Majuki

I'm pretty certain you can only reinstate your previous status and not upgrade. Since it is a soft landing, you would be buying back your previous status. That is to say, if you were Platinum and had dropped to Gold, you are able to change your status back to Platinum for 40,000 points.

gardener

Well, I do not know about the weather where you are (we've had a lot of snow in the Northeast), but as to whether this makes sense:

Last year I earned 9,555 points for Platinum arrival gift and 80,740 points for 50% Platinum bonus (40K more than a Gold would earn).

So while I did not need this offer, it seems clear that you could pay out the 40K points to stay as Platinum and then earn back 50K over a year.

tvetter01

Yeah, but how many nights did you stay to earn that? After 75 of them you earn platinum anyway, so the buyback doesn't provide you any benefit after that point.

The real question would be how many extra points (more than you would have as Gold) did you earn in your first 75 nights?

gardener

Good point!

I will let you know once I reanalyze my spreadsheet.

And the answer is....

No change because the year I have data for, I only stayed 79 nights so would have made platinum on my last (5 night) stay in Tokyo.

Anyway, the point is, it could be a decent deal to pay 40K points to stay platinum, IF you plan a lot of stays the following year. The more short and high dollar stays the better, as the delta between Pt and Au is the 500 point arrival gift and the 50% point bonus vs. 25%.

drzoidberg

I was told that you can upgrade as well, which seems to contradict their fine print.

**EDIT: They responded by email that I could not upgrade; guess their phone-CST had it wrong.

doodiedan

I actually got the email from Marriott today entitled "Use Points to Buy Back Your Gold Status - Limited Time".

Details are pretty much spelled out in the thread already. There is a nice bold line at the end of the email that says:

Offer ends April 1, 2010 and is valid only for members who were Gold Elite in 2009.

I would imagine it says the same on emails for Plat & Silver.

I don't think there were any sort of stay requirements for this. I only had 19 nights with Marriott last year. Whether I take the offer or not, I haven't decided yet.

2358

is the buyback targetted? This gold hasn't received the offer - can/where do I find it on the website?

Chuckles

https://www.marriott.com/marriott/elitebuyback.mi

jalves

OK, so if I was Silver in 2009 and got the "taste of Gold" upgrade in the last quarter of the year, but am now back down to Silver does that temporary bump up qualify me for the buyback gold offer in 2010?

Kalboz

two mods are bloging about buying back status with MR:

http://boardingarea.com/blogs/thewan.../tag/marriott/

http://boardingarea.com/blogs/viewfr...medium=twitter

BrightlyBob

This is the first of 3 consecutive posts about the value, or otherwise of the Marriott offers to buyback status.

Starting with Silver

In order to work out whether it is worthwhile to renew Silver status for 7500 points we need to ascertain the value we can tease out of the scheme, whilst remembering we only have 10 night stays to do so, because after 10 nights Marriott gives us the status.

To do this we must examine each Silver benfit in turn...

1. 10% weekend discount against rack rate with Courtyard and Springhill Suites. Hohum, there are no Springhills and very few Courtyards in Europe but even if this applied accross all brands, Marriott has the "weekend rate" which is a, um, 20% discount against rack rates at weekends available to all, not just elites. So pretty much hot air that then.

2. Marriott Gift shop discount. The Marriott gift shop is not to be found at all hotels and even where it is present is generally pretty expensive compared to local gift shops in the vicinity, so I dont see any value there.

3. Priority late checkout. This is subject to availability and so is meaningless. Most Marriotts seems to have a general policy of first hour of a late checkout is free, but then so do most hotels, I've never had a problem securing an hour late checkout anywhere, Marriott or not. After that it becomes a fight, although I've noticed late checkouts are easier to obtain as a Plat, never as a Silver. So nothing there either.

4. Ultimate reservation guarantee. This will compensate you if you're bumped. I've never been bumped in over 250 stays at Marriott, only about 200 of which were as a member of MR. I have been bumped once with another chain where I didnt have status and after reminding them of their contractural obligations the hotel found me accommodation with a local competitor, picked up the bill, refunded me my reservation and gave me a voucher for a free night, so I reckon I can secure the value without the guarantee.

5. Elite reservation line, for you to make your bookings, instead of using the normal line. I find when a company is after your money they tend to answer quite quickly and dont see any value here.

6. Elite Guest line. So I can call and discuss my status and enquiries about the scheme. Erm yeah, so that's a non benefit, I only have questions if I'm a member. I'm not a member of Hyatt so dont have any questions about their scheme, so hardly miss not being able to call Hyatt about it. As a scheme member I'd expect to be able to call someone with my queries about the scheme, so hardly a benefit that.

7. 20% bonus points. At last we've got past the spin doctors and into the value of the scheme. Points have value and the extra 20% is valuable. The base award is 10 points per $, so Silver adds 20% to that, 2 points per $. To recover your 7500 point outlay you'll have to spend $3750. In only 10 nights, thats $375 night. Possible I grant you, with a few Marriotts in London, Paris and New York in this price point, but with the average FS running at $170 you actually only get 3400 points back, much less if your stays are mainly non-FS, especially CY or FI.

Now some might say I'm being mean in according no value whatsoever to benefits 1-6 and you may feel that those bits are worth something to you. Especially to those who dont like arguing the ultimate guarantee may mean something, but in reality very little. I suspect I've spent well over 500 nights in hotels during my life, and only been bumped once, the chances of you being bumped in those first 10 nights is microscopically small. The gift shop may hold value for you, perhaps you always get your local postcard there, but at only 10% discount you're going to have to buy a lot of postcards, or cuddly bears to see any benefit, and as I say, generally the local independent gift shop is cheaper anyway. It really is impossible to see these other 6 being worth anything but to be generous lets say no more than $20-$30, and using a value of 1UScent per point gives us 2000-3000 points. Even if you accord that value to the first 6 bennies you're still going to have to spend over $200 night during the first 10 nights to recover the 7500 points spent.

Lastly, it is worth mentioning that taking out UK Marriott Visa card gives you sufficient nights for silver and is free. The USA signature card does better giving extra nights credit and a cat 5 free stay certificate but is subject to a fee... Thanks to bk3day for pointing this out.

So is the 7500 points to renew Silver worth it?

Categorically not!!

BrightlyBob

If you've been offered the opportunity to buy Gold for 25,000 points the question is, is it worth it? Whether that's worth it depends upon the value you can squeeze out of the status, so lets examine that.

The benefits of Gold are:-

1. A Gold elite telephone line, that's exactly the same number as the Silver elite, so that's no added value over Silver there then.

2. Guaranteed room type, hmm, not sure this is worth anything, I always get the room type I book with any hotel, I did with Marriott before I joined MR.

3. Extra 0.5 points per $! Yup, non-elites get 10 points per $, Silvers get a 20% bonus, thats 12 points per $, an extra 2 points over non status and Gold get a 25% bonus, that's 12.5 points per $, or 0.5 point per $ over silver. You'd need to spend $50,000 to recoup the cost and with room averages at FS Marriotts about $170, that means about 290 nights, many more for CY or FI... So that's hardly worth it then!

4. Room upgrades, variable and in the queue behind Plats, so really difficult to value. I personally found as a Gold I was upgraded more than occasionally, less than often. Most of my upgrades were as Gold (and still are as Plat) along the lines of better room position/view rather than concierge level or suites. Since as a Silver (and Gold and Plat) I've always booked the cheapest room, this doesn't save me any money, as I'd never pay the extra though I guess it does make my stay nicer. Difficult to value something I'd never pay for though, but lets say an extra $10 night, when acheived, which for the sake of arguement I will say is 1/3 of the time. A fair value for a point is 1cent so thats worth an average of 300 points per night.

5. Exec Lounge access... Now here's the real meat of Gold, free soft drinks and coffee, free weekday breakfast, free evening offerings, that I can value, $15 per night for the breakfast benefit alone, an extra $10 for the soft drinks/coffee/evening fare gives you an added value of $25 night, although it can be much more, or much less. At some hotels the breakfast offerings are so wide as to be a cooked breakfast in the lounge with evening offerings which are equivalent to a meal, and for those properties without a lounge the benefit is sometimes replaced by breakfast vouchers and drinks vouchers, or free minibar. The benefit can however be really disappointing at other hotels with lounges open only Monday morning to Friday lunch, and no alternative offered, weekend stays can be very dry indeed. Hence Exec lounge is only worth it if you stay vast majority weekdays or, if a good proportion of your stay pattern is leisure based staying at the "overperforming" hotels (***but don't tell Marriott... Corporate doesn't seem to like excellent customer service***).
So how to value this? Well some can be worth as much as $40 night in exec lounge benefits, others barely manage the $15 breakfast value, so take an average of $25/night. This is therefore a valuable extra for the midweek stayer. For me about half my stays are weekdays, although in Europe over half of CL's are open during weekends, and when not all hotels seem to offer complimentary full breakfast worth $20... On the other hand I can't or don't always feel like taking full advantage. Then again, I am accompanied about half the time so that adds to the value, so say 2/3 of the $25 seems appropriate here, that's $16 night which I'm valuing at 1600 points each time.

6. EEO's, an extra weekend night free, but this time round not honoured in any hotels outside the USA. This is a major benefit only if you can use it, and if you live outside the USA you're probably like me, on the outside looking in, nose pressed against the window. So its worthless to me, but if you're in the USA, very valuable. Last year when it was valid in Europe I used it at least 4 or 5 times (unlike USA it was not valid in that many European hotels). Now, weekend rates are much lower than weekday but nonetheless the value is still about $100 per weekend night, or 10,000 points each time ^. Say you use them just 4 times per year that saves you $400, or 40,000 points ^^

But worthless if outside USA, so that's...







Ahem, sorry about that. So, to continue...

On this basis the benefit of Gold gives you PER NIGHT:-

1. Phoneline, same as Silver so... Zilch

2. Room type, all hype... Zilch

3. 0.5 points per $. Purleeze, so pointless as to be... Zilch

4. 300 points on the room upgrades.

5. 1600 points per night for the exec lounge access

... EEO's I will return to in a mo'

At a total value of 1900 points per night you'll only have to stay 13 nights at FS Marriotts to pull back the value in upgrades and exec lounge benefits, AND whilst doing so you will earn 0.5 point per $ spent so at the average $170 per night that will in 13 nights gross you an extra 1105 points over Silver. Don't spend 'em all at once

Remember this relies on a lot of averaging and as always YMMV. On weekday stays you'll get more out the Exec lounge, but less chance of upgrades, at weekends the upgrades may be more frequent but the Exec lounge benefits may well be non-existent with no replacement vouchers. In reality this does become an EU-v-USA thing. Over here you'll get lounges open at weekends or free breakfast or free breakfast and minibar/bar vouchers, over in the USA less upgrades, less Exec lounge bennies, but "worry ye not" USA, for your moment in the sun is about to arrive...

Overall, I would say the 25,000 points is worth it if you'll stay more than 13 nights in the year at FS, which if you're in Europe I suspect you will. But its not worth it if you're in the USA AND your stays are mainly non FS brands, since without the Exec lounge benefit, the value largely disappears... Until we return to those EEO's...


6. For those staying in the USA ONLY at weekends... EEO's worth on 1 stay per quarter, on my cash conversion, 40,000 points per annum... But this doesn't need a rough cash conversion, we can take the points at their use, for hotel night stays. On that basis to buy that night with points as a reward stay would cost 25,000 points for just one EEO night at a category 5 hotel, thus getting your entire cost of Gold back in one EEO stay


A no-brainer here, if you're in USA and plan a weekend break the EEO's alone mean the Gold buyback is good value especially if you're the man I referred to above with 13 nights or more FS paid for stays who lives in the USA. In fact even if you just live in USA but take a lot of weekend breaks the buyback becomes stonking value...

The ideal customer for this offer... A USA resident with plenty of business in FS, a penchant for lots of weekend breaks, who vacations in Europe... Yes that one will certainly get fantastic value from the purchase.

BrightlyBob

So you're a Plat, busted down to Gold, but offered redemption, for *only* 40,000 points you can be a shiny Plat all over again BUT is it worth it? Well Plat is more difficult to value, mainly because the imponderables can be very helpful, but tough to value.

Lets examine the extra benefits...

1. 48 hour guaranteed availability. This is difficult to place a cash value against. What value do you place on staying in your hotel of choice? I used the override at least 4 or 5 times last year, every time I could have stayed elsewhere, a couple of times to another, slightly less convenient Marriott. On another couple of occasions to a different hotel chain. But this New Years Eve in Edinburgh, I used it to secure a Marriott room for £99 ($150) when the few quality hotels with inventory were looking for £200+ ^ I think all Plats would agree the 48 hour override can be very useful.

2. Platinum arrival Gift. A beer/ half bottle Merlot and some nuts, cost at the hotel minibar about $10. At some hotels the local choice can be a nice cheese platter or hot hors d'ouvres, and a better wine, value about $20. Not hungry or thirsty? Then 500 points, not a huge amount but Plats are regular stayers so they add up. As an arrival gift its not per night, the value you get out of it depends on whether your stays are long or short.

3. Extra 20% bonus points over Gold. Again, as with all the points bits, thats the easiest to value. Base points are 10 per $. Golds get an extra 25% - that's another 2.5points per $ and Plats get another 2.5 points over Gold, making 20% extra to Gold, 15 points per $.

So, to value the offerings

1. 48 hour availability. How to value this? Convenience must be worth something, lost points maybe, except in most cases I would have been able to stay at a different Marriott, or at IHG where I am also a PLT, though the scheme isn't as valuable nor the hotels (in UK, Holiday Inn/Express) as nice. Nonetheless I would have got points. Of course I saved £100 at New Year in Edinburgh, that's a direct benefit, but I suspect pretty exceptional. Overall I've decided to value it on the basis of 1 lost Marriott stay without points, 2 stays at my second choice and the loss in value there, plus an extra £50 ($75) for the exceptional Edinburgh-type experience. Taking the average cost for a FS at $170/night the points (inc PLT bonus) works out at 2500points for the lost stay, 1000 points per night for the lost value on the other 2 stays at IHG and, valuing points at 1UScent each 7500points for the saving at New Year. Total value 12,000 points ^

2. Platinum Arrival Gift. I take the points about half the time, the $10 worth most of the rest and get the really nice ones maybe 2/3 times a year. Here I do need to bear in mind that once my total night credit reaches 75 nights I regain Platinum. Taking into account credit card nights and assuming another double nights promo is on its way, I'd say 55 butt-in-bed nights would get to Plat in USA (if you have the card that credits you 15 nights), 60 in UK, or if you have the basic Marriott card in USA. Average, 58 nights. If I say a stay averages at 2.5 nights the we have 22 arrival gifts, 7 of which are worth $10 (1000 points), 3 at $20 (2000 points) and the other 12 at 500 points. Total value another 19,000 points. See, they do add up!!

3. 20% extra points above Gold, 2.5 points per $. Again we need to bear in mind that after an average of 58 nights you'll regain Platinum, but at an average of $170 FS per night this is an extra 425 points each night. However, unlike the previous calculations this total is going to take a long time to reach and regain status so we should mix it about a bit. Taking into account weekend stays at much reduced rates, use of EEO's etc and a little non FS rates, bearing in mind we're chasing 58 nights I'm going to reduce the rate to an average of $120 per night, thats 300 points extra. So in the 58 nights you need to get back to Plat you'll earn an extra 17,000 points.

Hence 12,000+19,000+17,000= 48,000 points.

This therefore turns out to be quite marginal, in terms of monetary/points value, you gain 8,000 points out of the transaction, but thats only if you achieve Platinum during the year AND experience an Edinburgh-like saving. If you dont get that then you lose 7500 points of value, meaning that its only worth it if you make Platinum during 2010...

Reversing the calculation, and using all the averages above you'll not break evens on the value unless you stay overnight at least 84% of 58 nights, that is to say 49 nights. And thats butt-in-bed, again assuming you have an Edinburgh experience, otherwise you wont breakeven unless you requalify for platinum in 2010, as above...

So this is very keenly priced by Marriott.

In conclusion, if you generally stay at non FS properties, its difficult to see this as being worthwhile especially as demand is lower so the guarantee less likely to be invoked, the arrival gifts are worth less and on the long stay brands points are halved.

If you always stay at FS at popular destinations, for only 1 or 2 nights per stay then its probably good value.

For those of us that mix and match a bit, but predominantly stay at FS, its marginal.

But for some the status of Platinum and the reassurance of the 48 hour availability may well make it all worth it on its own...

NJUPINTHEAIR

Brightly, thanks for the analysis.

I'll add my comments because I exercised the buy-back provison for Gold. I'm basically a leisure traveller now and so I am unsure how much I will stay at Marriott, at all, let alone on weekends in the US, where lounge access is generally non-existent.

I should add, however, that I am flush with points so 25,000 is not very much to me when considering my overall haul.

That said, I do not disagree with you that valuing MR points at approx. 1 cent per point is not without reason -- the value Brightly has ascribed to them -- and I often go by this figure when thinking about redemptions.

However, I should add that if one is contemplating using their points or staying at a hotel outside of the US with a reportedly well regarded Concierge lounge, then the cost may very well be justified on such trips, alone, regardless of whether you plan to spend time in the US properties.

In my case, I am going to stay 8 nights at the Berlin Marriott and have at least one additional reward night scheduled at a hotel in Japan.

I have seen reports that a space available upgrade to the Concierge Floor at the Berlin Marriott at the front desk runs for about 50 Euros per night. Putting aside whether this is worth the price or not, if I were to exercise such an option, the oop cost to me would exceed over $500 = thus making the buyback worthwhile.

Even if the lounge access at the hotel does not live up to its hype, inasmuch as I am flush with points -- and I have no idea what the future may hold for my travel plans = I might actually travel more than I now anticpate, the Gold buy back pomotion is one well worth exercising in my situation -- and perhaps, for you, as well!

PS -- I agree that Silver is not worth it, unless of course, you know that you have an extended trip coming up and the extra points you would earn would offset the cost in points to exercise the buyback = which is doubtful.

With respect to Platinum, I would say know, unless you intend to stay at a property that has a good reputation for upgrading you to a suite -- at the time you intend to travel. If so, then yes -- if not, then, I think it is a judgment call -- does the extra 15,000 points equal the amount of points you could earn as a Platinum? If so, or if likely, then yes, otherwise, no.

bk3day

Another big +1 on the thanks for the Buy Back breakdown BrightlyBob ^

I too am leaning towards the Gold buyback (w/partial point buy) with the EEOs being the biggest draw as my upgrades and lounge access (somewhat spotty record on finding either- not to mention if available- are even worthwhile) a close 2nd.

What gives me pause is iirc, EEO BOGO certs are transferable to non-Plats/Golds.

Am I correct and if so, how does that work?

Must your Elite friend who gives you the cert also make your booking?

Under whose MR #?

Finally, 2 additional data points.

US members can get the MR Signature credit card that gives automatic Silver and a free Cat5 night/year for an annual fee that's less than the buyback.

Gold & Plat members also get slightly higher promo/sometimes easier too achieve bonus offers which aren't much but should still factor a bit into the overall equation.