That's what my fellow American passenger said to me as we were chatting yesterday towards the end of our flight to LHR.

He actually assumed the product was an old one due for replacment soon...
I'm afraid not I replied, it's 3-4 years old, no more.

I know we've said this and repeated this may times here, but my flight yesterday just reminded me yet again how avarage LY are when it comes to their premium products (nothing wrong with Economy).

I actually find the First class seat hard and uncomfortable (more like you sit on it rather than in it, if you know what I mean...).

I was thinking about joshwex90's recent comment that LY First is an excellent Business class and I actually disagree.
I think it's a good business product but very far from being very good, never mind excellent.

Any of the Biz products I'm used to from BA's to LX's to CO's are far superior to LY's First, and it says a lot if one is sitting in their First seat on LY dreaming of another airline's Business product (in my case BA's CW...).

My issue is not with the soft product but with the hard product, and besides finding the seat not very comfortable the lack of privacy is what bothers me most.

Oh, and don't get me going about the food again...

Thanks for the shout out. First off, I agree that Y is actually a decent Y. Forgetting IFE, which is getting better on other airlines, the comfort of the seat, and the service, have been on par with CO, WT on BA, and others.
With regards to food, I personally enjoy the meals. I haven't had an F meal in quite a while, but for C/Y, I've generally (with some exceptions,) had pretty good meals.

F: It's very similar to CO's BF. Both are 2-2-2, (on the 772), and both are fully lie-flat. I've always seen them as similar products. I never think about the comfort of the seat in relation to other seats, as I've found them OK, but I will try to be conscious of that next time. But we do agree that it's a Biz product at best, and nothing more.
My problem with CW is the density. One of the things I prefer on CO and LX over BA and UA is the width of the seat and the total area. I feel that I have room to move around, store things... On BA and UA, with the 2-4-2 and 2-2-2 configs (744/772 and 763 respectively,) it's a lot tighter.

Sorry, should have been clearer.

I was travelling in an F seat with C service...

Breakfast was just very boring, a bland omelette that looked very sad with nothing else on the plate with it, an green salad, salmon and cream cheese which was nice and for afters something that looked and tasted like shaving cream with some brown powder on top...

What I don't get is why they serve everything on one tray? I would like first eat my starter then main etc but as they serve you the main at the same time it's going to get cold if you do that so I end up eating that first.

I actually prefer the way they do it in Y, at least the main is closed until you open it so stayed hot.

I know it's a little stupid complaining about little niggles like that but it's not the way it should be done.


For some reason I find CO's BF seat a little more private (or should I say Cocooned), isn't the seat next to you slightly set back/forward?.[/QUOTE]


I agree CW isn't the widest of seats, but I find it far softer and more comfy than LY's F seat, and as long as I can get a window seat I have total privacy which for me is important.

I agree on meal service better served the way you suggest, and don't think it's stupid to complain about these. It's fair to complain when LY simply is matching up to the competition. LY claims "not just an airline, we're Israel." Part of that means that I expect BETTER service when it comes to Jewish things (i.e. a KSML). So when I'm being served a KSML, I expect the best possible meal. In general, I've been happy with quality of the food, but you do have more experience on LY than I do. But if EL AL wants me to feel "at home" (הכי בבית בעולם) they must make sure that I feel at home, and that means, as you say, serving meals properly.

Yes and no. Continental BusinessFirst - it's not that the seat is slightly back or forward; the seats are angled. The cabin on the 772 isn't || || || (like LY, which is,) rather the cabin is \\ // //. There might be a bit more privacy, but there's less space also. It's a give and take. LY has significantly more seat pitch.

When traveling alone, I want privacy and ease of aisle access. I get that in UA F, LX F, LH F, most of LX C, AC, US, and parts of BF. (I'd add BA F, but I don't really fly it.) I don't get that in CW. When traveling with someone, I still want a wide seat, so even though the whole BF cabin is fine with a partner, it's still more snug in BA. But again, YMMV

Yes, that's why I find BF a little more private, and you're right about the space but then I have no issue with the amount of space in BF so the extra space with LY F doesn't really matter to me.
I still prefer the BF seat comfort wise, and of course you cannot even compare the IFEs.


You don't get what with CW? Privacy or easy aisle access?

This one isn't even a comparison

Sorry, I wasn't clear. Unlike BF, I don't get easy aisle access. Privacy you get, but I still prefer BF which allows for some privacy but also companionship. And again, isn't as tight.

On BA, if you can get the last row in C or on the UD rows 62 or 64 then you have easy aisle access. I always make an effort to get one of those but TBH when I don't I still take a window seat for the privacy and find aisle access not too big a deal to be honest - for the added privacy it's a small price to pay to have to climb over someone's legs which are anyway quite low at the end of the "bed". The other day I was actually upgraded to F on BA because an excellent customer service chap thought it was not right they had shifted me out of my private window seat into a middle seat (due to change of aircraft).

I agree with Clubman that BA C is far superior to LY F.