Washington DC Attorney General sues Marriott over "deceptive resort fees"
Jul 12, 2019, 8:33 pm
#91
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Some of the 'amenities' are insulting: a coupon book? Bottles of Pepsi water? Access to the pool? I agree that if properties added real value there would be less backlash and anger about these fees.
Perhaps even a choice of packages:
Resort Package A (maybe more business focused): parking, Enhanced Wifi, several pages of printer use, item pressed or cleaned, etc.
Resort Package B: maybe more for a family
Resort Package C: maybe includes almost everything you'd need
Perhaps even a choice of packages:
Resort Package A (maybe more business focused): parking, Enhanced Wifi, several pages of printer use, item pressed or cleaned, etc.
Resort Package B: maybe more for a family
Resort Package C: maybe includes almost everything you'd need
Jul 12, 2019, 10:09 pm
#92
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I made the decision years ago, when resort fees first appeared - I NEVER spend a penny beyond my room charges at a hotel that imposes a resort fee. No dining, no spa, no sundries, no pool-side anything. My own little protest. Works for me. If most guests cut back on ancillary spending the hotel operators would notice.
What's more, I would object to resort fees which are calculated as a percentage of the base rate on principle. If the hotel is providing services for which it wants to recover the cost, then recover the cost. Percentage-based resort fees just make their fundamental deceptive purpose more obvious.
Jul 12, 2019, 10:16 pm
#93
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This is why the principle is illegal in most developed countries.
Jul 13, 2019, 12:58 am
#94
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I think you’re missing the single most important part of consumer protection regulations around pricing in the 21st century: a large majority of price discovery is done in various forms of price comparison websites (whether a booking.com, a corporate portal or even the Marriott website) and it is here where the hotel owners get by far the largest benefit from resort fees: it makes a hotel look cheaper than it actually is.
This is why the principle is illegal in most developed countries.
I am very much in support of all-in pricing like Europe and Australia. However, simply adding a resort fee to a room rate (which is impossible to do if the resort fee isn't static) and displaying that in a search result still doesn't give you the full picture unless all taxes from all levels of government are also included for all-inclusive pricing.
I have already illustrated that two properties in two adjacent municipalities with two different tax structures can vary greatly in total cost on similar rooms with identical rates. The property that has a favourable tax structure could add a resort fee and still be cheaper while the other is disadvantaged. I care more about the bottom line and don't really care how they slice and dice it. That information is available if one chooses to use it.
Until all travel providers show all-inclusive pricing for hotels everywhere the rates will always show cheaper than the actual cost if there is a resort fee or not.
Tip: For visitors staying 59 days or less in Chile they are exempt from taxes so the price you see is the price you pay.
James
Jul 13, 2019, 7:55 am
#95
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Not at all! You are missing my point. If someone is shocked to learn about a resort fee at check-out then they haven't done their homework. Full stop! It isn't hidden. Full stop! It amazes me that people make mistakes, cry victim, shift blame elsewhere and others jump in to support them.
I can book the Westin New York Times Square in a major corporate travel portal and *never* see that it has a $30 resort fee until I'm receiving an email receipt after the stay is over.
I can book it on Marriott.com and see its rate listed directly next to properties that have no resort fee, and there is no notation that the Westin has a resort fee. I'm shown a rate on the front page that simply does not exist at all. For tonight, the search result says $370. The reality is that it's $400, at a minimum.
This is fraud. Purposeful fraud, and the hotels know exactly what they are doing. Nobody's ever answered the question: what would be a non-fraud, legitimate reason for these kinds of fees to exist? There is none.
If you want to build a straw man about government taxes, go for it. I'd actually be quite happy to see all the taxes and fees in the original rate. But I recognize that this is harder to do, and I recognize that there is no ill intent on the part of Marriott by showing the taxes later in the booking process. But hey, if you want to lead that charge, go for it...
I remember posting somewhere a bit of a facetious example - why not make the room rate close to zero and charge a high resort fee? Someone responded: that's exactly what they do in Vegas. The resort fee is often greater than the posted room rate! It what world do people see this as fair, reasonable, just, and with any kind of purpose other than deception?
Jul 13, 2019, 9:27 am
#96
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I fear we are talking at cross purposes here. I am simply explaining to you why this practice is illegal in many countries and why even in the US a similar practice is illegal for airlines in the US. It is self-evidently impossible to "do one's homework" on 100 hotels when looking for choosing one at the right price point, which is why very few people ever complain that governments enforce price transparency. As I have noted before, market transparency is one of the basic foundations of classical economic theory of a free market, and so even people generally dismissive of any form of consumer protection should be in favour of this one.
Jul 13, 2019, 9:42 am
#98
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The entire city of Las Vegas is basd on corruption and deception.
Jul 13, 2019, 9:47 am
#99
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That’s why this isn’t allowed in most developed countries either. Having said that, it’s obviously much less important than resort fees from a price discovery perspective as taxes tend to impact all rooms equally (or at least proportionally). The customer would still see the accurate relative pricing of their choice of rooms instead of the deception they will see now.
Jul 13, 2019, 9:49 am
#100
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Local municipal taxes (the so-called tourist taxes) are almost always never included in the rate and in several European countries (Spain and, not as often, the UK) even the VAT is usually not included. And in Asia it is not uncommon for the 10% service charge to be missing from the shown rate.
Jul 13, 2019, 10:25 am
#102
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I can book the Westin New York Times Square in a major corporate travel portal and *never* see that it has a $30 resort fee until I'm receiving an email receipt after the stay is over.
I can book it on Marriott.com and see its rate listed directly next to properties that have no resort fee, and there is no notation that the Westin has a resort fee. I'm shown a rate on the front page that simply does not exist at all. For tonight, the search result says $370. The reality is that it's $400, at a minimum.
I can book it on Marriott.com and see its rate listed directly next to properties that have no resort fee, and there is no notation that the Westin has a resort fee. I'm shown a rate on the front page that simply does not exist at all. For tonight, the search result says $370. The reality is that it's $400, at a minimum.
One-Click, Destination Charge disclosed. In this case it includes a $30 F&B credit.
Breakfast rate on Booking.com. $439 + $102.68 taxes & charges.
If you want to build a straw man about government taxes, go for it. I'd actually be quite happy to see all the taxes and fees in the original rate. But I recognize that this is harder to do, and I recognize that there is no ill intent on the part of Marriott by showing the taxes later in the booking process. But hey, if you want to lead that charge, go for it...
Seriously? Why is it harder to do? For Marriott it is just a matter of calculating the taxes and adding it to the room rate on the front page rather than listing them at check-out. Booking.com already does it and shows the additional taxes and charges below the rate. In the case of the Westin example the $102.68 additional taxes and charges includes the resort fee which is disclosed before purchase. If booking.com added the fees and charges to the room rate you would have an all-inclusive price. It is actually more difficult with resort fees. Percentage based resort fees can't be determined until a room rate is selected.I am all for a flag that the property listed in the front page on Marriott charges a resort fee. An optional filter to remove those properties could be implemented too.
Millions of airfares are changing daily yet when I query a fare the price I see includes all taxes and other fees. It isn't uncommon to have a dozen or more charges included in the final price. It isn't difficult at all.
I remember posting somewhere a bit of a facetious example - why not make the room rate close to zero and charge a high resort fee? Someone responded: that's exactly what they do in Vegas. The resort fee is often greater than the posted room rate! It what world do people see this as fair, reasonable, just, and with any kind of purpose other than deception?
Vegas is a totally different market where supply and demand can see a room rate swing from $40 to $600 or more. The resort fee included in the taxes and charges total below the room rate is disclosed on booking.com on the front page, how is that deceptive? Do you need someone to add the two together for you?
James
Jul 13, 2019, 10:46 am
#103
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It didn't used to be that way until the laws were changed. Similar laws should apply to hotels. There is absolutely no reason to allow deceptive advertising and search manipulation.
Jul 13, 2019, 10:59 am
#104
Join Date: Aug 2018
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That’s why this isn’t allowed in most developed countries either. Having said that, it’s obviously much less important than resort fees from a price discovery perspective as taxes tend to impact all rooms equally (or at least proportionally). The customer would still see the accurate relative pricing of their choice of rooms instead of the deception they will see now.
How is it that a flat rate local tourist tax (EUR 10 per person/night in VCE or EUR 4.50 person/night in PAR) “tend[s] to impact all rooms equally or at least proportionally” and doesn’t impair the ability for the customer to “see the accurate relative pricing of their choice of rooms” but a flat resort fee (say USD 20 per room/night) doesn’t have the same effect?
Jul 13, 2019, 11:06 am
#105
Join Date: Aug 2018
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That is indeed an issue that OP should raise with his/her corporate travel portal, not with Marriott. It appears the travel portal is the one perpetrating the fraud on consumers by hiding the resort fees that Marriott and all other OTAs clearly disclose.