AMS to NWI via.... Belgrade??
Nov 22, 2008, 6:36 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 7,560
AMS to NWI via.... Belgrade??
Well, that's the explanation that was (jokingly) offered by one of my fellow passengers here at NWI.
I am one of the increasingly frustrated passengers waiting for the combined KL1506 and KL1508 - I am booked on KL1508 so my problems aren't anywhere near as great as those of some of my fellow passengers.
KL1506 was cancelled.
Just before the scheduled departure time of KL1508 (1240) they announced an "indefinite" delay... and then left us completely in the dark from then on. Some of us decided to track our inbound flight on the Schiphol web site, where the departure information screen went from "Gate closed" at 1301 to "Departed" at 1310 (Dutch time - i.e., 1210 UK time). Still no information from the airport here.
Come 1300 several of us went to the window and started looking up the approach - even in the worst-case scenario (i.e., with a Polderbaan departure) the aircraft should have been here by then. But... nothing. And still no official information - just the "wait in lounge" message on the board.
Then, about ten minutes ago, we were told that the aircraft had just left and was due to land at 1400 UK time... that's when one of my fellow passengers made his remark about "via Belgrade".
Anyway, it's just landed (20 minutes earlier than they told us it would) so I'd better go.
Does anyone have any idea why an aircraft that left the stand at 1310 Dutch time would take until just before 1500 Dutch time to make the quick hop to NWI?
I am one of the increasingly frustrated passengers waiting for the combined KL1506 and KL1508 - I am booked on KL1508 so my problems aren't anywhere near as great as those of some of my fellow passengers.
KL1506 was cancelled.
Just before the scheduled departure time of KL1508 (1240) they announced an "indefinite" delay... and then left us completely in the dark from then on. Some of us decided to track our inbound flight on the Schiphol web site, where the departure information screen went from "Gate closed" at 1301 to "Departed" at 1310 (Dutch time - i.e., 1210 UK time). Still no information from the airport here.
Come 1300 several of us went to the window and started looking up the approach - even in the worst-case scenario (i.e., with a Polderbaan departure) the aircraft should have been here by then. But... nothing. And still no official information - just the "wait in lounge" message on the board.
Then, about ten minutes ago, we were told that the aircraft had just left and was due to land at 1400 UK time... that's when one of my fellow passengers made his remark about "via Belgrade".
Anyway, it's just landed (20 minutes earlier than they told us it would) so I'd better go.
Does anyone have any idea why an aircraft that left the stand at 1310 Dutch time would take until just before 1500 Dutch time to make the quick hop to NWI?
Nov 22, 2008, 8:36 am
#2
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Geneva
Programs: LX SEN, AFKL Platinum, BA Bronze,
Posts: 5,661
Well, that's the explanation that was (jokingly) offered by one of my fellow passengers here at NWI.
I am one of the increasingly frustrated passengers waiting for the combined KL1506 and KL1508 - I am booked on KL1508 so my problems aren't anywhere near as great as those of some of my fellow passengers.
KL1506 was cancelled.
Just before the scheduled departure time of KL1508 (1240) they announced an "indefinite" delay... and then left us completely in the dark from then on. Some of us decided to track our inbound flight on the Schiphol web site, where the departure information screen went from "Gate closed" at 1301 to "Departed" at 1310 (Dutch time - i.e., 1210 UK time). Still no information from the airport here.
Come 1300 several of us went to the window and started looking up the approach - even in the worst-case scenario (i.e., with a Polderbaan departure) the aircraft should have been here by then. But... nothing. And still no official information - just the "wait in lounge" message on the board.
Then, about ten minutes ago, we were told that the aircraft had just left and was due to land at 1400 UK time... that's when one of my fellow passengers made his remark about "via Belgrade".
Anyway, it's just landed (20 minutes earlier than they told us it would) so I'd better go.
Does anyone have any idea why an aircraft that left the stand at 1310 Dutch time would take until just before 1500 Dutch time to make the quick hop to NWI?
I am one of the increasingly frustrated passengers waiting for the combined KL1506 and KL1508 - I am booked on KL1508 so my problems aren't anywhere near as great as those of some of my fellow passengers.
KL1506 was cancelled.
Just before the scheduled departure time of KL1508 (1240) they announced an "indefinite" delay... and then left us completely in the dark from then on. Some of us decided to track our inbound flight on the Schiphol web site, where the departure information screen went from "Gate closed" at 1301 to "Departed" at 1310 (Dutch time - i.e., 1210 UK time). Still no information from the airport here.
Come 1300 several of us went to the window and started looking up the approach - even in the worst-case scenario (i.e., with a Polderbaan departure) the aircraft should have been here by then. But... nothing. And still no official information - just the "wait in lounge" message on the board.
Then, about ten minutes ago, we were told that the aircraft had just left and was due to land at 1400 UK time... that's when one of my fellow passengers made his remark about "via Belgrade".
Anyway, it's just landed (20 minutes earlier than they told us it would) so I'd better go.
Does anyone have any idea why an aircraft that left the stand at 1310 Dutch time would take until just before 1500 Dutch time to make the quick hop to NWI?
My KLC flight from CGN to AMS last night was on time in the local system, the KLM website had no 'expected time', only scheduled times, the Schiphol website already mentioned a 1 hour delay and Teletekst didn't appear to have been updated all afternoon, all this around the time the incoming flight was scheduled to land at CGN. In those circumstances, you can't really rely on any source except your own observation that an airplane has actually landed and that you should make your way to the gate - as you did...
The KLM website lists now KL1507 as departed at 13:35, with arrival at 13:43 so that seems to fit with the observation that it landed 20 minutes earlier than the 14:00 mentioned.
I don't know what the definition of 'departed' is at the Schiphol website but it may well be 'doors closed' or 'startup'. That plus a single runway in use (Polderbaan appears to be not in use, only Zwanenburg and Aalsmeerbaan were in use Thursday and Friday, with strong wind from the North) may have meant another 20 minutes waiting before taxiing out.
Now, I only hope that your flight isn't held at NWI due to a lack of landing slots with only the single runway in use. As the captain last night explained it, incoming intercontinental flights are given ATC priority as they are already in the air.
Nov 22, 2008, 2:43 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 7,560
Funny you should mention being held at NWI... we were, but for different reasons!
Boarded the aircraft, were told we would be on our way in 10-15 minutes once the aircraft had been de-iced.
10 minutes passed. 15 minutes passed. 20 minutes passed. No sign of any de-icing.
Eventually the pilot came back on the intercom and explained the reason for the delay...:
Apparently someone had had the last of the de-icing fluid earlier in the day. Apparently no one had noticed. The de-icing rig was now in the process of being refilled, but it would take about 15 minutes for the fluid to warm up sufficiently.
This wasn't KLM's fault. It was Norwich Airport's fault. Dear old Norwich Airport (you have to live in East Anglia to understand this...)
We finally got to AMS at about 1715, nearly tree hours late. I feel sorry for all the people who had connections... and for the family with baby who had been at NWI since 8 o'clock in the morning. At least we were only delayed by three hours, and we only had to get to Utrecht from AMS.
Boarded the aircraft, were told we would be on our way in 10-15 minutes once the aircraft had been de-iced.
10 minutes passed. 15 minutes passed. 20 minutes passed. No sign of any de-icing.
Eventually the pilot came back on the intercom and explained the reason for the delay...:
Apparently someone had had the last of the de-icing fluid earlier in the day. Apparently no one had noticed. The de-icing rig was now in the process of being refilled, but it would take about 15 minutes for the fluid to warm up sufficiently.
This wasn't KLM's fault. It was Norwich Airport's fault. Dear old Norwich Airport (you have to live in East Anglia to understand this...)
We finally got to AMS at about 1715, nearly tree hours late. I feel sorry for all the people who had connections... and for the family with baby who had been at NWI since 8 o'clock in the morning. At least we were only delayed by three hours, and we only had to get to Utrecht from AMS.
Nov 23, 2008, 11:21 pm
#6
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ, USA. UA 1K, reluctant but * best in class * DL FO/MM. Former BA jumpseat rider and scourge of Dilbertian management and apologists. As LX might - and do - say: "....an experienced frequent flyer of international airlines"
Posts: 3,386
But never mind Belgrade. Why wouldn't you route instead through EWR? At some points in the recent past, UK-AMS-EU could be done via EWR incurring only a very marginal extra cost and less than 18 hours additional transit time. Just a couple weeks back it could be done via JFK on DL via (during the recent NWA.COM bonanza) for about $250 a.i. to certain European cities. Perfect!
Dec 2, 2008, 1:58 pm
#7
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 14,352
- Nov 19 08:49 Schedules RecordCreated
- Nov 21 11:11 FAA Time Adjustment Scheduled Runway Departure Changed To 11/22/08 12:15 PM
- Estimated Runway Departure Changed To 11/22/08 12:15 PM
- Scheduled Runway Arrival Changed To 11/22/08 11:48 AM
- Estimated Runway Arrival Changed To 11/22/08 11:48 AM
- Nov 22 06:15 Airline Gate Adjustment AEQP Changed To F70
- Nov 22 08:25 Airline Gate Adjustment AEQP Changed From F70 To 100
- Nov 22 09:57 Airline Time Adjustment Estimated Gate Departure Changed To 11/22/08 12:30 PM
- Nov 22 11:23 Airline Time Adjustment Estimated Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 12:30 PM To 11/22/08 01:00 PM
- Nov 22 11:38 Airline Time Adjustment Estimated Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:00 PM To 11/22/08 01:15 PM
- Nov 22 11:38 AFO Time Adjustment Estimated Runway Arrival Changed From 11/22/08 11:48 AM To 11/22/08 12:50 PM
- Nov 22 12:06 AFO Time Adjustment Estimated Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:15 PM To 11/22/08 01:01 PM
- Nov 22 12:20 Airline Time Adjustment Estimated Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:01 PM To 11/22/08 01:15 PM
- Nov 22 12:53 AFO STATUS-Active Actual Gate Departure Changed To 11/22/08 01:36 PM
- Status Changed From Scheduled To Active
- Nov 22 13:04 AFO Time Adjustment Actual Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:36 PM To 11/22/08 01:10 PM
- Nov 22 13:17 AFO Time Adjustment Actual Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:10 PM To 11/22/08 02:06 PM
- Nov 22 13:20 Airline Time Adjustment Actual Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 02:06 PM To 11/22/08 01:35 PM
- Actual Runway Departure Changed To 11/22/08 02:06 PM
- Estimated Gate Arrival Changed To 11/22/08 01:43 PM
- Nov 22 13:28 AFO Time Adjustment Actual Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 01:35 PM To 11/22/08 02:06 PM
- Nov 22 13:30 Airline Time Adjustment Actual Gate Departure Changed From 11/22/08 02:06 PM To 11/22/08 01:35 PM
- Nov 22 13:49 AFO Time Adjustment Estimated Runway Arrival Changed From 11/22/08 12:50 PM To 11/22/08 01:50 PM
- Nov 22 14:20 AFO STATUS-Landed Actual Runway Arrival Changed To 11/22/08 01:40 PM
- Status Changed From Active To Landed
- Nov 23 02:10 FlightHistory Final Task
Johan
Dec 3, 2008, 12:25 am
#8
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: AMS
Programs: KL/AF FB Plat, Hilton Silver, La Quinta Gold
Posts: 1,159
But never mind Belgrade. Why wouldn't you route instead through EWR? At some points in the recent past, UK-AMS-EU could be done via EWR incurring only a very marginal extra cost and less than 18 hours additional transit time. Just a couple weeks back it could be done via JFK on DL via (during the recent NWA.COM bonanza) for about $250 a.i. to certain European cities. Perfect!
!!
Dec 3, 2008, 5:03 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 7,560
Thanks for the useful information, Johan - don't understand it all but it does seem to reflect the general confusion. I presume you have to be a registered user to get these details? (Would be really interested to see what the system had to say about AMS-NWI flights the following day...)