MSN article about boycotting ff programs
Jan 20, 2003 | 10:07 am
#1
Original Poster
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,861
MSN article about boycotting ff programs
http://www.bcentral.com/articles/elliott/122.asp
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
2. Hard to get an award
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
4. Tax Liability
5. Makes you waste money.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
7. Non existant perks
I don't agree with the article but some points have some merit, especially #2.
#7 is becoming more true, but the million mile a year flyer will get some perks. I've lost interest in DL because the program has gotten worse and don't try to add miles unless I have to. Other programs are almost as guilty
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
2. Hard to get an award
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
4. Tax Liability
5. Makes you waste money.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
7. Non existant perks
I don't agree with the article but some points have some merit, especially #2.
#7 is becoming more true, but the million mile a year flyer will get some perks. I've lost interest in DL because the program has gotten worse and don't try to add miles unless I have to. Other programs are almost as guilty
Jan 20, 2003 | 11:21 am
#2
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Bethesda, MD USA
Posts: 2,802
I hope that lots of people are idiots like this guy and do cut their cards up. Go for it, dude. That is one less person who I have to compete for a seat with.
Woo hoo! I encourage everyone to act like him. Then I will have more chances of getting a seat when I want it.
Not that I've ever had problems redeeming my miles, though.
Woo hoo! I encourage everyone to act like him. Then I will have more chances of getting a seat when I want it.
Not that I've ever had problems redeeming my miles, though.
Jan 20, 2003 | 11:45 am
#5
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MCI
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Wow. I've read some dumb articles about frequent-flyer programs, but I think this one takes the cake.
Several of the author's points make no sense. Point #4 is just plain false, and point #7 is a gripe about elite status - not the value of miles. Points #5 and #6 assume that I Am A Moron.
Points #1, #2, and #3 are some of our greatest debates, but the author just takes the "FF programs suck" mindset and doesn't present any real facts to back that position up.
Finally, the author's solution for all of this is that I fly Southwest. For those of us for whom that isn't possible, he offers no alternative other than to stop accepting miles for the flights we take.
It's nonsensical babble to me...
Several of the author's points make no sense. Point #4 is just plain false, and point #7 is a gripe about elite status - not the value of miles. Points #5 and #6 assume that I Am A Moron.
Points #1, #2, and #3 are some of our greatest debates, but the author just takes the "FF programs suck" mindset and doesn't present any real facts to back that position up.
Finally, the author's solution for all of this is that I fly Southwest. For those of us for whom that isn't possible, he offers no alternative other than to stop accepting miles for the flights we take.
It's nonsensical babble to me...
Jan 20, 2003 | 11:51 am
#6
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Join Date: Feb 2000
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by seat 50J:
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
Given the choice of spending an extra two hours in a place I really don't want to be anyway or making a few extra miles, the miles will win.
2. Hard to get an award
Never had an issue with awards
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
And a penny is only a penny, but if you have 100 of them you have a dollar, and if you have 100 of those... If I need to get someplace and don't want to spend a ton of money on the fare, or want an upgrade I couldn't possibly justify paying for, they are worth much more then a penny.
4. Tax Liability
Not an issue
5. Makes you waste money.
Not an issue, as attested to here time and time again, the most frequent fliers are always looking for the lowest possible fares.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
Don't agree with this one either, most people don't make stupid decisions, they get miles for things they were going to buy anyways. Most of us will send flowers in a couple of weeks, why not get ten miles per dollar?
7. Non existant perks
Again, I have never had an issue with this, run about 80% upgrades when I want them, have never ever not gotten my requests award flights, love the separate check in lines, boarding first, more space between the seats, etc.
</font>
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
Given the choice of spending an extra two hours in a place I really don't want to be anyway or making a few extra miles, the miles will win.
2. Hard to get an award
Never had an issue with awards
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
And a penny is only a penny, but if you have 100 of them you have a dollar, and if you have 100 of those... If I need to get someplace and don't want to spend a ton of money on the fare, or want an upgrade I couldn't possibly justify paying for, they are worth much more then a penny.
4. Tax Liability
Not an issue
5. Makes you waste money.
Not an issue, as attested to here time and time again, the most frequent fliers are always looking for the lowest possible fares.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
Don't agree with this one either, most people don't make stupid decisions, they get miles for things they were going to buy anyways. Most of us will send flowers in a couple of weeks, why not get ten miles per dollar?
7. Non existant perks
Again, I have never had an issue with this, run about 80% upgrades when I want them, have never ever not gotten my requests award flights, love the separate check in lines, boarding first, more space between the seats, etc.
</font>
Jan 20, 2003 | 11:55 am
#7
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DelrayChris, FlyerTalk's rules ask that you not post articles in their entirety. You might just include a passage that you wish to dispute specifically. And you might consider editing your post as a courtesy to Flyertalk. 
Obviously, an article taking the position that miles and points are worthless is going to be controversial here on Flyertalk -- but let's keep the dicussion positive and let's not make personal attacks or question folks' intelligence.
Thanks!
--
Gary
aka gleff
MilesBuzz! moderator
Obviously, an article taking the position that miles and points are worthless is going to be controversial here on Flyertalk -- but let's keep the dicussion positive and let's not make personal attacks or question folks' intelligence.
Thanks!
--
Gary
aka gleff
MilesBuzz! moderator
Jan 20, 2003 | 12:29 pm
#8
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 1,152
The article was just plain dumb. He gave no context for his points just some examples to justify his rationale, without any profiling information.
FF programs are not plain vanilla across the board. Peoples traveling patterns or needs are not the same.
When I was a poor college student,trying to get home I was very flexible. I took the cheapest flight regardless of schedule, routing, service etc. The most I flew was 5000mi per year
Now as a businessman who values his time I am very particular about my flights and the benefits associated with the costs. Now I fly 100k+ a year.
FF programs are not plain vanilla across the board. Peoples traveling patterns or needs are not the same.
When I was a poor college student,trying to get home I was very flexible. I took the cheapest flight regardless of schedule, routing, service etc. The most I flew was 5000mi per year
Now as a businessman who values his time I am very particular about my flights and the benefits associated with the costs. Now I fly 100k+ a year.
Jan 20, 2003 | 1:13 pm
#9
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: NY USA-Buenos Aires Argentina.
Programs: AA,US,AR,Hyatt, Hilton, holidayinn/AR Plus, DiscoPlus& JumboMas
Posts: 407
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by seat 50J:
http://www.bcentral.com/articles/elliott/122.asp
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
2. Hard to get an award
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
4. Tax Liability
5. Makes you waste money.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
7. Non existant perks
I don't agree with the article but some points have some merit, especially #2.
#7 is becoming more true, but the million mile a year flyer will get some perks. I've lost interest in DL because the program has gotten worse and don't try to add miles unless I have to. Other programs are almost as guilty</font>
http://www.bcentral.com/articles/elliott/122.asp
7 Reasons to toss your ff cards.
1. Waste of time
2. Hard to get an award
3. Worthless (a mile is merely a penny)
4. Tax Liability
5. Makes you waste money.
6. Makes you make stupid decisions
7. Non existant perks
I don't agree with the article but some points have some merit, especially #2.
#7 is becoming more true, but the million mile a year flyer will get some perks. I've lost interest in DL because the program has gotten worse and don't try to add miles unless I have to. Other programs are almost as guilty</font>
Jan 20, 2003 | 2:55 pm
#11
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Charlotte, NC
Programs: DL DM, Hilton, Marriott & SPG Platinum & a whole lot of other programs...
Posts: 745
I usually do not make it a point to comment on articles, but I must mention that your recent article on Frequent Flyer programs was very poorly written.
You mentioned everything in very high level, and led the average consumer to believe that all programs are a waste. While I do believe you are correct on some of your points (mainly #6), others do not carry much merit.
You mention someone spending a day to get Gold Medallion. While that may sound extreme to you, do you realize that gives you 2x as many upgrades, saves money on Crown Room Memberships, Gives 100% mileage bonuses, allows you to board early and use Elite Security lines, etc. That 1 additional day spend will save countless hours and money over a year of traveling.
I just booked my Honeymoon and my fianc and I are traveling RT First Class to Spain and Rome. The tickets would have cost $9800 each, but we each used 100k United Star Alliance miles. We also redeemed Hotel Points to stay at 2 different 5* hotels.
I understand this may not apply to everyone, but making broad generalizations from a journalist in your position is irresponsible
You mentioned everything in very high level, and led the average consumer to believe that all programs are a waste. While I do believe you are correct on some of your points (mainly #6), others do not carry much merit.
You mention someone spending a day to get Gold Medallion. While that may sound extreme to you, do you realize that gives you 2x as many upgrades, saves money on Crown Room Memberships, Gives 100% mileage bonuses, allows you to board early and use Elite Security lines, etc. That 1 additional day spend will save countless hours and money over a year of traveling.
I just booked my Honeymoon and my fianc and I are traveling RT First Class to Spain and Rome. The tickets would have cost $9800 each, but we each used 100k United Star Alliance miles. We also redeemed Hotel Points to stay at 2 different 5* hotels.
I understand this may not apply to everyone, but making broad generalizations from a journalist in your position is irresponsible
Jan 20, 2003 | 2:56 pm
#12
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Jersey Isle
Programs: BA Gold, BMI Gold, LH Senator, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 1,175
Yes, miles are addictive but after reading the article I ask myself; are we in denial ourselves or is the author a frustrated Delta or Continental elite member? 
------------------
"Fly me to the moon and let me earn alot of miles."
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"Fly me to the moon and let me earn alot of miles."
Jan 20, 2003 | 3:00 pm
#14
Join Date: May 2000
Location: HH Gold, Marriott Gold, PC Plat, Emirates Silver
Posts: 2,729
He also wrote an article called the 5 rules for collecting frequent-flier miles. It contradits some of his own points.
http://www.bcentral.com/articles/elliott/107.asp
http://www.bcentral.com/articles/elliott/107.asp
Jan 20, 2003 | 3:09 pm
#15
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: From and of Boston.
Posts: 4,973
You can pick apart details in the article, but overall it's my experience that frequent flyer benefits are 'way less than they were 3 or 5 years ago:
There's no great mystery to me why the FF value has gone down: airlines prices are generally an enormous bargain. And low-cost airlines have demonstrated time and again that more customers will buy a $240 ticket on Bob's Cut-Rate Airline than will buy a $270 ticket on Full Service Airlines.
And that should be very troubling indeed for frequent fliers. Because if the major airlines hope to compete with the Southwests and others who have shown how to turn a profit by providing bare-bones service and no significant FF benefits, it's hard to see how that will happen with FF benefits remaining even at their current level.
- I can still upgrade as much as I used to, but the value of the upgrade isn't nearly as great. First class used to mean enough space to work or relax, along with a decent meal and good service. Now 1st class has less room, there seem to be fewer FAs per person (so reduced service), and meals have gone down in quality and, in many cases, have disappeared altogether.
- Unlike cordelli, I have had issues in claiming awards. Whereas UA used to be reasonable in making international premium-cabin award seats available in advance, such seats are absolutely non-existent on some routes, no matter how far in advance I want to make reservations.
There's no great mystery to me why the FF value has gone down: airlines prices are generally an enormous bargain. And low-cost airlines have demonstrated time and again that more customers will buy a $240 ticket on Bob's Cut-Rate Airline than will buy a $270 ticket on Full Service Airlines.
And that should be very troubling indeed for frequent fliers. Because if the major airlines hope to compete with the Southwests and others who have shown how to turn a profit by providing bare-bones service and no significant FF benefits, it's hard to see how that will happen with FF benefits remaining even at their current level.