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Old Sep 12, 2018, 4:45 pm
  #46  
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Originally Posted by UKtravelbear
No they don't Airlines don't know my ESTA number. There is no field in APIS to enter it for example.

Airlines transmit the passport number to the US (along with other demographic data) and they get sent back a marker that shows them you have an ESTA which then along with the passport check generates the 'docs ok' on the boarding pass.
Which is why it seemed odd when I've been asked for a copy of my ESTA document at check in. It happened only a couple of times (CDG was one place), and the check-in staff backed down when I said it wasn't possible to produce document or number.

OK, I could have got the number from my online document store, but it would have been a hassle, and I was feeling bloody minded.

Perhaps communication with the US system was down, who knows? But if that were the case, would the airline feel entitled to accept my evidence of compliance with ESTA?
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 1:02 am
  #47  
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Originally Posted by IAN-UK
Which is why it seemed odd when I've been asked for a copy of my ESTA document at check in. It happened only a couple of times (CDG was one place), and the check-in staff backed down when I said it wasn't possible to produce document or number.

OK, I could have got the number from my online document store, but it would have been a hassle, and I was feeling bloody minded.

Perhaps communication with the US system was down, who knows? But if that were the case, would the airline feel entitled to accept my evidence of compliance with ESTA?
For most of the history of ESTA, there have been some people arriving at US airports of entry without an approved ESTA despite being required to have one to travel by air to the US. Airline/agent error and IT issues on one or more side of the travel have been part of the picture of how that has happened for US VWP users.

Having a printout showing an approved ESTA doesn’t necessarily mean that the ESTA is still approved as valid for use, but airlines have been known to accept the printouts at times. At least when systems are up, the airlines flying to the US get feedback from the USG about whom should be allowed to travel to the US and who shouldn’t. In some cases this feedback to the airline even prevents US citizens, including those with a US passport loaded in the PNR, from being able to fly back to the US — much of that is related to the US no-fly list enforcement, but some of it isn’t.

When ETIAS/connections for ETIAS goes down on one or more side, it may make a mess of the travel and create even worse and slower lines at passport control than is already the case. That’s what has happened at times when US CBP has found some people to have arrived at a US airport of entry without approved ESTAs or if the involved systems for US-bound air travel and arrival processing at airports of entry aren’t working like usual. But it’s even worse when the CBP computers or electricity at an airport aren’t working in the DHS/CBP inspection facility as usual.

Last edited by GUWonder; Sep 13, 2018 at 1:16 am
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 6:28 am
  #48  
 
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
. Take for example the hassles and costs a Swedish-US dual-citizen in Idaho with a current US passport may face in getting a replacement Swedish passport or Swedish national ID card while in the US. Without ETIAS, it’s pretty easy for such person to fly to Scandinavia and get in without seeking an ETIAS or paying an ETIAS fee or any heightened overseas application costs.
Why can't he or she just fly / drive to next Swedish consulate or embassy in the US to get Swedish passport? I do not understand the problem here.
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 9:05 am
  #49  
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Originally Posted by flyingfkb
Why can't he or she just fly / drive to next Swedish consulate or embassy in the US to get Swedish passport? I do not understand the problem here.
For a US-Swedish dual-citizen already with a valid US passport and ticket to travel from Idaho to the Schengen area but lacking a currently valid Swedish passport, going from Idaho to a place with the equipment to issue a standard full duration Swedish passport isn’t ordinarily as cheap and easy as flying on the US passport to Europe and getting the Swedish passport issued in Sweden. The proportion of Swedish consulates/embassies with Swedish passport-issuing equipment in place year round is much lower now than it was say 20 years ago, and the cost of issuing a passport to applicants outside of Sweden isn’t necessarily the same as for issuing a passport to applicants inside Sweden, with or without a rush.
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 2:26 pm
  #50  
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
That’s all under your version of “hassle” .
You're speaking GUWonder-ese newspeak again. It may well be that in the private lexicon of the GUWonder clan or in some dialect of English that I am unaware of that may be popular in the Swedish community in Idaho "to be hassled" is neutral but in standard English"to be hassled" and "to be inconvenienced" do not have the same connotations. The latter may be neutral but the former certainly is not and is loaded with negative connotations suggesting harassing, pestering, annoying, etc ... This seems to me patently hyperbolic in the context of the current discussion,
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 2:33 pm
  #51  
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Originally Posted by NickB
You're speaking GUWonder-ese newspeak again. It may well be that in the private lexicon of the GUWonder clan or in some dialect of English that I am unaware of that may be popular in the Swedish community in Idaho "to be hassled" is neutral but in standard English"to be hassled" and "to be inconvenienced" do not have the same connotations. The latter may be neutral but the former certainly is not and is loaded with negative connotations suggesting harassing, pestering, annoying, etc ... This seems to me patently hyperbolic in the context of the current discussion,
To acknowledge that an increase in costs in time and money in the real world is a hassle seems to be anything but hyperbolic. To fail to appreciate the fact that such increase in costs is a hassle seems to be it own form of being patently hyperbolic.

I wasn’t a fan of ESTA having a cost, and I’m not a fan of ETIAS having a cost.
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 2:39 pm
  #52  
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
To acknowledge that an increase in costs in time and money in the real world is a hassle seems to be anything but hyperbolic.
You did not talk about an increase in cost/time being a hassle. You talked about EU citizens being hassled. "Hassle", as a verb, is not the same thing as "hassle" as a noun. The latter depending on context does not necessary have the same strong negative connotations that the former has and which is, in this context, imo clearly hyperbolic.
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Old Sep 13, 2018, 4:00 pm
  #53  
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Originally Posted by NickB
You did not talk about an increase in cost/time being a hassle. You talked about EU citizens being hassled. "Hassle", as a verb, is not the same thing as "hassle" as a noun. The latter depending on context does not necessary have the same strong negative connotations that the former has and which is, in this context, imo clearly hyperbolic.
It’s a hassle no matter how a lawyer may try to slice and dice a word before or after a discussion about the word. . And yes it will cause some EU citizens a hassle and will hassle.

When automated/self-use kiosk border control went into place in various parts of the EU, it was often said it wouldn’t cause a hassle for any EU citizens. But it too has. ETIAS won’t hassle as many EU citizens, but it will hassle some.
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Old Oct 5, 2018, 8:31 am
  #54  
 
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I note that the link in post #1 (https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/p...ts-regulation/) is now 404ed. Anything odd going on with the EU Council on this matter?
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Old Oct 5, 2018, 11:13 am
  #55  
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Originally Posted by beltway
I note that the link in post #1 (https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/p...ts-regulation/) is now 404ed. Anything odd going on with the EU Council on this matter?
I don't get a 404 when clicking your link.

What odd things did you suspect were going on... most likely the server was temporarily down or they moved the web page.
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Old Oct 5, 2018, 11:19 am
  #56  
 
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Originally Posted by :D!
I don't get a 404 when clicking your link.

What odd things did you suspect were going on... most likely the server was temporarily down or they moved the web page.
Huh. It's working now, but was very much 404 this morning.
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Old Apr 11, 2019, 12:59 pm
  #57  
 
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Originally Posted by UKtravelbear
Airlines transmit the passport number to the US (along with other demographic data) and they get sent back a marker that shows them you have an ESTA which then along with the passport check generates the 'docs ok' on the boarding pass.
ESTA, ETIAS, eTA, green cards, global entry ... on top of even the best of passports. I get dizzy from the various additional documents! There must be a way to consolidate it all.

Originally Posted by GUWonder
... going from Idaho to a place with the equipment to issue a standard full duration Swedish passport isn’t ordinarily as cheap and easy as flying on the US passport to Europe and getting the Swedish passport issued in Sweden. The proportion of Swedish consulates/embassies with Swedish passport-issuing equipment in place year round is much lower now than it was say 20 years ago ...
I have met the Swedish Consul General in San Francisco a couple of times. She is quite nice, and who in an Idaho community wouldn't want to spend a day or two in San Francisco anyway?
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