Originally Posted by jrolland1975

So there seems to be a correlation between meat consumption and high life expectancy

Second, the life expectancy increased dramatically in the past 200 years, and so did the individual consumption of meat. Whenever people COULD consume more meat, they WOULD. And they would become stronger and more healthy.

Similarly, while India is at the bottom of meat consumption, it is also at the bottom of life expectancy.

Once again I know correlation is not causation, but I challenge the vegans to produce unbiased stories proving that eating meat is unhealthy. What is probably unhealthy is to overeat and to avoid exercising.

Originally Posted by jrolland1975

I do not buy that for a minute. I am convinced that this is pure propaganda put together by PETA and the likes. I do not have any qualitative basis to support claim (this is why I originally asked for studies) but I have a few facts that tend to support my claim:
1. Life expectancy is higher in countries with high beef consumption: Japan, France
1 Japan 82.6 79.0 86.1
2 Hong Kong ( China) 82.2 79.4 85.1
3 Iceland 81.8 80.2 83.3
4 Switzerland 81.7 79.0 84.2
5 Israel 81.6 79.7 83.4
6 Australia 81.2 78.9 83.6
7 Spain 80.9 77.7 84.2
8 Sweden 80.9 78.7 83.0
9 Macau ( China) 80.7 78.5 82.8
10 France (metropolitan) 80.7 77.1 84.1

to be compared with meat consumption
Denmark 74.1 69.2 69.2 71.1 73.7 1
Czech Republic 64.6 67.6 64.5 66.2 67.7 2
Spain 54.0 56.3 57.8 60.7 64.0 3
Germany 54.8 54.7 53.2 55.9 58.8 4
Austria 56.3 57.6 55.0 57.2 57.7 5
Hong Kong 54.4 49.9 52.7 54.9 54.3 6
Belgium-Luxembourg 54.4 55.1 43.0 47.0 52.6 7
Netherlands 44.2 44.3 42.9 43.9 43.7 8
Taiwan 40.2 41.7 39.6 44.3 42.5 9
Hungary 39.3 38.5 40.6 36.6 42.1 10
Ireland 37.9 38.4 40.2 40.1 40.5 11
Poland 38.6 41.2 34.2 38.3 39.6 12
Sweden 35.8 35.0 35.8 37.5 38.5 13
France 35.8 34.8 35.3 38.1 38.4 14
http://www.allcountries.org/uscensus..._meat_and.html


So there seems to be a correlation between meat consumption and high life expectancy

Second, the life expectancy increased dramatically in the past 200 years, and so did the individual consumption of meat. Whenever people COULD consume more meat, they WOULD. And they would become stronger and more healthy.

Similarly, while India is at the bottom of meat consumption, it is also at the bottom of life expectancy.

Once again I know correlation is not causation, but I challenge the vegans to produce unbiased stories proving that eating meat is unhealthy. What is probably unhealthy is to overeat and to avoid exercising.

Originally Posted by mikeef

As a proud member of PETA (People for the Eating of Tasty Animals), I fully support your decision. My people have worked too long and hard for me to get to the top of the food chain for me to eat vegetables exclusively.

Mike

Originally Posted by GadgetFreak

You cant compare whole countries to other countries, there are too many other differences. But if you want to do that, try comparing the US, conveniently missing above, which has very high beef consumption, with the others. The US is like 27th or 28th in life expectancy. Also comparing a country like India to Japan is to be honest, totally laughable.

...

The leading cause of combined mortality/morbidity in terms of lost days of productive life from either death or disability is diarrhea in the developing world and cardiovascular disease in the developed world (per the WHO and it has been that way for a long time).

Originally Posted by jrolland1975

Ok, I don't know if this belongs here or what, but since I am really pissed and I want to let it go, here is what happened to me on a FRA-SFO last week, seating upstairs in C class

Dinner was the standard united short ribs. I have. The woman next to me starts looking funny so I ask her what is wrong.

And then she starts asking me if I realize how much suffering I am causing eating meat and how much water was needed to produce that piece of meat and that meat is unhealthy all the condescending stuff.

Originally Posted by CBear

I would have taken a big bite, lean over to her and go....mmm...mmm..mmmm!

Originally Posted by GadgetFreak

I think you should be free to eat whatever you want. And I do eat meat myself. I also think it is wildly inappropriate to lecture people on what they are eating, or for that matter more or less anything else. Minding ones business is a lost art and I would have probably told the person so in no uncertain terms.

Originally Posted by roberino

And in other news, there is a perfect correlation with people who drink water and death. Meat consumption is directly related to economic wealth of a country, which, in turn, is related to social welfare and health programs, which, in turn, lead to greater life expectancy.

Originally Posted by ossipago

A lost art? Since when? You don't actually have a right to not be lectured. Especially in an airplane, which is not in actuality a public space but pretty much functions like one. The founders of the U.S. did not protect a right to silence or to not be annoyed, but the right to speech. If you don't buy the arguments, fine - but listening to them IS the price you pay for living in a "free" society (one, which, by the way, subsidizes the price of meat to a vast extent).

Originally Posted by ossipago

A lost art? Since when? You don't actually have a right to not be lectured. Especially in an airplane, which is not in actuality a public space but pretty much functions like one. The founders of the U.S. did not protect a right to silence or to not be annoyed, but the right to speech. If you don't buy the arguments, fine - but listening to them IS the price you pay for living in a "free" society (one, which, by the way, subsidizes the price of meat to a vast extent).

Originally Posted by GadgetFreak

I think you rather broadly missed my point. I said art, not constitutional right. While one might have a constitutional right to be a boorish busybody, that doesn't mean they should feel compelled to avail themselves of that right.

Originally Posted by mikeef

As a proud member of PETA (People for the Eating of Tasty Animals), I fully support your decision. My people have worked too long and hard for me to get to the top of the food chain for me to eat vegetables exclusively.

Mike

Originally Posted by dcpatti

I love to remind preachy folks like this, how many things AREN'T vegetarian. The processing/refining of white sugar can often be non-vegetarian. Dental anesthetic often isn't vegetarian. And some beers/wines aren't vegetarian. Anything "enriched with Omega-3" is just enriched with fish. True, the sugar refining process is getting away from use of bone char filters, and my neighborhood bar now has a vegan beer menu, but it's still very hard to lead an animal-free existence.

I'm not sure if I enjoy exposing a hypocrite more than seeing that "oh no" look on the pushy person's face when they learn how many beers are filtered.

Either way, unless I'm killing the cow in front of you on the plane, mind your own business. If you think you've got a right to lecture me, then I've got a right to tell you to stfu. Right after I tell you what's in your Omega 3 Orange Juice.