00:39 "...now that Lan is likely to exit its alliance"!!?
Jun 12, 2012, 6:25 pm
#1
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00:39 "...now that Lan is likely to exit its alliance"!!?
I was shocked to hear that Lan is likely to exit its alliance @ 00:39
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/94413...1b-merger.html
I guess MarkXS was right? Post #37
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/star-...l#post18656176
http://www.bloomberg.com/video/94413...1b-merger.html
I guess MarkXS was right? Post #37
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/star-...l#post18656176
Jun 13, 2012, 7:37 am
#3
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The keyword here is "if". This Bloomberg article suggests that no decision has been announced:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...ap-appeal.html
While TAP’S routes to Brazil might be especially attractive should Lan Airlines SA of Chile quit IAG’s Oneworld alliance after merging with Sao Paulo-based Tam SA, a member of the rival Star group, Walsh’s acquisition of U.K.-based BMI from Deutsche Lufthansa AG (LHA) means he now has the slots needed to add flights to growth markets direct from his company’s London Heathrow hub
Jun 19, 2012, 12:25 am
#6
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What LATAM would want is better connectivity to the rest of the world, both from South America and via North America. Oneworld is an increasingly shaky alliance of failing carriers and those on peripheries of the action: Siberia, Finland, Spain.
Oneworld: Nobody in Africa. Only a very weakened American in North America, just the USA part of it, with no route network in Canada or Mexico. Only one carrier in Asia. European carriers in the worst connecting hub (by hassle and cost), and on the periphery (IB, Finnair).
Compare to what they get in Star, even assuming US buys AA and AA/US is in oneword so US exits Star: TAP, LH, LX from South America to Europe. South African from South America to Africa. United and Air Canada in North America, both who do provide decent lift into LATAM hubs in LIM, BOG, SCL, EZE, GRU, GIG as well as their North American extensive network. UA's huge Mexico and central american route network gained from CO. Copa's network. Far more choices from the Americas to Asia, with the North American carriers and with Asiana, Thai, Singapore. Air New Zealand pretty much swaps for QANTAS for Australasia. United's Micronesia network inheirited from Continental Mike.
Only problem: arranging to keep AviancaTaca Group from joining Star. So far, they haven't joined Star. Hmm, wonder what the delay is?
Again, I could be utterly wrong. But Star management has talked about recruiting LAN, LAN has talked about "making a decision as to which alliance" rather than coming out and saying "of course we have to bring TAM into oneworld because Chile won't allow us to join Star." And it's 2.5 months overdue for AviancaTaca to join Star. And AV/TA did a huge deal with Skyteam's Aeromexico 1 week before AV/TA was supposed to join Star.
Jun 19, 2012, 3:05 am
#7
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BA affiliate Comair is in Africa. Oneworld does have someone in Africa. Their problem is the amount of the continent covered, not lack of a current member.
AA is not "weakened". They have heaps of cash on hand and are more then capable of exiting Chapter 11 intact and well positioned. AA has a cost problem, not a revenue problem. They are not about to disappear or become drastically smaller
MX is still on the books and still has a chance of being revived. Oneworld serves most major cities in Canada. Their problem is domestic flights. Something that can be easily solved.
Two carriers in Asia (CX, JL) with two more joining (MH, UL).
Oneworld European hubs, LHR, MAD, HEL, BER, DUS, AMM, DME. They have hubs surrounding Europe and two hubs in the middle of Europe. Looking at the route maps, Oneworld probably has a better network in Europe then Star does.
Sure... a 4 million person market vs a 22 million market.
There is no delay. Star has always said mid 2012 for AviancaTaca joining the alliance. The April date was unofficial and nothing more then rumor.
LAN leaving oneworld has about the same chances of happening as VS being sold to BA.
Only a very weakened American in North America, just the USA part of it,
with no route network in Canada or Mexico.
Only one carrier in Asia.
European carriers in the worst connecting hub (by hassle and cost), and on the periphery (IB, Finnair).
Air New Zealand pretty much swaps for QANTAS for Australasia.
Only problem: arranging to keep AviancaTaca Group from joining Star. So far, they haven't joined Star. Hmm, wonder what the delay is?
LAN leaving oneworld has about the same chances of happening as VS being sold to BA.
Jun 19, 2012, 6:07 am
#8
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Jun 19, 2012, 6:18 am
#9
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Simple. Because LAN is the best South American carrier, and will get even better with TAM added. LAN doesn't need AA lift to South America. They have huge amounts of their own lift from North America to South America. Now with all of TAM's flights from NYC, MCO, MIA. And LAN Colombia improving their Central America and northern South America connections.
What LATAM would want is better connectivity to the rest of the world, both from South America and via North America. Oneworld is an increasingly shaky alliance of failing carriers and those on peripheries of the action: Siberia, Finland, Spain.
Oneworld: Nobody in Africa. Only a very weakened American in North America, just the USA part of it, with no route network in Canada or Mexico. Only one carrier in Asia. European carriers in the worst connecting hub (by hassle and cost), and on the periphery (IB, Finnair).
Compare to what they get in Star, even assuming US buys AA and AA/US is in oneword so US exits Star: TAP, LH, LX from South America to Europe. South African from South America to Africa. United and Air Canada in North America, both who do provide decent lift into LATAM hubs in LIM, BOG, SCL, EZE, GRU, GIG as well as their North American extensive network. UA's huge Mexico and central american route network gained from CO. Copa's network. Far more choices from the Americas to Asia, with the North American carriers and with Asiana, Thai, Singapore. Air New Zealand pretty much swaps for QANTAS for Australasia. United's Micronesia network inheirited from Continental Mike.
Only problem: arranging to keep AviancaTaca Group from joining Star. So far, they haven't joined Star. Hmm, wonder what the delay is?
Again, I could be utterly wrong. But Star management has talked about recruiting LAN, LAN has talked about "making a decision as to which alliance" rather than coming out and saying "of course we have to bring TAM into oneworld because Chile won't allow us to join Star." And it's 2.5 months overdue for AviancaTaca to join Star. And AV/TA did a huge deal with Skyteam's Aeromexico 1 week before AV/TA was supposed to join Star.
What LATAM would want is better connectivity to the rest of the world, both from South America and via North America. Oneworld is an increasingly shaky alliance of failing carriers and those on peripheries of the action: Siberia, Finland, Spain.
Oneworld: Nobody in Africa. Only a very weakened American in North America, just the USA part of it, with no route network in Canada or Mexico. Only one carrier in Asia. European carriers in the worst connecting hub (by hassle and cost), and on the periphery (IB, Finnair).
Compare to what they get in Star, even assuming US buys AA and AA/US is in oneword so US exits Star: TAP, LH, LX from South America to Europe. South African from South America to Africa. United and Air Canada in North America, both who do provide decent lift into LATAM hubs in LIM, BOG, SCL, EZE, GRU, GIG as well as their North American extensive network. UA's huge Mexico and central american route network gained from CO. Copa's network. Far more choices from the Americas to Asia, with the North American carriers and with Asiana, Thai, Singapore. Air New Zealand pretty much swaps for QANTAS for Australasia. United's Micronesia network inheirited from Continental Mike.
Only problem: arranging to keep AviancaTaca Group from joining Star. So far, they haven't joined Star. Hmm, wonder what the delay is?
Again, I could be utterly wrong. But Star management has talked about recruiting LAN, LAN has talked about "making a decision as to which alliance" rather than coming out and saying "of course we have to bring TAM into oneworld because Chile won't allow us to join Star." And it's 2.5 months overdue for AviancaTaca to join Star. And AV/TA did a huge deal with Skyteam's Aeromexico 1 week before AV/TA was supposed to join Star.
Jun 19, 2012, 12:18 pm
#10
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Anything can happen. I will not be surprised. LATAM is the perfect fit to oneworld. But I think the south american business can be tricky. If LATAM decide to switch to star (I mean if). I will not be surprised to see IAG spending a fortune to bid on TAP.
Then again I would not be surprised to see TAM remain in star while LAN in oneworld just like Air China and Cathay Pacific.
Nothing is impossible.
Then again I would not be surprised to see TAM remain in star while LAN in oneworld just like Air China and Cathay Pacific.
Nothing is impossible.
Jun 19, 2012, 1:39 pm
#11
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That would be impossible, because the antitrust authorities in Chile have said that LATAM will have to choose an alliance, as in one alliance, and it can't the the one with AV.
Jun 19, 2012, 4:19 pm
#12
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Or is LATAM seriously considering SkyTeam? Or is LATAM seriously thinking that AV will fail to go into Star Alliance after all?
It would seem only if one and/or the other of those were the case that they could be considering anything other than OneWorld, right?
Jun 19, 2012, 4:34 pm
#13
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 71
I Just saw online that Avianca now has an A320 in Star Alliance Livery considering the anti-trust agreement that means TAM has to leave Star Alliance since the merger with LAN according the the Chile Anti-trust agreement the rumours are now that Copa and Avianca-Taca are both joining star Alliance now tomorrow. http://www.lockonaviation.net/html/s...to.php?id=7757 heres the link to the photo of Avianca in Star Alliance livery
Jun 19, 2012, 4:57 pm
#14
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LATAM, as an entity, should be in existence within a matter of days.
Jun 20, 2012, 6:50 pm
#15
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But with its single alliance official when?
(Until then, it makes it sounds like they're considering SkyTeam, since that seems the only legal option besides oneworld, and if not considering SkyTeam and thus committed to oneworld, why not announce it officially already?
)
(Until then, it makes it sounds like they're considering SkyTeam, since that seems the only legal option besides oneworld, and if not considering SkyTeam and thus committed to oneworld, why not announce it officially already?
)