I will be flying BKK-NRT-SFO and was trying to upgrade via KL. BKK-NRT portion was available but not NRT-SFO. Because the ticket only registered a plane change (same flight no) they could not book the upgrade and KL advised me to switch routing which I did. Explained this to NW who said my fare is not upgradeable (consolidated H class) I said not to worry, KL has different rules. The agent said she would manually note that my ticket may not be upgraded as there are restricted rules. I asked if there are rules on this why would there be a need for manual entry? The agent did not answer this, only specify that she was adding "passenger may not upgrade". I called KL who confirmed availability and processed the upgrade despite the NW remark. Mark my surprise when I later checked my reservation online it still showed Y class. I called KL to ask what happened when they checked they said NW cancelled my upgrade due to "hostile passenger action at NW" I could not believe this neither could KL who managed to get it processed again. I suspect the same agent I talked to later found the reservation and cancelled it herself. I cannot the way some agents are so purposefully mean; perhaps they are bitter that other programs have different rules and try to override them or maybe they are just plain mean.

This is a tough one; but, I will steer clear of opinion and make a simple statement. It applies in life in general.

If someone does not give you the answer that you like - just call again and ask again.

When you felt the resistence at the earliest stage you should have politely excused yourself, thanked and "Have a Good Day" then called again later.

The agent is correct and it is spelled out very clear in a NWA reservation. Below your flight itinerary just around your phone information and on the first page - NO UPGRADES - very pronounced on all consolidator and non-upgradeable international fares. What she may or may have not done is all subjective.

Not excusing any attitude questions - just say "Thank You" and call back again in the future if the issue is of such importance or better - develop a rapport with an Elite representative.

Wow - not good Customer Service.

I would write a letter - nicely to NW and KL explaing the situation and get a clear answer - you might mention the agents name if you were truely offended.

Is it possible to ask for one specific Elite agent - I have be PE/GE for over 4 yrs and never tried, but it sounds like a good idea.

I am confused here.

Can a passenger with KL FF number upgrade on NW flight under consolidator's fare?

If that is true, then it is not fair to WordPerks members!

If that is not true, then the NW agent acted correctly.

Actually it is true - sort of. FD members have a much broader range of fares in which they can upgrade from. An "H" fare in this case is not truely a consolidator's fare it is the same as NW "H" fare. I have thought of switching for this reason alone.

I agree not fare to WP members - but we could always switch, but loose our domestic upgrade status -- oh the trade-offs...

The Flying Dutchman program is not available to persons residing within the USA (although many persons use various loop holes to get around this).

In the past NW has insisted that when a flight�s not operated in conjunction with a partner, its rules preside � in other words, even though you�re a Flying Dutchman elite, you can�t upgrade your ticket.

Elena - I meant to ask - what ended up happening? Did you get upgraded in the end?

Mark

TNB (Tokyo Notice Board) just had an article talking about how mean the flight attendants are at NW. With the pro-abuse stance, people are starting to notice and talk about it like in that article.

A flight attendant actually said ' if there is a crash, none of YOU 3 will leave this craft until all injured bodies are OFF!!'

Gloria had a bee in her bonnet about 3 physically fit elites sitting in exit row, treating us like squatters in first class, and she was definately trying to pick fights.

Actually I believe (though I'm too lazy to go and check - so I may yet stand corrected) that FD PE flyers get EUA upgrades on both CO and NW, and auto upgrades on intra-Europe flights (no big whoop that one). It is the reason why many consider the program to be among the best in the world.

I love Schiphol, but I won't switch now, since it would mean domestic Y for the better part of 6 months.

Edited to add: of course with the AF merger (can anyone believe that the Frogeaters are actually taking over something???) the FD program might see signficant changes. From everything that I've read, AF agents would rather eat Mickey D's for a week than surrender an upgrade. Ironic isn't it?


(Tongue firmly in cheek. Viva la France!)

[This message has been edited by notsosmart (edited 10-31-2003).]

I believe you are right about the upgrades - I have heard that too.

From what I understand you can "switch" your program and retain your status - you just have to have an "address" in Europe.

FD PE's do indeed get EUA upgrades on CO and NW... BUT... it is often a complete pain trying to get a FD FF number into the right place in the reservation and automatic upgrades frequently fall by the wayside. FD GE and SE don't quality but sometimes luck out.

Nobody gets automatic upgrades on intra-Europe flights BTW - it's a uniquely U.S. perk.

-- Dambus

FD Silver/Gold members DO get domestic NW upgrades same as WP- that has always worked for me in the past and the status is printed automatically on the boarding pass. NW says there is no favoritism whether WP/FD in term of upgrades. Yes I know the brochure says PE elites but I have noticed it working for everyone. KL PE can also domestically upgrade on CO but it is more difficult. I strongly recommend switching to a European adress if you can- also for the free WC use+ benefits discussed in previous threads.

Yes, I did get my upgrade although after a long fight with BKK NW agent- she saw I was confirmed in C class along with the NW note. If they have some kind of rule they should not have approved the upgrade in the first place.

KL FD can upgrade any fare regardless and PE within 48 hours. My point is NW has it's rules which apply to WP- some of their award seats are given to other airlines(KL/CO)and how they in turn choose to issue those seats should not concern NW once given;each airline follows it's own reward program. The other airlines must manually request the seats from NW anyway and once granted they should not change your minds.

The main point I am upset with NW is not the rules they apply to their fares but that once they release seats to other airline program partners they should not interfere and if they must then don't release the seat. And the fact that if the rule is no upgrade and it is in the ticket rules there is no need to write extra manual messages. If the rule exists- no need to enter this type of messages.

Also I recommend if you find a good Elite agent- ask for the same one every time you call if possible. I always call the same agent at KL; this way I can avoid the bad ones and believe me there are quite a few.



------------------
KLM PE,HHonors Diamond,SPG Plat,PC Plat,SAS Silver

No, they don't - just Platinum. The EUA upgrades Silver/Gold, as do SOME agents... but that doesn't mean they "DO" get them, as that could change anytime - especially now that it's been plastered all over FT .

Elena,

I have a Euro address, and a FD account - I could make the change anytime. I just need to get the logistics straight. I have a few questions I'd like to ask you "outside" a public forum. Can I email you - or just email me and I will respond.

Thanks for the consideration.

Mark

IP is correct. I don;t know what the rules were in the past. Current FD rules clearly state that upgrades are exclusively for Platinum Elites.

Platinum Elite First Class upgrade


Reserved exclusively for our Platinum Elite members, Platinum Elite First Class upgrade automatically entitles you to First Class travel with Northwest Airlines and Continental Airlines. This service is available on most Northwest and Continental-operated domestic flights, whenever you travel alone or with other Platinum Elite members.
When traveling on a full-fare Economy Class ticket, your upgrade will be automatically reserved at the time of booking. For those traveling on a discounted Economy Class ticket, the Northwest Airlines and Continental Airlines reservations system will attempt to book your upgrade starting five days prior to departure.

I have only been denied an upgrade three tiems in the last 4 years, the last incident being three years ago. So it's not really an issue with me. I am sure many oothers who have lost an opportunity to upgrade because of misapplication of rules might not be too happy. Now that you have blatantly blurted this out, WP is bound to take notice and take corrective action. Enjoy your upgrades while they last.