UAL to buy US Air
May 24, 2000 | 7:09 am
#16
Join Date: Jan 1999
Location: Charlotte, NC
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I wonder how many US Air Lounges they will keep open and when (if) they will be changed to RCC's. Also wonder when their will be access to these clubs... 
Time will tell
Time will tell
May 24, 2000 | 8:31 am
#17
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Third planet from the Sun
Posts: 7,024
So what happens after two years? It will take United at least two years to digest their new meal.
What fare does United not promise to raise for the next two years? Full fare Y? If that is the case they can still raise all of their promotional fares (the bulk of their fares) and still not break any promises.
What fare does United not promise to raise for the next two years? Full fare Y? If that is the case they can still raise all of their promotional fares (the bulk of their fares) and still not break any promises.
May 24, 2000 | 10:20 am
#18
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 24,150
As I posted on a different thread yesterday.All those who did,are doing,will do the LP bonus, I cant help but think our miles will be worth less since I feel UAL will NOT remain with LP as US AIR was. So we are done to TWA & KLM to use for getting around anywhere but CA & SA. How long TWA will remain in the air is another question, but Im still going down in a few weeks what the heck Wall St is shot need to find another gamble.
May 24, 2000 | 11:09 am
#21
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Join Date: May 1998
Location: Chattanooga, TN, USA**US Airways Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 1,338
BajanYankee, of all parties in this, UA was the least responsible for destroying competition in Canada. Once Collenette tipped his hand in favor of Onex, competition was going to be destroyed no matter what--all UA did was arrange to be on the winning side.
May 24, 2000 | 2:54 pm
#23
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Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
Fred-
As you well know, 48 is not 60!
A 12 pt differential = skepticism
Yet the closing price for UA was only about 53!
Wall Street analysts pointed to several potential obstacles that could derail the deal. They listed labor discord, antitrust issues and the tough task of making the marriage work as potential pitfalls and cited previous failed airline consolidation efforts as proof of the difficulties that carriers face when they try to merge.
http://www.nytimes.com/00/05/24/news...24tsc-air.html
[This message has been edited by doc (edited 05-24-2000).]
As you well know, 48 is not 60!
A 12 pt differential = skepticism
Yet the closing price for UA was only about 53!
Wall Street analysts pointed to several potential obstacles that could derail the deal. They listed labor discord, antitrust issues and the tough task of making the marriage work as potential pitfalls and cited previous failed airline consolidation efforts as proof of the difficulties that carriers face when they try to merge.
http://www.nytimes.com/00/05/24/news...24tsc-air.html
[This message has been edited by doc (edited 05-24-2000).]
May 25, 2000 | 5:32 am
#26
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Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
UAL Corp.'s plan to buy most of US Airways Group Inc. in what would be the largest airline merger in history was certain to face obstacles. And when the deal was announced formally Wednesday, naysayers swarmed in. The news drew criticism from the powerful pilots union at UAL's United Airlines unit. It raised the hackles of some legislators and consumer advocates. Some Wall Street analysts speculated that such a huge deal could be blocked by antitrust authorities before it set off a competitive chain reaction that would further concentrate the airline industry.
...Speaking from a Metroliner train to Washington from New York late Wednesday, Mr. Goodwin joked that Amtrak "is the only way to fly." In truth, he said, stormy weather forced US Air to cancel a number of flights, which is how the executive found himself taking the train...
...United executives also said privately that routes between some of the assorted hubs of the two companies might have other antitrust problems...
The American Society of Travel Agents, a group that has been pummeled by airlines' commission cuts and increased selling on the Internet, believes that "any reduction in competition among major carriers will hurt our members and consumers," according to Joe Galloway, the president.
PaineWebber Inc.'s Samuel Buttrick said the labor and regulatory hurdles are so great that he won't assign a more than 50% probability that the transaction will be approved.
The 5,000 pilots at US Air aren't "elated," said a spokesman for the Air Line Pilots Association. "We thought they were going to build an airline out of US Airways," he said of current management.
But the leader of the 10,000 United pilots, who together own 25% of UAL and have a seat on the board, said he was "deeply disappointed" that UAL would enter into the transaction without reaching full agreement with the pilots on all issues. Rick Dubinsky said the proposed merger could require "potentially disruptive" negotiations over the integration of US Air pilots into United's pilot-seniority list.
http://public.wsj.com/news/personalE...482848311.html
...Speaking from a Metroliner train to Washington from New York late Wednesday, Mr. Goodwin joked that Amtrak "is the only way to fly." In truth, he said, stormy weather forced US Air to cancel a number of flights, which is how the executive found himself taking the train...
...United executives also said privately that routes between some of the assorted hubs of the two companies might have other antitrust problems...
The American Society of Travel Agents, a group that has been pummeled by airlines' commission cuts and increased selling on the Internet, believes that "any reduction in competition among major carriers will hurt our members and consumers," according to Joe Galloway, the president.
PaineWebber Inc.'s Samuel Buttrick said the labor and regulatory hurdles are so great that he won't assign a more than 50% probability that the transaction will be approved.
The 5,000 pilots at US Air aren't "elated," said a spokesman for the Air Line Pilots Association. "We thought they were going to build an airline out of US Airways," he said of current management.
But the leader of the 10,000 United pilots, who together own 25% of UAL and have a seat on the board, said he was "deeply disappointed" that UAL would enter into the transaction without reaching full agreement with the pilots on all issues. Rick Dubinsky said the proposed merger could require "potentially disruptive" negotiations over the integration of US Air pilots into United's pilot-seniority list.
http://public.wsj.com/news/personalE...482848311.html
May 25, 2000 | 5:40 am
#27
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Join Date: Apr 1999
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doc-
Thanks for shocking me into reality again. I needed that!! I think my nice broker will soon receive a call from me, and I WILL go short on US Air stock. For heavens sake.....they have been shorting moi for years (note: this is the 1st "airline" I flew on, and back when they were officially Allegheny Airlines). At the time we were certain they were doing crop-dusting on the side and hopefully re-cleaning the plane.
Thanks for shocking me into reality again. I needed that!! I think my nice broker will soon receive a call from me, and I WILL go short on US Air stock. For heavens sake.....they have been shorting moi for years (note: this is the 1st "airline" I flew on, and back when they were officially Allegheny Airlines). At the time we were certain they were doing crop-dusting on the side and hopefully re-cleaning the plane.
May 25, 2000 | 6:07 am
#28
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Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
So perhaps you remember the red "hot pants" worn by the then highly regulated, extremely thin & unmarried "stewardesses" in 1970!
Personally, I'd rather see you sell the US (uncovered) calls to take advantage of the rather huge premium(s) and also minimize some risk! This is a no brainer if you already own the stock, IMHO! But details on this are for another Usergroup! 
From the NY Times Editorial today:
There is a morbid expression that no one ever got rich hauling passengers. Not the railroads. Not the buses. Not the airlines.
http://www.nytimes.com/00/05/25/editorial/25thu2.html
Personally, I'd rather see you sell the US (uncovered) calls to take advantage of the rather huge premium(s) and also minimize some risk!
This is a no brainer if you already own the stock, IMHO! But details on this are for another Usergroup! From the NY Times Editorial today:
There is a morbid expression that no one ever got rich hauling passengers. Not the railroads. Not the buses. Not the airlines.
http://www.nytimes.com/00/05/25/editorial/25thu2.html
May 25, 2000 | 8:12 am
#29
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Bryn Mawr PA & Wailea HI
Posts: 15,726
doc-
IMHO anybody buying or selling "uncovered calls" with ANY airline stock, should get their basement checked for excessive radon.......and quickly.
And I am not certain re the NYT editorial either. I went to college with one of the nice (actually) Rockefellers, and he seemed to have mega-more savings than the average guy on campus. The St Joe Paper people are still coining it big in Florida per article in the NYT last week, etc. Not for the long-term average six-pack-joe individual investor though. Combo of mega-union and mega-government rules, regulations, laws etc has ground them all down (ie forty years to get fireman off diesel trains?). The bottom line is the original family usually makes-out and few others.
IMHO anybody buying or selling "uncovered calls" with ANY airline stock, should get their basement checked for excessive radon.......and quickly.
And I am not certain re the NYT editorial either. I went to college with one of the nice (actually) Rockefellers, and he seemed to have mega-more savings than the average guy on campus. The St Joe Paper people are still coining it big in Florida per article in the NYT last week, etc. Not for the long-term average six-pack-joe individual investor though. Combo of mega-union and mega-government rules, regulations, laws etc has ground them all down (ie forty years to get fireman off diesel trains?). The bottom line is the original family usually makes-out and few others.
May 25, 2000 | 9:12 am
#30
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Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
Okay- I'll check my radon detector and also make an emergency call to the "Radon-detection" folks!
Not to perpetuate this unnecessarily but when:
Sell Short 1000s = unlimited vulnerability/loss on upside
Sell 10 calls = unlimited vulnerability/loss on upside for 100 shares (minus premium earned and which you've garnished upfront!)
By heh! You are the MBA! What do I know?
BTW- Both are down a bit early today!
Meanwhile, the UA/US wagons are circling in defense of the deal!
Executives defended plans by the parent of United Airlines to acquire US Airways as a good strategic match that would withstand any government antitrust challenge or bidding war by competitors. Admittedly, the Goodwin/Wolf comments regarding the "lack of route overlap", unions similarly structured, common aircraft, etc, which should permit the two (labor) organizations to very easily combine amazes/amuses me somewhat!
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/f/AP...-The-Deal.html
Not to perpetuate this unnecessarily but when:
Sell Short 1000s = unlimited vulnerability/loss on upside
Sell 10 calls = unlimited vulnerability/loss on upside for 100 shares (minus premium earned and which you've garnished upfront!)
By heh! You are the MBA! What do I know?
BTW- Both are down a bit early today!
Meanwhile, the UA/US wagons are circling in defense of the deal!
Executives defended plans by the parent of United Airlines to acquire US Airways as a good strategic match that would withstand any government antitrust challenge or bidding war by competitors. Admittedly, the Goodwin/Wolf comments regarding the "lack of route overlap", unions similarly structured, common aircraft, etc, which should permit the two (labor) organizations to very easily combine amazes/amuses me somewhat!
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/f/AP...-The-Deal.html