Mar 24, 2015, 6:09 am
Last edit by: irishguy28
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4U9525 Moderator team: totti, oliver2002, NewbieRunner, starflyergold, DownUnderFlyer, cblaisd, TWA884
============================================
Germanwings Flight 4U 9525 (Barcelona - Dusseldorf) crashed on 24 March 2015, coming down in the Alps near Barcelonette France
Aircraft involved is Airbus A320 reg D-AIPX. It was delivered to Lufthansa in 1991 and passed to Germanwings in 2001. It received routine maintenance at DUS the day before the crash (performed by Lufthansa Technik) and had its last major overhaul ( C-Check) in the summer of 2013. Lufthansa have said the plane was in 'perfect' condition.
Circumstances
It is very likely that the aircraft was deliberately crashed by the co-pilot Andreas Lubwitz
As per Germanwings press conference held 1400 on 24th March:
The aircraft flew from DUS to BCN on the morning of the crash
The flight left BCN at 1001 local time, it reached crusing altitude of 38000 at 1045 but remained there for only one minute before beginning a descent which lasted 8 minutes and ended in the crash.
ATC permission was not asked for the descent and it is unclear whether or not the crew were in ATC contact and under what circumstances an emergency was declared.
Subsequent reports suggest there was no communication between the crew and ATC after the aircraft began to descend.
The weather was good at the time of the crash:
Surface weather near where they started the descent:
METAR LFTH 240800Z AUTO 07012KT 9999 NSC 15/08 Q1008
METAR LFTH 240830Z AUTO 07012KT 9999 NSC 15/09 Q1008
METAR LFTH 240900Z AUTO 08016KT 9999 FEW035 SCT130 15/08 Q1008
That's basically unrestricted visibility at the surface.
Posted by Captainmiles Post #156 in this thread
US govt sources say no evidence of terrorism (reported on sky news uk)
Germanwings/Lufthansa official response
Germanwings press conference announced for 1500 local time, to be held in Cologne
Press conference reports: Lufthansa group employees enroute to crash site, families of victims being informed, crisis center set up at DUS airport
New flight number have been announced
4U9440 DUS0645 – 0855BCN EQV
4U9441 BCN0935 – 1155DUS EQV
Relatives of victims have been transported to the crash area by Lufthansa
Lufthansa press conference held at 1330 GMT on 26 March stated that the plane was most likely brought down deliberately by the co-pilot.
Video recording of the press conference (26 March):
In German
In English (simultaneous translation)
Victims
Latest reports are 144 passengers and 6 crew aboard, Spanish government report 45 Spanish nationals, French government reports 0 French nationals, German government reports there are some German victims but numbers not known (German wings press conference reports 67), Sky News UK reports Turkish nationals on board. There were 2 babies, one of the belonging to a woman from Manchester and the other is German, the child of opera singer Maria Radner who was travelling on the flight with her husband.
Two of the victims were Australians - a mother and her adult son from Victoria.
Two victims from Argentina
Three from Great Britain
One Israeli
Two Colombians
One Belgian
One Dutch
Two Iranians
Three Americans
Two Japanese
Three Mexicans
The German victims include 16 pupils and 2 teachers from Joseph Koenig Gymnasium (high school) at Haltern Am See, they were returning from an exchange visit to Spain.
Crew comprised 4 cabin crew and 2 flight deck. The captain had been with Lufthansa group for 10 years and had over 6000 hours on this plane type.
The co-pilot is widely reported to have joined Germanwings straight out of training in 2013 and to have had 630 hours of experience.
French rescue services believe there are no survivors.
Emergency contact numbers
From Germany 0800 1133 5577
From Spain 902 400 012
0049 30 5000 3000
The names of the victims will be published once their families have been informed.
Crash site
The crash site has been identified by helicopters, it is not accessible by road and is around 2 and a half hours walk from the nearest road (reported Sky News UK). It is at an altitude of around 2000m. Search and rescue teams are en-route. There may be an avalanche risk which could hamper rescue efforts. Rescuers are assembling at Seyne-Les-Alpes.
Sky news UK are reporting that a helicopter has landed near the crash site. They have confirmed no survivors and have reported the largest piece of debris to be about car sized. The debris field is about 200 square meters in size. See also http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/24557269-post183.html
Investigation - confirmed information
Large numbers of French investigators are on site, efforts have been made to secure the site against outside interference.
The cockpit voice recorder (CVR) has been recovered and taken for investigation at French BEA. It is damaged but functional. Voices can be heard on the recording but it is unclear if they are those of the flight crew.
BEA is working in cooperation with German BFU (Bundesstelle für Flugunfalluntersuchung), Airbus and CFM.
The aircraft was complete until impact - there was no midair breakup
"Germanwings Pilot Was Locked Out of Cockpit Before Crash in France"
New York Times reports that one of the two pilots was locked out of the cockpit during the descent: “You can hear he is trying to smash the door down.” http://nyti.ms/1HC7g9i
French prosecuters believe that the crash was caused by the deliberate actions of the co-pilot, he is thought to have locked the captain out of the cockpit and then to have deliberately crashed the aircraft.
Video of cockpit operation and manual override switch to block door from being opened externally. From The Guardian.
A locked door is opened by a flight crew inside the cockpit but can also be unlocked by cabin crew entering a keycode from the outside. Crew inside the cockpit can manually override it to keep a door locked for up to five minutes.
On 6 May 2015, the BEA released its preliminary report.
Reliable Sources
AV Herald page on the crash.
FlightRadar24 flight path map
flightware tracking log
BBC News "What we know so far"
Germanwings / 4U 9525 A320 Alpine plane crash 24 Mar 2015
Mar 24, 2015, 1:30 pm
#241
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While the cause is of interest to anyone involved in aviation, I'm sure all of our thoughts and prayers for those so inclined are with the families and other loved ones of the victims of this tragedy.
Mar 24, 2015, 1:36 pm
#242
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 193
Do pilots receive exposure to sudden decompression as part of their training?
Which at 38,000 feet is most of your useful consciousness time gone!
http://www.theairlinepilots.com/foru...andhypoxia.php Do read the footnotes!
I have been trying to track down the research discussed there but no luck so far.
Which at 38,000 feet is most of your useful consciousness time gone!
http://www.theairlinepilots.com/foru...andhypoxia.php Do read the footnotes!
I have been trying to track down the research discussed there but no luck so far.
If that did happen, I can't imagine the descent being as consistent as this one was.
I have absolutely no idea what caused this crash nor will I start guessing, but I'll be very surprised if it was due to a sudden decompression. Either the pilots were consciuos and able to fly, in which case why fly into a mountain. Or they were unconscious, in which case the consistent rate of descent doesn't really seem plausible.
Mar 24, 2015, 1:39 pm
#243
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Mar 24, 2015, 1:40 pm
#244
Join Date: Sep 2012
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Not that I'm aware off. But there are some cases the other way around. So, quite some flights where landed save and sound after an explosive decompression.
Mar 24, 2015, 1:43 pm
#246
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Berlin
Posts: 1,765
You probably want to look into Helios 522: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helios_Airways_Flight_522
Mar 24, 2015, 1:43 pm
#247
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I have absolutely no idea what caused this crash nor will I start guessing, but I'll be very surprised if it was due to a sudden decompression. Either the pilots were consciuos and able to fly, in which case why fly into a mountain. Or they were unconscious, in which case the consistent rate of descent doesn't really seem plausible.
Mar 24, 2015, 1:53 pm
#248
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As is usual in tragic circumstances like this Germanwings have retired the flight number.
New numbers:
4U9440 DUS0645 – 0855BCN EQV
4U9441 BCN0935 – 1155DUS EQV
New numbers:
4U9440 DUS0645 – 0855BCN EQV
4U9441 BCN0935 – 1155DUS EQV
Mar 24, 2015, 2:02 pm
#249
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According to Spiegel Online several crews from Germanwings and Lufthansa are refusing to fly A320s. Apparently the crashed plane was on the ground for several hours with technical difficulties on Monday, the crews are refusing to fly because of security concerns, the article states.
Mar 24, 2015, 2:04 pm
#251
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According to Spiegel Online several crews from Germanwings and Lufthansa are refusing to fly A320s. Apparently the crashed plane was on the ground for several hours with technical difficulties on Monday, the crews are refusing to fly because of security concerns, the article states.
http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/unt...a-1025378.html
Mar 24, 2015, 2:17 pm
#253
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Obviously, we will have to wait for the flight recorders and their data to know more...
According to Spiegel Online several crews from Germanwings and Lufthansa are refusing to fly A320s. Apparently the crashed plane was on the ground for several hours with technical difficulties on Monday, the crews are refusing to fly because of security concerns, the article states.
Google's machine translation of a key portion of the article:
Originally Posted by article
Background for the refusal of several pilots receive their service in the cockpit, apparently, is the fact that the machine has been accident yesterday hour in the so-called AOG mode ("Aircraft on Ground") in Dusseldorf on the ground - because of technical problems. There had been a "problem of the 'Nose Landing Door' ', Lufthansa confirmed.
The "Nose Landing Door" is the door that opens and closes the fuselage when the nose wheel raus and is purely down. "This issue but had been completely resolved, so that the airplane for 10 clock morning in regular flight service was traveling yesterday," said Lufthansa spokesman.
The "Nose Landing Door" is the door that opens and closes the fuselage when the nose wheel raus and is purely down. "This issue but had been completely resolved, so that the airplane for 10 clock morning in regular flight service was traveling yesterday," said Lufthansa spokesman.
Mar 24, 2015, 2:23 pm
#255
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: AGH
Posts: 5,985
In German there is just one word "Sicherheit" which can mean safety or security. Anyway, I don't agree that the crews won't fly due to safety conerns. That is what SPON is arguing based on the cancelled flights and the airliner in maintenance before - or what they think they understood from the situation. SPON journalism... Perhaps it is true but I guess they are just emotionally not fit to fly. Just swapping in different crews is also not easy.
Last edited by fassy; Mar 24, 2015 at 2:40 pm