I hate places like this. Especially if the service is crap. You still end up paying the "service charge" Not only will i be pissed off with service charges, I will walk out without ordering if I know before I ordered, and if I only find out when the bill comes, I will not give a cent more than what is on the bill. I'm not responsible for paying for people's salary. If they don't feel like they get paid enough or they don't like their job, they can go get another one. Also, in many countries, the services are much much better, and they don't tip in those countries. Two places that come to mind - in my personal experience is Japan, and Spain. Why can people in those countries serve with such great services when they know they won't even get a tip? But in North America, they serve badly and they still expect to get a tip? There is something wrong with the attitude i think

That surcharge is ridiculous. If that crawled its way into my bill, I wouldn't tip at all. And no, you don't get tipped for just doing your job. I normally start around the 10-15% mark depending on the price range of the place (more at higher end places) and go up or down from there. I expect you to be knowledgeable about the menu, my order placed properly, my food delivered hot, my water glass topped up without my asking, and prompt service when I ask for it. It's not too much to ask.

If a service charge is added to my bill, there will be no tip.

A server in Vegas did the begging in April. He kept saying it is not a tip. The three of us in the room all three shook our heads no.

Was this for room service? I would have called hotel management to complain.

Not in Vegas but I was actually at a hotel once that made you initial the tip line if you left anything as they wanted the servers to make sure the customers acknowledged they were giving extra as the service charge was included already. ^

Hustling for tips in the USA has been taken to an art form....

Obvious and then not obvious .. It's just the thing you want. It's a cultural difference, I personally feel offended if somebody is efficient. If he brings me the bill without having asked for it. It cries "LEAVE we have other guests!" After paying the bill, I generally stay for about 30 minutes on my table. In the US I would never dare to..
It's just a feeling about time - in Europe, we have a lot of it, in the US or in NYC people just don't and ask for efficency - <but IMHO eating is not about efficency. I want t i m e on my own, digest, rest, stay, look, talk, having an other espresso, chat with the waiter, make jokes, talk about other customers, become a regular and beeing treated like this. The waiter brings me my favorite drink to finish and then again, I finally ask for the bill. 15 minutes passed. still no bill. I finally get it and leave. After 30 new minutes.
This is europe in a really good place with good waiters.

I know, my american friends would get bored by this. I LOVE it.

Stop dining out. I'd simply go to the grocery store, order something from the deli and take it back to my hotel room. Simple solution. Yes, I'd prefer a nice dinner out , but, someone has to send them back a clear message that the customer is not the one to charge back their business expenses to.

AGREED!!

So...I guess I missed it, then.

Is the service charge a tip or not and does it depend if it is a restaurant or a room service situation in a hotel?

I never tip room service waitstaff because of the service charge that I am not given the choice to handle on my own. I'll tip if I want to tip, dang it.

Isn't the important issue the total cost of the meal? If the 17% surcharge was offset by 17% cheaper food relative to comparable restaurants in SF, I wouldn't be too upset. On the other hand, if food and drinks were the same price as similar restaurants before the 17%, then I would be miffed. I guess the issue is whether the meal was a decent value no matter how the bill was divided up.

If the above was something I couldn't answer, I would be reluctant to return. This may be especially difficult for tourists to determine, and tourists are unlikely to return anyway. I bet this is more common in restaurants that attract tourists and are not too concerned about repeat business.

It probably is - and most tourists wouldn't do the research to find out what are some good locally recommended restaurants.

When I have an "imposed gratuity", er a service charge, I will make a point to circle the line on the sales slip where the imposed gratuity is itemized. I then either write in a zero or put a dash across the line where it asks for an additional tip.

If I receive absolutely exceptional service, I might add an additional tip, but in most cases I make a point to circle the line with the imposed gratuity on the sales slip and leave nothing additional.

When it comes to tipping, I tip based on the service. I start at 15% and then go up or down based on the service. I've been known to leave no tip or a couple of pennies for crap service, but I've tipped as high as 40% for absolutely fantastic service.

If I'm familiar with a specific states wage laws, I will sometimes take that into account when tipping.

I also hate the tip jars that are popping up everywhere that never used to exist. It's often setup in a way where they want you to tip your change or toss a $1 bill in before you even receive what you ordered since most of these tip jars are at the cash register.

I will not leave a tip in one of these tip jars unless I am surprised with above and beyond service.

The trend from "tip" to "service charge" is one you will see spread further in the USA.

For one, a tip belongs to the waiter. The employer cannot legaly alter the amount he or she pays to the employee - usually same or next day.

With a service charge this is not the case, and the restaurateur can decide to allocate a portion to the rest fo the crew, hold on to it for a week or a month, etc. I do believe, however, this now becomes part of income and now social security, etc. is paid on the full payout of wages including this "tip".

With tax laws in effect since the mid '80s it makes sense for a restaurant to do this as the burden of withholding on tips is with the employer.

If the service is exceptional, I always have a few extra dollars in cash to discretely hand to the waiter / waitress. I doubt the employer will tyr to pry it out of his / her hands!.

Apparently you don't realize that "Splitting Tips" is quite common in a variety of establishments selling food and beverages. Bar(wo)men often receive a portion of the tips given cocktail wait(resses/persons). Depending on the joint, the splits may extend even unto busboys/girls. The "Split" is usually carried out among employees, leaving out management to avoid clumsy tax issues. Back when I wasa barman, those few bucks you handed the cocktail waitress were sure going to be split with me.

On the other hand, even as a former barman, when I see an entry for "Service Charge", my desire to further reward wait staff disappears, especially when the "Service Charge" is shown at 17.5 - 20% (or even more these days). I'll take this sort of "Taxation without Representation" once, but take care never to retun again. On the other hand, having been exposed to, seen and known a multitude of chickensh*t patrons whose idea ofa good tip is a dollar or two on a fifty dollar check, I understand why some restaurants resort to this sort of blackmail.

Of course, nothing matches hotel room service charge ripoffs....