The KLM erosion thread
 

Reading through this forum I strongly feel that many amongst us have had enough of it. A lot of dissatisfaction can be heard when KLM once again erodes the quality of their product and frequent flyer benefits.

When reading individual cases we may sound a bit like a bunch of grumpy old bats. But the grumpiness has nothing to do with these individual cases. It is the result of a long history of erosion experienced by us, the frequent flyer.

We seem to have bumped into 1 or 2 issues where KLM seems to part us of money without any logic, product or extra service behind it. I have marked them with an (!)
If somehow it can be proved they are not true, please let it it know ASAP, because I think these issues weigh even heavier than the ongoing erosion issues.

Let’s sum up what eroded over the past years to show to anyone that we have the right to complain about any topic, even if it seems to be a small issue at first!

So far we have:

PRE APRIL FOOLS

Eroded


Cabin

• 3x3 Y seats in short haul C (should we reveal the overall poorness of ES in detail?)
• The slippery slope seat in WBC
• introduction of a middle seat in J-class (on 777) 2-3-2
• Introduction of cramped 3-4-3 Y-class configuration on 777

Flying Blue

• Disappearing of Royal Wing lounge
• Decrease of award availability
• No 100% Level miles on certain booking classes (some of which are 200 euros more than other Sky Team partners)
• No way to avoid these booking classes when making a reservation on line without "upgrading" to Flex fares.
• Upgrades from lower fare buckets now for miles + cash, and only on day of departure.
• Disappearance of dedicated PE helpdesk.
• no more unlimited lounge access with Platinum/Royal Wing card
• Depreciation of airmiles due to continuing increase of redemption levels.
• Disapearing of 100% free awards (all sorts of taxes need to be payed, some of them for the benefit for the airline)
• Decrease in Platinum Elite bonues from 125% to 100%
• Elite bonus no longer calculated including COS
• Reduction of C class bonus on intercontinental flights from 200% to 150%
• (!)Taxes on award tickets are often higher than taxes on payed tickets
• PE bonus reduced from 110 to 100%, longhaul CoS from 100 to 50%.

In flight

• Catering on short haul (Although slightly improved no too long ago, still miles away from what it used to be)
• Dog food Dorito bits
• The quantity of long haul Y meals
• Deterioration of catering in WBC, both quality and quantity
• no more choice of starter in WBC
• quality of wines on board is much reduced and advertised wines are often not on board
• reduction of the number of flight attendants on certain aircraft
• deteriorating in-flight kit
• no more magazines in Y-class

Ground

• Strong reduction in chances to be upgraded
• Much reduced selection of English and Dutch language newspapers and magazines in the lounges
• No more bottled water in the lounges
• No more champagne in the AMS lounges

Reservation/booking

• Restrictions on advance reservation of seats, both in Y and WBC.
• An internet booking fee
• A 0900 number to contact KLM when making a booking on line ( I should not have to pay to call them to give them my money)
• A credit card surcharge, even when using their FB American Express card
• No way to reserve seats on line
• The introduction of the "paid" select seating
• The introduction of the "paid" exit row and rows with only a 2 seat configuration
• Finger pointing between: 1. website help desk & 2. phone reservations & 3. FB FF program are all treated internally as if they are separate companies
• Numerous reports of technical difficulties with website. Booking website even harder to use woth Firefox and Safari browsers.
• Dramatic increase of C fares for some markets
• (!)when you cancel a non-flexible flight, the fuel surcharges suddenly seem to become part of the fare and are not refunded

Operations

• Cancelled flights are often listed as NOOPS. Basically one could say that it is a shot term schedule change, or a planned cancellation. This 'trick' keeps the flights out of the delay and cancellation statistics.
• Almost daily cancellation due to obvious shortage of aircraft

Other: Consensus (hard to prove but it is certainly how we see and feel it)

• 'NEP-OPS' Abuse of company travel privileges for KLM staff (upgrades of travelling KLM staff and their friends) to the point that paying customers risk losing their seats printed on their BP, choice of food or beverage, peaceful cabin, chance of fair or attentive service, chance of op-up, etc. (numerous reports of this on the forum to prove this case)

Other: Perhaps not necessarily eroded, but room for improvement

• Poor implementation of priority boarding
• Priority luggage tags that almost never work
• It takes up to 6 weeks to get the refund of your taxes when you cancel a ticket
  
• Shower capacity in AMS lounge does not match current policy nor meet related demand (seems to be improving)

Other: Open for discussion (they may be personal taste or caused by external factors. Further, of course all points are open for discussion)

• Seats in general. Comfort decreases with each new generation. (except for 738 and 739 Y seats).
• Outrageous fuel surcharges
• Outrageous award booking taxes
• Amenity kits
• Breakfast for Economy Class passengers on intercontinental flights (generally agreed it still used to be lots better in the past)

Improved

• The tratoria sandwich (quality seems to be deteriorating)
• The new short haul Y seats
• ability to book award travel more easily on AF
• IFE
• OLCI
• The Schengen lounge at Schiphol
• Selection of drinks and snacks at the lounges at Schiphol. Type of snacks change through the day.
• Much improved selection of French language newspapers and magazines in the AMS Schiphol lounges
• No longer advertising misleading "exclusive" prices in Dutch market
• Improved semy flex fare policy in Y
• Introduced possibility to select E instead of N when booking. (100% vs. 25% miles)
• Introduction of NEV3 seats on 77W

APRIL FOOLS

Eroded

• You've got to pay for extra legroom in Y
• AF F awards only available to elites
• Z fare gets 125% miles in business class
• Reduced mileage earning on most economy fares on a 25-50-75-100 scale
• AF F awards skyrocketing in price

Improved

• New award bucket reserved for elites with a 15% miles surcharge - i.e., 115% of a "classic" award
• Free access to certain "extra legroom seats" for plats
• J fare gets 175% miles in business class

POST APRIL FOOLS
Eroded

Improved

• Introduction of Economy Comfort

Let’s stay reasonable and factual. Please try to keep personal issues, personal tastes, non-implemented products and rumours aside.
Further, I would like to stress that 3 steps backwards and 1 step forward is still erosion!

That is not possible. :D

• Upgrades from lower fare buckets now for miles + cash, and only on day of departure.
• Deterioration of catering in WBC, both quality and quantity (I admit I'm comparing to what it was like eight+ years ago, but KL and I go back much longer than that. Maybe I should start comparing WBC to Royal Class :D?)
• Seats in general (comfort decreases with each new generation).
• Restrictions on advance reservation of seats, both in Y and WBC.
• Disappearance of dedicated PE helpdesk.
• Reduced FB elite and CoS bonuses

Johan

* reduction of the number of flight attendants on certain aircraft
* no more unlimited lounge access with Platinum/Royal Wing card
* deteriorating in-flight kit
* no more magazines in Y-class
* introduction of a middle seat in J-class (on 777)
* no more choice of starter in WBC
* Priority luggage tags that almost never work

* No 100% Level miles on certain booking classes (some of which are 200 euros more than other Sky Team partners)

* No way to avoid these booking classes when making a reservation on line without "upgrading" to Flex fares.

* An internet booking fee

* Outrageous fuel surcharges

* Outrageous award booking taxes

* A 0900 number to contact KLM when making a booking on line ( I should not have to pay to call them to give them my money)

* A credit card surcharge, even when using their FB American Express card

* No way to reserve seats on line

* The introduction of the "paid" select seating

* The introduction of the "paid" exit row and rows with only a 2 seat configuration

* An almost non existent Elite boarding procedure

I actually find the seats in 738's and 739's to be the best Y seats in the industry. They're very comfortable, much better than any other Y seats I've encountered. E.g. the Y seats on AF's A320 family are awful and pale in comparison. (The very worst Y seats I've encountered are on RO.)

Catering: European Y has changed stale cheese sandwiches for good sandwiches ^ on a fraction of flights at "Meal times :td::td: - which they make up, i'm sure, or maybe it's meal times in Oz or something) and all other flights you now eat dogfood dorito bits. Overall - :td:

I am taking the liberty to update my original post with your points, for general readabillity.

Apart from the section 'Eroded' I have included a section 'Other' and 'Improved'.

Actually, recently I flew NCE AMS in the morning on a fokker in ES. the Y sandwich was much much much better than the ES "thing". Fortunately, they had leftovers of Y sandwiches :)

Yeah, I think that most of us will agree that the Tratoria Y sandwiches are very tasty. Why don't they put them in the ES box? Together with a desert and a little something else it would make the ES box actually something to look forward to!

erosion:

* free award tickets eliminated and replaced with copy of Dutch Air Miles "miles & money" scheme of bogus fees and taxes; existing miles became severely devalued overnight

* miles continue to be made worth less due to continuing increases in redemption levels (e.g. Europe 123 - N. America C class, from 80K to 90K miles plus above mentioned extortionate fees)

* quality of wines on board is much reduced and advertised wines are often not on board

* finger pointing: 1.website help desk & 2.phone reservations & 3. FB FF program are all treated internally as if they are separate companies: the customer is stuck in the middle and treated poorly. (just try to buy a ticket on klm.com with a 100% earning fare class and a travel voucher - you will enter a twilight zone of dysfunctional company communication,personnel incompetence, unwillingness to serve, ...)

* KLM staff have become quite blatant in their use and particularly abuse of company travel privileges to the point that paying customers risk losing their seats printed on their BP, choice of food or beverage, peaceful cabin, chance of fair or attentive service, chance of op-up, etc.

improvement:

* ability to book award travel more easily on AF where business class is still slightly above minimum industry thresholds of acceptability

* darker shade of blue of KL livery introduced in the 90's looks somewhat nicer than the Korean Air style lighter shade of blue

* FB program encourages frequent flyers to fly other airlines therefore weaning once loyal, exclusive KL travellers from KL and introducing them to new, more attractive options

Added your points to the initial post. Took the liberty to leave sarcastic comments and personal tastes asside. "What is you favorit colour?" :)

And what is the definition of industry treshold of acceptabillity for business class award tickets? :rolleyes:

That would be coming from me.:p

Seriously, whether fully paid, discounted or paid for three times as an award (first extra for full miles, then using the miles then paying all the extra cash on top of the miles), the rapidly decreasing quality of the KL product is not really debated here, is it? I would love to hear factual arguments indicating that they are improving versus getting worse. I would love to have a reason to fly them again.

If you look at the airlinequality website (and other rating organisations for that matter) you can also see that in the past year(s) KL has been demoted from being a 4 star "real" airline to a 3 star airline with quite some depressing company in the 3 star line up.

Not to mention flatseats.com

• IFE
• OLCI

Johan

PE bonus reduced from 110 to 100%, longhaul CoS from 100 to 50%.

Not sure how much room for discussion that leaves.

Johan