flyrights

A recent British Airways flight from London to Berlin was canceled, due to an "airport operations" problem. I was traveling on an Advantage award, and had an "OK" confirmed ticket in economy. There were only about ten seats available for people to get on the NEXT flight, which was the last of the evening. I felt British Airways should have put people on that last flight of the evening, giving the order of PRIORITY to the order that people checked in for the flight. Instead, British Airways gave priority to the First Class passengers. I was outraged. Wasn't my "OK" confirmation in economy just as confirmed as a First Class passenger's confirmed seat? The only FAIR way to determine priority should be order of check in. It should NOT be allocated based on class, fare paid, sob story, etc. I supposed I would give some priority to people traveling with small children, but there were none traveling. British Airways wouldn't provide a hotel room for the night, nor any meals. I believe First Class passengers are entitled to more space, better food, more luggage allowance, but they are NOT there to push economy traveler's aside who ALSO hold "OK" confirmed seats.
Jim

sbrower

I would disagree with your analysis. IMO First Class comes with rights other than those you list, including the right to be treated better in case of unusual circumstances.

Further, no matter how upset you are (and you certainly have the right to be upset about not getting to your destination on time, no matter whether BA was right or wrong in the priority system it used) that doesn't mean that you should use a misleading title on a subject posted here. In fact, your post doesn't have anything to do with whether you had an "OK" on your reservation (so did everyone else in Coach and First Class). Rather, you are talking about priority based on check-in.

[This message has been edited by sbrower (edited 07-07-2002).]

[This message has been edited by sbrower (edited 07-07-2002).]

Plato90s

If you believe that British Airways [or any other major carrier] should accomodate a passenger on an award economy ticket from a partner airline instead of a revenue First Class passenger, then I'm afraid you'll be disappointed in many other instances.

When you get down to it, an airline will involuntarily bump or deny boarding to an economy-class passenger if a revenue First passenger wanted the seat.

Djlawman

Sorry flyrights, I have to disagree with you, too. If they can only make 10 people happy, when all of you have confirmed reservations, and you can't all get on that plane, I think the smart airline is going to keep the first class passengers happy. They face the risk of losing business from whoever is unhappy, but the risk they face from you (flying on a FF award from a partner airline in economy) is probably lowest, followed by general economy passengers, followed by the perceived highest risk of losing future business from not giving those seats to the First Class passengers. Curious, were you ever given an explanation of that the "airport operations" issue was?

Djlawman

YesHyM

Flyrights,

Even if you were the first one to have checked in, you should have been the last one to have received any seat available on the next flight.

Snoopy

This may be academic....but BA doesn't have First class between London and Berlin....

Wiirachay

This is the beginning here as you're traveling on a mileage award. I'm not sure if there's a link here, but BA made a few pax stand in the aircraft because it was oversold and people traveling on award seats can't be bumped. I remember that one person was "confirmed" in J class but ended up just standing the entire flight -- which was from LON to JNB (Johannesburg), I think.

Quote:

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">British Airways wouldn't provide a hotel room for the night, nor any meals.</font>

Now that's not cool, esp. if it's airport operations, as opposed to weather.

Quote:

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">. . . they are NOT there to push economy traveler's aside who ALSO hold "OK" confirmed seats.
Jim

Money (and elite status) talks. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif What's in the best finanical interest of BA?

Quote:

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">This may be academic....but BA doesn't have First class between London and Berlin....

Maybe the original poster was referring to connecting pax who flew into LON in F/J?

ScottC

If you pay for Business then you get business, if you pay for economy then you get economy, I think the pecking order for a seat would be:

I can't imagine it being any different on any carrier, don't let the name Oneworld alliance fool you, it won't ever entitle you to more than BA's own customers...

[This message has been edited by ScottC (edited 07-08-2002).]

TransWorldOne

I have a hard time believing this (quoted) story.

TransWorldOne

flyrights,

You are wrong. Your "'OK' confirmed" status was for a flight that was cancelled, not the later flight. Why should an airline reaccomodate based on check-in time? I have never heard of such a thing.

ScottC

Me too, no single captain would EVER let pax fly with him standing, let along the FAA or CAA. Unless this was way back in the 1950's I think this is an urban legend.

Efrem

There were ten seats on the plane. There were at least eleven people who had "OK" confirmed tickets on the earlier flight. There is no way all of you were going to board. Your "OK" confirmation was just as confirmed as anyone else's, but conversely theirs were just as confirmed as yours. Some of you were going to be disappointed.

So, should order of checkin be the determining factor? Unless the airline announced ahead of time that it will be, I don't see why. Using your implied analogy to bus practice, that arrival time at a bus stop determines priority for getting on the next bus if it doesn't have enough room for everyone, is attractive but logically has no connection to the canceled-flight situation.

One of the things you get when you pay for F (more likely on this route, business class) is being taken care of better when bad stuff happens. BA did just that. I might not have liked it if I had the short end of that particular stick, and it surely goes against the egalitarian slant of many Yanks, but it's the right thing to do in the absence of any previously announced rule to the contrary.

(Personally, I'd like to see airlines give priority to skinny grandfathers for everything, as well as 75 percent discounts.)

flyrights

A few points:
When I said "first class passengers", I admit I'm not sure it it was incoming First Class from someone else, or Business Class passengers holding simply London to Berlin tickets.
I British Airways has a PRIORITY ORDER to reroute/rebook passengers on canceled flights, then they have an OBLIGATION to inform people, in advance, of this practice and of the order, BEFORE tickets are bought/redeemed. That is, had British Airways informed me, in advance, that traveling on an award ticket would make me LOW priority in "airport operations" situations, I may not have redeemed an award for that flight... as it may have been CRITICAL for me to make a particular flight, I may have PREFERRED to buy a revenue ticket to increase my PRIORITY level. The point is, British Airways kept that a secret, before, during and after the situation. No one REALLY knows what their hidden priority system is. THis is wrong, and is not fair.
I hardly think their agents at the airport have the ability to sort everyone's ticket type out, when determining priority... that is why the ORDER of check in seems to me to be the ONLY FAIR way of determining who should get PRIORITY to go on the first flight out with seats. It's very clear, and equitable to everyone.
I agree that First Class passengers should be entitled to more room, better food and more baggage allowance... but they should NOT have the right to go in front of OTHER passengers who may have needed to get to Berlin or anywhere else, JUST AS QUICKLY as a First Class passenger.
FINAL POINT: Order of check in is the ONLY fair way I can think of, to determine priority for rebooking on canceled flights.

Plato90s

I have no idea how often you fly, but I always assumed that frequent fliers know the pecking order that airlines use. It's fairly simple too.

The more money you spend, the better service you get - in any situation. That could mean you paid a full-fare First class ticket, or you have top-tier status for flying so much (ie. spending lots of money) with the airline.

In fact, I can't think of a service industry where the time you check-in can actually over-ride another customer who paid more money.

In a hotel, the best suites go to the people who pay the most, even if he arrives at midnight. In a stadium, getting there early won't get you the luxury suite. In a concert, being there early won't get you a backstage pass. You can be the first at the cab stand, but people who pay enough has a limo waiting for them.

And finally....

Getting to the gate early also won't let you board before people who paid more $$ than you did.

First class .... goes first.

landspeed

Also re: full-fare tickets:

Since full fare tickets (biz and economy) are fully refundable and endorsable, I think it could be argued that by booking those pax on the next flight out that they were really just refunding their tickets for the cancelled flight and using the amount of the refund toward the purchase of a full-fare ticket on the next flight.