I couldn't begin to add anything here that hasn't already been said in all of the above.
Hilton last year still had my overall vote of confidence.
I suppose they have more then enough business at this point.
Or the faith that this is going to produce better results in the long run
While I admire much of what Hilton has to offer I am clearly feeling the pull of the competition.
My feet and luggage seem to be in other branded properties as of late
All as a result of the above mentioned changes combined with the lack of the former good old double mile promos and points
With that said that doesn't mean not staying at Hilton just a lot less.
Hilton has some great product,choices and exceptional value in certain markets
Happy Travels All


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AA & Starwood,Marriott Platinum
Hyatt, Hilton Diamond
Swissotel Club Gold
U/A 1k

I agree! I'm still booking Hilton properties, even with the devaluation. However, I have been finding some weird ways at getting HUGE points lately:

- MyPoints 3000points (2000 from the Amtrak 2450 promo and so far I've found 350 Mypoints for free and am waiting for that last 1000 to bump to Hilton
- Weird surveys have popped up, thanks to FT.
2500 here, 5000 there
- Visa's 10000 points for signup and use
- 10000 points from Delta's stoppage. I had 7000 miles in Delta for 11 years, and was lucky to hear of the stoppage in the knick of time.
- 2500 AGNT. Waiting for that one!
- And naturally the regular points 25% bonus with Gold, etc, etc.,etc.

Starwoods temped me with the 50,000 points for 5 stays in Asia, however I found I could just bump 50,000 airline miles to Starwoods for 1-1 mile transfer and then save $500 - $700 there.

So yes, Hilton is still getting my bookings and some of my Hilton hotels have lowered their rates.....a little. Hopefully will be back to what it was in January soon.

Unknown if I will make the "Fast Track to Diamond" offer by June 14th.

SHADO

Not sure what you mean in the above sentence? You can't transfer airline miles to Starwood, if that's what you mean by "bump". On the other hand, 50K Starwood points would transfer to most airline FF accounts as 60K miles.

Oops, yes you are right. My error. I'm still finding my fingers on the computer booking Hilton reservations, even with the devaluation.

SeaDog, I have no problem with the sponsors selling miles, since they price the miles themselves and hopefully get a fair price. The problem I have is over-liberal bonuses such as CNTU. You are defending something I didnt' attack.

Many have offered CNTU as justification for the devaluation. That's ludicrous! If you subscribe to that argument, then it means HH is asking its customers to pay for its mistake. If prices in the industry have gone up, then HH should simply award less points in the future rather than adjust the redemption level which devalues existing points. IF prices have gone down, which I believe they have due to 9/11 etc., then the property owners get a relative windfall from redemptions even at the old levels because they are getting the same points for something the market says is now worth less.

RutDog, your information is impressive and surprising. I would venture that for most its irrelevant because most redeem VIP awards. Why redeem 20,000 points for a $100 hotel room? Most people accrue miles hoping to go to Hawaii or Eurpoe some day. The devaluations of the ALON and GLON are substantial--43% by my calculation. If you were sitting on 100K points you intended to use 2 years from now for an ALON, they are now worth 43% less. That was something you already owned that was in effect taken away from you.

Are most redemptions for VIP awards? I have used 6 awards, never a VIP award. No desire to go back to Hawaii and all other travel less than 6 nights. Am I that much out of the mainstream? Also, the GLONP award has only gone from 150K to 175K. I don't think a GLON is that valuable anyway because the hotels you can use it at you can usually get pretty cheap.

marc

Well I have both agree and disagree with you.

Agreement: Like you I too dont use the GLON/GLONP redemptions as the determining factor for my opinion/participation in the program, the great majority of awards I use are SC5 or SP5s (3day awards) the comparable points for these stays have gone up 15 to 18%
so while I am not ecstatic, I could see this coming after all I did get FOUR 50k bonuses in the last two years and more points then I had gotten in the previous 8 years with the same approx number of stays per year.

Disagree: My two most recent use of GLONS (not GLONPS) were at the Dublin and Brussels Conrads the lowest available rates at the time of stay were excess of 185EU for the Brussels and 245EU for Dublin IMHO thats is a very cost effective use of those awards.
Note 3 day awards at the same hotels would have been 170k points.
mike

Thanks for the info. I assume your mention of 170K was for the new points; I have paid only max of 100K for 3 days before.

marc

Yes, I tend to use only GLON or GLONP awards -- in London (Paddington Hilton on a GLON), Shanghai (Hilton Shanghai on a GLON), and NYC (Doubletree Suites Times Square on a GLONP).

Disagree strongly that "hotels you can use it (GLON) at you can usually get pretty cheap."

The raising of the GLON award from 100,000 to 150,000 points is a HUGE devaluation and a real blow as far as I am concerned. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif


Kathy

I was still on the topic of GLONs, which was 100k = 6 nights as compared to 2 SC5s =170k points for the same 6 nights.

The new redemptions would be the 150k for the GLON2 versus 210k for 6 one night stays.
The multiple night awards having been eliminated.
Mike

Let me rephrase what I said to be more precise. I believe it is more meaningful to look at the devaluation in the VIP awards because these were the most valuable awards in the program. I don't know what everyone else's motivation and redemption history.

True, the GLONP have not been devalued as much as the GLON and ALON, but I don't believe they should have been increased at all for two reasons. First, with the recession in the travel market, the rooms if anything are less valuable now, so the number of points if anything should have been reduced. Second, the number of 50K bonuses awarded was a HH decision, and they should live with their mistakes rather than force their loyal customers to do so. If a mistake was made, they should correct it on a prospective basis and simply award fewer points in the future. I don't see how their liberal awarding of points gives them license to devalue the points; when you combine both actions its almost fraud IMHO.

Marq, I don't think your travel patterns are that unusual, but that is from my perspective. I have a record of the number of days stayed for every leisure trip (Hilton or other) I have made going back to 1997. 70-75% of my leisure stays are only for 1 night, and there is only one instance (Rome, where I stayed at the Marriott) where I had a 6 night stay. I will be using an ALON for 6 nights this October in Hawaii on my honeymoon so that will be a second. Almost all of the other stays are 2 or 3 nights. Thus, I rarely use ALONs or long multi-night awards. Of course, I am not one who enjoys lazing for 6 days at the beach on vacations. There are many who find that appealing so they are more likely to use ALONs and long multi-night stay awards. To each his own, I guess.

Even with the above information on my own travel stats, it's clear that my HHonors points were devalued. The overall increase in award category level (as discussed by Rut Dog) is only part of the issue, as is noted. My analysis suggests that on average there was an increase in award level of almost .5 (half) of a category. At the mid-level properties, this would effectively mean the points required for a one night award stay would go from 25,000 to 27,000 points or 10% if the half a level increase could be accurately reflected in the award chart. The elimination of multi-night discounts and the huge increase in the special (ALON/GLON type) awards are on top of that 10%. I weighted the loss of the multi-night discounts based on the travel patterns I mentioned above and estimate that my points were devalued to the tune of 20%. Those who make more frequent use of multi-night awards and the ALON/GLON awards are clearly affected to a greater degree. Following the devaluation, I also re-estimated the value I place on an HHonors point and dropped my valuation by the 20% figure to 0.55 cents each (or just above 1/2 cent each).

Mileking:

Thanks for the info. Most of my rewards have been SP5. I will also feel the devaluation. I also remember the double points instead of miles last year that built up my points in a hurry. I truthfully wish hotels and airlines would stop giving out points freely to non-flyers/stayers so that they don't feel a need to devalue points.

I also wish Hilton would institute a Super-Diamond level. Maybe at 100 or 120 nights. Although I really appreciate my Diamond benefits, I fear this Diamond fast track effort will increase the number of Diamonds and then force Hilton to decrease benefits.

Thanks again for all the inputs; I am still in the learning process on how to best take advantage of the laundering of my company's money thru hilton.

marc

I've noticed another trick Hilton is doing to "devalue" points is raising the hotel category levels. For example 'Hilton Wittier' CA is going from Executive to Cat 3. That hotel is a definate Cat 2.

Ditto! I just turned down the Disney Visa charter membership because, hey, I had my trusty HHonors points which were faarrrr more valuable...until all of the above in the first posting happened. Now I'm rethinking my 'no thank you'!

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