TO THE CURRENCY OF THE COUNTRY OF SALE
AT THE BANK SELLING RATE. THE RESULTANT FARE
MUST NOT BE LOWER THAN THAT FROM THE COUNTRY OF
SALE.
Sep 5, 2008, 3:21 pm
#34
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As for the pricing, there is NO reason why this system should allow a traveler in North America to pay the Asian based priced (i.e. BKK fare vs U.S.) if they don't have a BKK billing address. If you call AA RTW desk , they will be more than happy to construct an RTW starting in any country you want but will have the fare raised to the price where the reservation is made
Sep 5, 2008, 3:26 pm
#35
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New York
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Chritiep
Yes, I get it that everyone here pays the fare based on where travel originates. For example, if you call AA RTW in Dallas today and ask them to book an RTW originated in BKK they will do it but they will charge you the USD fare because the booking is being made in the U.S. To get the BKK fare, you have to get the ticket issued in Bangkok (at least with One World)
I expect the on-line tool will be the same, where the price you pay is based on the currency and billing country of your credit card...Using a U.S. card? then you will pay the U.S. fare...Using a Euro card? Pay the Euro fare...The billing country of your credit card will likely determine the point of sale in the virtual world
Yes, I get it that everyone here pays the fare based on where travel originates. For example, if you call AA RTW in Dallas today and ask them to book an RTW originated in BKK they will do it but they will charge you the USD fare because the booking is being made in the U.S. To get the BKK fare, you have to get the ticket issued in Bangkok (at least with One World)
I expect the on-line tool will be the same, where the price you pay is based on the currency and billing country of your credit card...Using a U.S. card? then you will pay the U.S. fare...Using a Euro card? Pay the Euro fare...The billing country of your credit card will likely determine the point of sale in the virtual world
Sep 5, 2008, 3:29 pm
#36
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No it's NOT. The fare is absolutely nothing to do with the billing country of your credit card.
You have completely misunderstood.
The fare is based on the point of purchase. This is completely independent of the billing country of your credit card.
I recently bought two AONE3s ex-Manila. The booking was set up entirely through the AA RTW desk in the US. My credit card has a billing address in Hong Kong. I bought the tickets from AA's GSA in Manila. The price I paid was the ex-Manila price (which happens to be in USD rather than Pesos because that's how OW chooses to define fare in the Philippines, but it was FAR less than the USD price ex-USA).
You have completely misunderstood.
The fare is based on the point of purchase. This is completely independent of the billing country of your credit card.
I recently bought two AONE3s ex-Manila. The booking was set up entirely through the AA RTW desk in the US. My credit card has a billing address in Hong Kong. I bought the tickets from AA's GSA in Manila. The price I paid was the ex-Manila price (which happens to be in USD rather than Pesos because that's how OW chooses to define fare in the Philippines, but it was FAR less than the USD price ex-USA).
Sep 5, 2008, 3:57 pm
#37
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: New York
Programs: Starwood, SQ PPS, BA EXEC
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Chritiep
Believe me ,,I do get it, but you just illustrated the point....Do get the MNL fare you had to go to a local GSA in Manila to have the ticket issued...Either you did it in person or you gave them your credit card number via phone, fax, e-mail....Again, to get the fare it required issuance in that country
In the on-line world, it is difficult to determine where the customer actually is. Again, we have not seen this program but I would be surprised if One World builds a system that once the reservation is complete, it tells the booker to contact the local office in the country of origin to complete the purchase. This would defeat the efficiencies they are trying to create, and the name of the on-line booking game is to close the purchase on-line....
That being said, I would not expect OneWorld to suddenly lift the requirement of having a pricing an Around the World based on where travel originates and the sale is made. My point is to complete the sale on-line, they will use the billing country to identify which fare is to be charged
But lets wait and see
Believe me ,,I do get it, but you just illustrated the point....Do get the MNL fare you had to go to a local GSA in Manila to have the ticket issued...Either you did it in person or you gave them your credit card number via phone, fax, e-mail....Again, to get the fare it required issuance in that country
In the on-line world, it is difficult to determine where the customer actually is. Again, we have not seen this program but I would be surprised if One World builds a system that once the reservation is complete, it tells the booker to contact the local office in the country of origin to complete the purchase. This would defeat the efficiencies they are trying to create, and the name of the on-line booking game is to close the purchase on-line....
That being said, I would not expect OneWorld to suddenly lift the requirement of having a pricing an Around the World based on where travel originates and the sale is made. My point is to complete the sale on-line, they will use the billing country to identify which fare is to be charged
But lets wait and see
Sep 5, 2008, 4:12 pm
#38
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OK - so that was exactly the point we made when oneworld4u mentioned this site a while ago. If they do that then obviously no-one with any sense will use it, so it will be a complete waste of time. Basing the price on the purchaser's credit card billing address is completely arbitrary (and different from anything that happens now) and would just be bizarre.
Sep 5, 2008, 4:22 pm
#39
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Star Alliance changed its rules in April and you now pay the fare of the point of departure, regardless of where you buy the ticket.
So I can now buy an ex-Vietnam Star RTW in the U.S. at the Vietnam price.
I suspect Oneworld will either do that, or since it is an e-ticket, will consider the ticket "issued" in the country of departure. I don't see a realistic scenario where Oneworld will look to where someone's credit card is issued from.
So I can now buy an ex-Vietnam Star RTW in the U.S. at the Vietnam price.
I suspect Oneworld will either do that, or since it is an e-ticket, will consider the ticket "issued" in the country of departure. I don't see a realistic scenario where Oneworld will look to where someone's credit card is issued from.
Sep 5, 2008, 7:10 pm
#40
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Always Flyin- You are correct about Star Alliance eliminating the Sale Indicator rule. However, Star Alliance also eliminated the advance purchase requirement well over a year ago and One World did not follow. As far as I know, One World has a 7 day advance purchase from North America, Asia, and Australia and has not matched Star with this requirement.
If One World didn't drop the advance purchase rule, why would they drop the sales location requirement?
Christep- I believe that the knowledge that FT'ers possess is the minority, not the majority of international travelers. I also believe that the carriers goal of on-line RTW booking is not to make it easier to book cheaper fares, but to bypass the whole localized GSA concept and take more control of this exotic ticket type.
I would love to know the % of RTW tickets sold by country of origin, but I would suspect that the lower priced countries is a very small % of the total. That being said, the majority of travelers may not know the difference in pricing
Of the One World carriers, BA, QF and CX tend to pay the most attention to whose is buying premium tickets and from where , with AA, LA and the others less concerned.
Again, we will see but this tool will likely be great to plan and book but I would not except an airline alliance to unroll 'Point, click and pick your country of origin for the lowest price' technology
If One World didn't drop the advance purchase rule, why would they drop the sales location requirement?
Christep- I believe that the knowledge that FT'ers possess is the minority, not the majority of international travelers. I also believe that the carriers goal of on-line RTW booking is not to make it easier to book cheaper fares, but to bypass the whole localized GSA concept and take more control of this exotic ticket type.
I would love to know the % of RTW tickets sold by country of origin, but I would suspect that the lower priced countries is a very small % of the total. That being said, the majority of travelers may not know the difference in pricing
Of the One World carriers, BA, QF and CX tend to pay the most attention to whose is buying premium tickets and from where , with AA, LA and the others less concerned.
Again, we will see but this tool will likely be great to plan and book but I would not except an airline alliance to unroll 'Point, click and pick your country of origin for the lowest price' technology
Sep 5, 2008, 8:34 pm
#41
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Always Flyin- You are correct about Star Alliance eliminating the Sale Indicator rule. However, Star Alliance also eliminated the advance purchase requirement well over a year ago and One World did not follow. As far as I know, One World has a 7 day advance purchase from North America, Asia, and Australia and has not matched Star with this requirement.
If One World didn't drop the advance purchase rule, why would they drop the sales location requirement?
Christep- I believe that the knowledge that FT'ers possess is the minority, not the majority of international travelers. I also believe that the carriers goal of on-line RTW booking is not to make it easier to book cheaper fares, but to bypass the whole localized GSA concept and take more control of this exotic ticket type.
I would love to know the % of RTW tickets sold by country of origin, but I would suspect that the lower priced countries is a very small % of the total. That being said, the majority of travelers may not know the difference in pricing
Of the One World carriers, BA, QF and CX tend to pay the most attention to whose is buying premium tickets and from where , with AA, LA and the others less concerned.
Again, we will see but this tool will likely be great to plan and book but I would not except an airline alliance to unroll 'Point, click and pick your country of origin for the lowest price' technology
If One World didn't drop the advance purchase rule, why would they drop the sales location requirement?
Christep- I believe that the knowledge that FT'ers possess is the minority, not the majority of international travelers. I also believe that the carriers goal of on-line RTW booking is not to make it easier to book cheaper fares, but to bypass the whole localized GSA concept and take more control of this exotic ticket type.
I would love to know the % of RTW tickets sold by country of origin, but I would suspect that the lower priced countries is a very small % of the total. That being said, the majority of travelers may not know the difference in pricing
Of the One World carriers, BA, QF and CX tend to pay the most attention to whose is buying premium tickets and from where , with AA, LA and the others less concerned.
Again, we will see but this tool will likely be great to plan and book but I would not except an airline alliance to unroll 'Point, click and pick your country of origin for the lowest price' technology
5. RESERVATIONS AND TICKETING
Unless otherwise specified
(a) Reservations and Ticketing
For travel originating in TC1
Reservations for the first international flight and all preceeding flights are required at least 7 days prior to
departure of the first flight. Subsequent segments may be open-dated. Tickets must be issued at least 7
days in advance of the first flight.
Exception:
For economy class reservations made 22 or more days before departure, tickets must be issued at
least 21 days before departure.
For travel originating in TC2/3
Reservations for the first international flight and all preceeding flights must be made prior to departure.
Subsequent segments may be open-dated. Tickets may be issued up to one hour prior to departure.
Exception:
For economy class reservations made 22 or more days before departure ticketing must be
completed at least 21 days before departure.
For economy class reservations made 21 to 8 days before departure ticketing must be completed
at least 7 days before departure.
For economy class reservations made 7 days or less before departure ticketing must be completed
prior to departure.
Unless otherwise specified
(a) Reservations and Ticketing
For travel originating in TC1
Reservations for the first international flight and all preceeding flights are required at least 7 days prior to
departure of the first flight. Subsequent segments may be open-dated. Tickets must be issued at least 7
days in advance of the first flight.
Exception:
For economy class reservations made 22 or more days before departure, tickets must be issued at
least 21 days before departure.
For travel originating in TC2/3
Reservations for the first international flight and all preceeding flights must be made prior to departure.
Subsequent segments may be open-dated. Tickets may be issued up to one hour prior to departure.
Exception:
For economy class reservations made 22 or more days before departure ticketing must be
completed at least 21 days before departure.
For economy class reservations made 21 to 8 days before departure ticketing must be completed
at least 7 days before departure.
For economy class reservations made 7 days or less before departure ticketing must be completed
prior to departure.
Sep 6, 2008, 4:27 am
#42
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: DUS
Posts: 318
Sorry,but am I too tired and blind right now to see the problem or isn't there any?
Say you create an iternerary AONE3 starting in BKK, then going to LAX making your way all through the US, from JFK you fly to Europe,have a nice time there and then fly back to BKK. You create and book this with the new online booking tool and as you are starting in BKK, you pay the Thailand price, don't you?
So when you live in the US and want to pay the Thailand price then there is no way that you get the Thailand price unless you also start the trip in thailand.Also, if you want to get the Thailand price then you have to purchase a seperate ticket bringing you there to start in BKK which means extra cost anyway.What I am saying is: oneworld might give everyone the AONE3 for the price of the country where it starts.So if you want a cheaper fare from another country,you have to start there like anyone else that is acutally living there AND "pay for the right" of the cheaper fare by having extra cost to get there.Not many people consider going to another country and starting their trip there but they just start from their home airport and pay their home price so why would oneworld afford to check anyone's home or even credit card billing adress?
To me, the easiest and also most logical way is to say: Pay the price for the country you start in.If you live there,that's fine, if not then it is your problem having to get there on a seperate ticket.For most home country and cheaper trip origin price differences it is not even worth the seperate ticket...
Say you create an iternerary AONE3 starting in BKK, then going to LAX making your way all through the US, from JFK you fly to Europe,have a nice time there and then fly back to BKK. You create and book this with the new online booking tool and as you are starting in BKK, you pay the Thailand price, don't you?
So when you live in the US and want to pay the Thailand price then there is no way that you get the Thailand price unless you also start the trip in thailand.Also, if you want to get the Thailand price then you have to purchase a seperate ticket bringing you there to start in BKK which means extra cost anyway.What I am saying is: oneworld might give everyone the AONE3 for the price of the country where it starts.So if you want a cheaper fare from another country,you have to start there like anyone else that is acutally living there AND "pay for the right" of the cheaper fare by having extra cost to get there.Not many people consider going to another country and starting their trip there but they just start from their home airport and pay their home price so why would oneworld afford to check anyone's home or even credit card billing adress?
To me, the easiest and also most logical way is to say: Pay the price for the country you start in.If you live there,that's fine, if not then it is your problem having to get there on a seperate ticket.For most home country and cheaper trip origin price differences it is not even worth the seperate ticket...
Sep 6, 2008, 6:07 am
#43
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The problem is that as the rules are currently defined you would pay whichever is higher of the Thailand price OR the price where the purchase is deemed to take place. What is not clear is where the purchase takes place on a website.
Sep 6, 2008, 9:15 am
#44
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svellmann, lots of people do that all the time. Remember, you only have to pay to get to the starting point (called a positioning flight) the first time. Thereafter, your xONEx typically ends at the starting point, so you're there to start the next xONEx.
Sep 6, 2008, 10:33 am
#45
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: DUS
Posts: 318
Still, this might be a nice way for TAs to make more money 