jugaadkabaap

Why cant be a SPG Amex UK card? I am sorry i am not getting the question. For amex& marriott - the Annual Fee and the benefits given by the card makes sense in their books - so they issue the card.

You would had observed that many CC closed in the UK in the last 2 years and almost every card reduced its earning rate or reduced benefits.

joakgarp

Yep without the 15 elite nights for no reason. That's why this thread was created smarty pants.
There's also a Japanese version from Amex without the Elite nights as well. I'm pretty sure Japan has equal intercharge rates as in the US
https://www.americanexpress.com/jp/c...ed-guest-card/

jugaadkabaap

How can you affirm it is for "no reason" - without knowing the revenue vs cost analysis. They would had done those and made a decision.

In a cobranded card - the brand (say Marriott) allows the issuer to use that brand and also provide brand specific benefits in return of some $ or/ and percentage of interchange fee + annual fees etc.

In certain markets the brand feels like it cannot provide such benefits due to cost vs gain ratio. And thus it excludes specific benefits.

In this case - the Japanese card comes at circa 310 USD fees = 240 GBP Annual Fee. And because of that it provides a 50K certificate and if my google translate is correct - it does provide 5 EQN on anniversary (under "Faster acquisition of Platinum Elite") . I don't speak or read or write japanese - so spare me from translation mistakes.

I am guessing because of the high Annual Fee & interchange & also consumer market (volume) - the card offers these benefits where as the UK card is just 75 GBP if i remember correctly.

crimsona

To answer your question. It is not fair.

Amex US Hilton Aspire cardholders get Diamond straight up without any nights needed. If anything, that's even more unfair.

jugaadkabaap

As much as I agree, I wont complain - only reason I am keeping that card even as someone based in Canada. At the same time, it is one of the most rewarding CC across the spectrum - a really good package.

EuropeanPete

Inter-change fees are only part of the profitability equation for card companies. The bigger opportunity is still people who don’t clear their debt at the end of the month.

In the EU there are some limited miles based credit cards in some countries, but the earning rates are a fraction of US ones, lack generous freebies like free elite nights and don’t come with massive joining bonuses. It’s just a factor of the current US credit boom.

kaizen7

I believe target market also plays role here.

US pretty much where majority of Marriott hotels located and most of the Bonvoy members are based in US.

It just like why Singapore Airlines only offer co branded cards in Singapore, Indonesia, Japan, Malaysia, and Philipines.
Even though they do fly to US and US based peoples can apply for Krisflyer membership.

joakgarp

I think what annoys most of us internationals here is the double messages and especially from GMs at different properties. We hear stories for a long time there are too many plats, titaniums etc and it's difficult to handle these many Elites on a daily basis. Some days ago we find out reward events 10 nights/year is being taken away to decrease amount of elites or making it even more difficult (used often by a few FT-internationals as no CC with generous elite nights is not available). Makes me confused, if Marriott wants to decrease number of elites then simply don't offer 15 elite nights for free in the NA-market and let everyone fight for each night. Not as generous as Hilton of course with giving away Diamond lol with Aspire CC.

Best solution is, and something I hope Amex is working on, is a better deal for Amex Plats and start to include 15 elite nights for all Amex Platinum cards instead of just giving away worthless Bonvoy Gold for free. Marriott Gold was great from 2017 and back but not in 2018 and forward. That's the easiest solution to everything and it's possible to get Amex Platinum almost in any well developed country in the world. If internationals wants to spend 35 nights extra with Marriott they get Platinum.
Obviously Marriott won't cancel their CC business in NA as there is money to be made.

Another solution is to offer double or triple night promotions more often to internationals. Have had it once every year which has personally helped me secure Titanium.

EuropeanPete

While true, the US loyalty schemes remain the most popular in Europe (ok, Accor is a larger chain) and so from a Marriott standpoint Europe is not that important (Especially with the shift of growth to Asia), but from a Europe standpoint Marriott is the program frequent travelers would by default have gone to.

lost_in_translation

I think the correct way to think about this is Marriott status in the US is close to worthless a lot of the time, therefore Marriott has decided to offer a route to make it easier so that those who wouldn't otherwise bother decide it could be worthwhile. Yes, it's harder to earn status in Europe or Asia, but at the end of the day it's so much more valuable to hold status in Europe and, in particular, Asia that this goes a long way to explaining the discrepancy. Of course, this means that those lucky individuals with US residency who spend most of their nights abroad are unfairly advantaged, but that accounts for a pretty small minority of members, I imagine.

As unfair as Marriott giving away free nights to US residents is, I'd much rather this than e.g. Hilton who give away Diamond for free with a credit card fee, which truly devalues HHonors status entirely. At least those who get the credit card nights with Marriott still have to put in quite a few nights to make a worthwhile status level (and quite a lot of spend to make Ambassador).

justned

It is totally fair. Asian/EU Marriott properties when I stay at a cat 3-4, the equivalent level of hard and soft product in the U.S is a cat 5-6+. We typically pay more for less. And in the U.S. status doesn't mean much either , I'd rather have breakfast in any Asian/EU Marriott than the U.S. . That 15 nights credit just levels the playing field by a bit. I feel the same way about Hyatt.

Cathay Dragon 666

To be honest, business is never about fairness but maximizing revenue/profit. This is like whining "Is it fair St. Regis Chengdu only charges $200 USD a night but New York charges $800 USD a night", we all know why there's a differentiation in pricing. Same goes for promotions. It has to be based on local competition, market share, value appreciation, etc. So that's one reason. Another reason is legal. Remember in other regions the local laws could prohibit a business to be too aggressive in promotions, to protect competing local businesses. Many people forget about that when comparing corporate strategy around the world.

It's business, not fairness.

Cathay Dragon 666

Many China's "secondary cities" only have Four Points or Courtyard, but most often than not they are better than Sheraton/Marriott back home in the States. Most Sheratons/Marriott in China can blow luxury brand away. And at half or even a quarter of the price.

Vince Chan

I am glad at least Marriott builds international hotel with higher standard/ quality with better elite recognition vs those dumps in the US.

if one day they starting giving Platinum for free like Hilton did with Amex for absolutely no reason anyone can get diamond without stay , I will immediately leave.

Vince Chan

exactly. World of Hyatt credit card only giving 5 night credits, while marriott giving 15N for free, while UK and Japan SPG card got nothing, doesn't make any sense.