What are you NOT willing to do for extra miles/points/status?
#121
FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: BOS, MHT
Programs: AA ltg, B6, DL, UA, AS, SPG/Marriott Plt, HH, Hyatt
Posts: 10,062
What is MS? It's not in the FlyerTalk Glossary.
When you buy things you can cash out just to get points or miles or cash back. The fees of these things, like VRs (Vanilla Reload packs, which may also not be in there) are outweighed by the amounts of points you might get during such purchases.
#122
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA PLAT
Posts: 79
MS is manufactured spending.
When you buy things you can cash out just to get points or miles or cash back. The fees of these things, like VRs (Vanilla Reload packs, which may also not be in there) are outweighed by the amounts of points you might get during such purchases.
When you buy things you can cash out just to get points or miles or cash back. The fees of these things, like VRs (Vanilla Reload packs, which may also not be in there) are outweighed by the amounts of points you might get during such purchases.
#123
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend




Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Programs: DL estranged 1MMer and lifetime gold, F9/CO/NW/UA/AA once gold/plat now dust, Spirit RIP
Posts: 42,224
I guess I've been a real slacker: No social media, no surveys, no wine clubs. I had gone some 19 years without a pure MR until a $138 BNA-RDU RT with a huge bonus mile deal of some sort proved too tough to resist a couple of years ago.
OTOH, the old system of flying-for-miles just isn't being rewarded like before. With MQDs/PQDs, DL and UA want 10 cents per EQM and count only purchases on their ticket stock (a real stealth gotcha), whereas FTers want to pay only around 4 cents, less if possible. I'm unlikely to go beyond silver, if that, on spending patterms and already have that as a MM'er. So DL just went from a program that could incentivize trips that wouldn't have happened at all to "What's the incentive to fly?", which is a spectacular drop in effectiveness for a loyalty program.
And Spirit's alternative is 50% miles and aggressive expiration with mediocre award levels UNLESS you're a cardholder (which many of their customers would not qualify for), so the only real game there is with the credit card (and, for those who are so inclined, MS). Again, no real incentive to fly, at least on paid tickets.
Having some 21 years now of online bookings and the fly-for-miles model (starting with command lines and EAASY SABRE on CompuServe, if you can believe), you could say I liked the old system and have been slow to change, but it's hard to deny that the current system and alignment of rewards can lead to credit-card churnin', spendin'-manufacturin', fuel-dumpin' super-cynics.
OTOH, the old system of flying-for-miles just isn't being rewarded like before. With MQDs/PQDs, DL and UA want 10 cents per EQM and count only purchases on their ticket stock (a real stealth gotcha), whereas FTers want to pay only around 4 cents, less if possible. I'm unlikely to go beyond silver, if that, on spending patterms and already have that as a MM'er. So DL just went from a program that could incentivize trips that wouldn't have happened at all to "What's the incentive to fly?", which is a spectacular drop in effectiveness for a loyalty program.
And Spirit's alternative is 50% miles and aggressive expiration with mediocre award levels UNLESS you're a cardholder (which many of their customers would not qualify for), so the only real game there is with the credit card (and, for those who are so inclined, MS). Again, no real incentive to fly, at least on paid tickets.
Having some 21 years now of online bookings and the fly-for-miles model (starting with command lines and EAASY SABRE on CompuServe, if you can believe), you could say I liked the old system and have been slow to change, but it's hard to deny that the current system and alignment of rewards can lead to credit-card churnin', spendin'-manufacturin', fuel-dumpin' super-cynics.
#126




Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SJC/SFO
Programs: WN A+ CP, UA 1MM/*A Gold, Mar LT Tit, IHG Plat, HH Dia
Posts: 6,377
I decided today not to bother with Rewards Network dining. I looked at the participating restaurants in my area and estimated that I'd visit them 1/month. For an average check of $40 and at a rate of 3 points/dollar that's about 1500 miles in the first year. I value those miles conservatively at $25 and feel that's just not worth giving my credit card numbers to a third party and letting them track my spending.
#127
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: DFW
Programs: AA PLAT
Posts: 79
I decided today not to bother with Rewards Network dining. I looked at the participating restaurants in my area and estimated that I'd visit them 1/month. For an average check of $40 and at a rate of 3 points/dollar that's about 1500 miles in the first year. I value those miles conservatively at $25 and feel that's just not worth giving my credit card numbers to a third party and letting them track my spending.
But anyway, my own town's selection is dismal, but I enjoy having a pre-selected list of "suggestions" when I travel to new cities.
#128




Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SJC/SFO
Programs: WN A+ CP, UA 1MM/*A Gold, Mar LT Tit, IHG Plat, HH Dia
Posts: 6,377
I considered that as part of my calculation. I figured the VIP status wouldn't kick in until after the first year, and then only if I squeeze in 12 dines. The restaurants in my city participating in the program are not ones I visit very often so I'd have to stretch to hit VIP status. And eating at a restaurant I've previously pooh-poohed is one of the things I care not to do for points.
#129




Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: YYZ, YYJ, ZRH
Programs: AC MM
Posts: 430
I won't fly on an airline that has crappy service (elderly, burned-out flight attendants) just to get points with the airline alliance I have status with.
For example, given a choice between Cathay Pacific and Air Canada on the same route, I'll choose Cathay every time, even though I do most of my travel with Air Canada and I participate in Air Canada's mileage program.
Paid J is generally the same price on both - but the difference in service, and thus the difference in enjoyment of the flight, is significant.
Similarly, I won't fly on an airline that has crappy lie-flat beds just because it is part of the same alliance as my mileage program... I'll always choose the airline with the best bed, to heck with the points.
For example, given a choice between Cathay Pacific and Air Canada on the same route, I'll choose Cathay every time, even though I do most of my travel with Air Canada and I participate in Air Canada's mileage program.
Paid J is generally the same price on both - but the difference in service, and thus the difference in enjoyment of the flight, is significant.
Similarly, I won't fly on an airline that has crappy lie-flat beds just because it is part of the same alliance as my mileage program... I'll always choose the airline with the best bed, to heck with the points.
#130


Join Date: May 2000
Location: Houston, TX, USA
Programs: UA Platinum, AA Lifetime Platinum, DL Platinum, Honors Diamond, Bonvoy Ambassador, Hertz Platinum
Posts: 8,179
I'm unlikely to go beyond silver, if that, on spending patterms and already have that as a MM'er. So DL just went from a program that could incentivize trips that wouldn't have happened at all to "What's the incentive to fly?", which is a spectacular drop in effectiveness for a loyalty program.
#131
FlyerTalk Evangelist




Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Danville, CA, USA;
Programs: UA 1MM, WN CP, Marriott LT Plat, Hilton Gold, IC Plat
Posts: 18,103
I won't take a connection when I could take a nonstop, or fly a circuitous routing just to earn more EQM.
I won't switch hotels in the same city just to increase my stay count. I already waste time switching rooms far too often (due to unsatisfactory conditions) and I hate wasting time repacking, elevators, etc.
Also agree with all of the following - just don't have the time to waste on this mostly low value time consuming nonsense:
Most of the restaurants are pathetic, but occasionally I am surprised when I get credit for one that I forgot was on idine.
Agreed - not worth the abuse.
+1 I limit myself to 1-2 new cards per year, mainly to get the signup bonus. And then I cancel the useless ones
+1
Agree. I already have enough CCs to track, don't need to add prepaid cards with more balances to track, just to earn a few bonus miles. My spend is high enough that I can easily meet all the thresholds with manufacturing fake spend.
+1 Very risky.
I won't switch hotels in the same city just to increase my stay count. I already waste time switching rooms far too often (due to unsatisfactory conditions) and I hate wasting time repacking, elevators, etc.
Also agree with all of the following - just don't have the time to waste on this mostly low value time consuming nonsense:
+1 Very risky.
#132
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: AA, Alaska, Hilton, Marriott, IHG
Posts: 67
I probably won't do the following:
1) Sign up for credit cards. I've had 3 so far, and I don't plan to get any more.
2) Manufactured spend. Don't want to get banned by any banks!
3) Book a "throwaway" hotel room just to complete a promotion
4) Do low-yielding surveys. Some surveys are worth it, most are not.
5) Open hotel accounts for my folks and have them book rooms for me to earn a promo.
6) Mileage runs. The cost in terms of time and wasted productivity is too much.
1) Sign up for credit cards. I've had 3 so far, and I don't plan to get any more.
2) Manufactured spend. Don't want to get banned by any banks!
3) Book a "throwaway" hotel room just to complete a promotion
4) Do low-yielding surveys. Some surveys are worth it, most are not.
5) Open hotel accounts for my folks and have them book rooms for me to earn a promo.
6) Mileage runs. The cost in terms of time and wasted productivity is too much.
#133
FlyerTalk Evangelist

Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: BOS, MHT
Programs: AA ltg, B6, DL, UA, AS, SPG/Marriott Plt, HH, Hyatt
Posts: 10,062
I probably won't do the following:
1) Sign up for credit cards. I've had 3 so far, and I don't plan to get any more.
2) Manufactured spend. Don't want to get banned by any banks!
3) Book a "throwaway" hotel room just to complete a promotion
4) Do low-yielding surveys. Some surveys are worth it, most are not.
5) Open hotel accounts for my folks and have them book rooms for me to earn a promo.
6) Mileage runs. The cost in terms of time and wasted productivity is too much.
1) Sign up for credit cards. I've had 3 so far, and I don't plan to get any more.
2) Manufactured spend. Don't want to get banned by any banks!
3) Book a "throwaway" hotel room just to complete a promotion
4) Do low-yielding surveys. Some surveys are worth it, most are not.
5) Open hotel accounts for my folks and have them book rooms for me to earn a promo.
6) Mileage runs. The cost in terms of time and wasted productivity is too much.
We may likely never have a beer together
#134
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: San Antonio
Programs: AS MVP
Posts: 2,276
Just an observation not criticism. To each his own.
#135
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: AA, Alaska, Hilton, Marriott, IHG
Posts: 67


It's just that I find it is easy to forget to pay a bill (even though I have it all on an Excel sheet). Had a late payment. Recently almost had another late payment!
Hey, any tips on keeping on top of all the credit-card/loan/internet/utility/etc. bills??

