Virgin Blue isnt connected either, and i seem to recall them having the same kind of spend based points

Nope. Therein lies the problem - why would I shift business away from the Star Alliance to a very small carrier unlinked to anyone else? The only compelling reason I'd fly Virgin America is if I have good tie-ins at least to Europe. Would prefer a partnership that can get me to Asia too, but I'd start with Virgin Atlantic's own metal to London.

True - I know I can go the partner route, but it still doesn't give me any incentive to actually fly Virgin.

These same reasons are why I don't fly a lot of U.S. niche carriers. When I redeem awards, I'm doing it for leisure travel and I want maximum choices, maximum destinations, many partner options. Love the Virgin idea, but I hope they tie it in to the rest of their network.

^^^

Actually I think this is good news and intelligent market-based pricing. Why give away products that have value which can be monetized? This means that I will be able to snag an exit row seat if I am willing to pay for it, v. needing 1P status (50k miles annually) for the same product on UA.

Makes sense if you pay for international travel and aren't fed up with your legacy carrier's service. But for those of us who live in Virgin territory, i.e. SFO and fly mostly domestic to world-class cities like NYC, Vegas, etc. the superior product will be very attractive.

Agreed. But even a program like UA Mileage Plus - which theoretically offers "maximum choices" - is a sham when there is zero saver award inventory in business class on the most popular international routes.

Does anyone know what the Founding member status is? I am assuming it does not mean anything more than regular Elevate status.

Also, any idea if there wlll be tiers to their elite status and if matching will work from similar airlines like Airtran?

Founding member is anyone who joins before Dec. 2007. The idea being that early adopters will get something "special" later on. What that is, nobody knows.


I don't get the impression that VX will be offering "tiers" just yet. It's more of a Southwest model : simply fly more, get more free flights.

(Which will no doubt upset the "I want a gold card, I'm important" gang... )

VX's booking engine sucks. I selected an outbound, then on the next page where I selected my return I had to reselect the outbound because it doesn't automatically select it.

Worse, they don't tell you the total price including taxes and fees until the last page of the booking process. You have to give your name, address and phone number before they'll tell you what the final price is.

I hate airlines that try to scam people with this tax and fee obscurity.

My guess is either a different colored card or the word "Founder" on the FF card. I don't expect anything else.

With you guys on this one. If it was anything special, they probably wouldn't make the promotion months-long. Can't hurt to keep the faith though.

I saw them unwrapping the checkin terminals and doing other various set up things at the new VA counter at LAX a couple weeks ago. A very sleek looking setup, and you could feel some excitement in the air from the VA people who were directing the work.

I think, if nothing else, it should compete with ATA, WN, etc. for LAS and LAX/SFO trips. Will I move any of my UA spend over there? Not biz travel, and probably not any personal jaunts to LAS.

Oh, No IAD/JFK? Boo. The one thing I might use them for is an alternative to UX or Amtrak for that.

Vegas...world-class city... Forget about Vegas for a moment...SFO-LAS is a short hop. Whoever gets me there on-time wins the business. But SFO-JFK - that's a route where the existing carriers (UA, AA, etc.) compete with their "premium domestic" service. The three-cabin planes, the best they have to offer short of international.

So thinking about that, will VX F compare favorably to to UA or AA J? Is that how they will eventually be pricing it? VX Y appears inferior to UA E+ and maybe on-par with AA's LRTC. So to me, the value on VX is if I'm buying F tickets. VX has clearly given the nod to UA in terms of the back of the bus - I don't think they have plans for any 35 or 36 inch service in Y.

Yeah...I know all of the big programs are a bit hit and miss on availability. Maybe it's because I usually don't fly at max-peak holiday times, but I usually have good luck with UA and AA. I just recently finished planning and booking an 8-segment int'l F itinerary and was able to get everything I wanted. My only complaint for UA: it would have been very, very difficult to book this without "outside" help. (Namely, using ANA to sift through all of the options first, because UA phone agents aren't that proactive or creative.)

True. Coupons are like sales. You haven't realized any taxable income.

Frequent flyer miles are a bit different. Everyone knows that they have some value. The problem is deciding what value and when it is realized. I don't think we have anything to worry about just yet. As the IRS has said:

"There are numerous technical and administrative issues relating to these benefits on which no official guidance has been provided, including issues relating to the timing and valuation of income inclusions..."

They've also said:

"Consistent with prior practice, the IRS will not assert that any taxpayer has
understated his federal tax liability by reason of the receipt or personal use of
frequent flyer miles... This relief does not apply to travel or other promotional benefits that are converted to cash,"

Naturally, these quotes come with the caveat that I'm not affiliated with the IRS and am not providing tax advice to anyone. Long story short, I really like the looks of Virgin's FF program! Simple and generous.

Exit row pricing for their transcons JFK-SFO appears to be $25 so if you want it both ways it adds another $50 to your ticket raising the cost to over $500. They mention an additional 6 inches of pitch for a total of 38 inches which implies a standard pitch of 32 inches. While better than average their transcon price is also just that, average. No mention of the cost for the AVOD but I don't believe I read that it'll be free either, just available.

Movies will be PPV; other programming, free. At least that's what they were saying at launch.

If they're not charging for the in-seat power you could at least bring your own AVOD I suppose.