People at US should wake up! These minority federal employees are extremely valuable in a time of war like right now.

White guys should know, they are lucky that blacks, arabs, and asians are working hard for them to transmit important information.

Sure, be tough to our minority groups, and see who would want to work for you? Then you are left alone in a time of war with no ally.

If US did not have German or Japanese speaking agents from second generation immigrants, they would never win the World Wars.

Show some appreciations, please. This arab might the person to translate secret document for Secret Service for their next successful mission.

I truly admire his courage and loyalty to US service.

Yup. That is the primary reason that we can't carry our tiny scissors and old ladies can't have their knitting needles. There is wide public support (read fear) for any kind of security. The problem is that no one wants to pay for real security so we get this bull ****.

Now if CBS or whomever did a survey of people who fly at least 50K miles per year, I think the results would be vastly different. 100K flyers would be even more realistic about it.

I agree with stimpy and bdschobel.

I took 2 US domestic flights this last week and had to check in 2 hours before the flight. How long are FFs going to put up with this? If it's for the sake of effective security, I can understand it but not for what I saw.

The security currently in place is for the sake of appeasing the public rather than preventing terrorism. Just my opinion.

I've never checked in as early as you have. However, I'll be more than happy to wait for any reasonable amount of time when appropriate security measures are in place. However, I'm not very happy when I have to wait even five minutes for shoes to go through x-ray machines or other ridiculous measures

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The security currently in place is for the sake of appeasing the public rather than preventing terrorism. Just my opinion.

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daniel baker -- [email protected]
Reliable, fast, and unmoderated forums at ITYT.

[This message has been edited by dbaker (edited 01-14-2002).]

to Robinhood
If you would check I believe that you would find that more FAs and Pilots died last year than Secret Service agents. They are responsible for the safety of a lot of people. We are not always going to like the decisions they make but we have to respect their right to make them.
To the individual quoting the Ann Coulter artcile. How about posting a link to where we can read about her suggesting we raid Muslim homes....

We need a statitics person here. Is there a ratio missing?

Absolutely! There are far more pilots and FA's than there are Secret Service agents.

intobsv,

That is perhaps the worst actuarial analysis I've seen in 28 years as an actuary.

First, the number of pilots and FAs is much greater than the number of Secret Service agents -- possibly 100 to 1. So, the exposure is much greater. If 1% of each group died last year, then the absolute number of dead pilots and FAs would be larger, obviously, but the death RATE would be identical.

Second, the number dying has nothing to do with being "responsible for the safety of a lot of people." These are separate issues! Lots of coal miners die every year, but they aren't protecting anyone -- not directly, anyway (they may stop us from freezing to death, but let's not get into that). The Secret Service is absolutely in the business of protection. Pilots and FAs do lots of other things; I would question whether they died protecting us or were just victims like the "regular" passengers were. You can make your own judgment on that issue.

Bruce

"During discussion of the incident, Shater's reputation has taken a beating. That is why he approached the attorneys. News personalities who influence public opinion sided with American Airlines. A CBS News Web site survey showed that 78 percent of respondents nationwide approved of the airline's actions."

Thank you for the post. I've noticed too that when TV talking heads discuss this issue, they would invariably cite allegations from the pilot's statement as if they were true or confirmed. So 78% of the surveyed agreed with AA, what were the questions and how were they phrased?

While pilots and FAs and other airline workers work hard everyday to make their living and deliver passengers to their destinations, it's unfortunate that the as-yet unamed pilot and FA in this incident have damaged the reputation of a security service agent with their inappropriate and misguided behavior. Racial bias and unreasonable paranoia against a certain ethnnic group definitely played a role here; I think had the agent not been Arab, the FA would not have rifled his personal belongings, and the pilot would have believed his security credentials (or at least made one verification call).

I still fault AA for not making a quick apology to the agent. Perhaps AA is afraid of lawsuits from all the kicked-off passengers, but it will be worse for AA if this case goes to trial.

Tip of the day: Be sure to cover all your foreign-language reading materials when you fly AA. Perhaps the kind they use to cover up romance novels will do. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I certainly wasn't trying to do any kind of statistical analysis. I was simply trying to make a point. I will change my question. When was the last time a secret service agent died in the line of duty?
As to Pilots they are responsible for the safety of their passengers. Can you imagine the outcry if the Pilot had let the person fly and something had happened? I don't think that a lot of us can put ourself in the position of having to make those kinds of decisions.

I guess I will never understand people that say that Middle Eastern looking people should not be targeted by airline security personnel. Please explain to me why a 65 year old woman is as much a danger as a 24 year old Arab Muslim.

I think we should profile all blond haired blue-eyed people with short hair. You never know when another Timothy McVeigh could be lurking out there.

intobsv,

I agree with you on that point, but once checked, Arab Muslims should be allowed to go about their business just like anyone else. The Secret Service agent identified himself to everyone's satisfaction, and STILL the pilot wouldn't let him fly -- then obviously made up a self-serving story about the agent's behavior. Heads should roll for this.

Bruce

[This message has been edited by bdschobel (edited 01-14-2002).]

[This message has been edited by obiwan (edited 01-14-2002).]

[This message has been edited by obiwan (edited 01-14-2002).]