Strangest (And Most Violent) Flight Ever Yesterday (Long)
Sep 26, 2009, 4:13 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: slc
Programs: dl dm, co gold, spg gold, hh gold
Posts: 21
Strangest (And Most Violent) Flight Ever Yesterday (Long)
The passenger behind me physically attacked me for reclining my seat (gently) on a Delta Connection flight from Burbank to Salt Lake City yesterday.
My experience with this guy began when he took his seat behind me and immediately jammed his knees into the small of my back. He appeared to be of average height as he passed me, so I was confused about how he could physically pull this off. I fly enough to know that letting strange and/or selfish actions by others bother me only makes the journey tougher for me, so I elected to ignore him. But ignoring him got a little harder once we passed 10,000 feet.
As most fliers would, I attempted to recline my seat, only to meet significant resistance. At first I thought my seat was broken, but then the man behind me explained the situation by announcing that I would not be able to recline because his knees were pressed against my seat to prevent me from doing so.
That was a new experience for me. I got the impression that keeping me from reclining was as important to him as reaching his destination. I was curious enough about how he was managing what seemed to me to be a tricky maneuver that I made a lavatory trip to eye his contortions from the aisle. He was sitting with his tailbone more or less on the very edge of his seat, his shoulders meeting his seatback about midway up, and his knees and upper shins pressed quite firmly into my seatback. Quite a feat for a guy appearing to be around 65. (Im 40-ish and in excellent health, but I cant fathom sitting like that for an extended period of time, so please dont flame me.)
After considering my options, I elected to ignore him and read my book. After all, an hour and 35 minutes in the air is a pretty short flight. But about an hour in, my lower back was starting to hurt, so I was quite relieved when he stood to allow his traveling companion access to the aisle. Once his seatmate was clear, I eased into a recline, wholly unprepared for what happened next. Captain No-Recline violently slammed his body into my seatback and started yelling at me. Then he leaned over my right shoulder and tried to press the wrong seat button. Realizing his mistake, he leaned over my left shoulder and started slapping aggressively at my left arm, which was blocking his access to the button. He continued to scream, demanding that I get my seatback out of his space, then called me an a$&hole.
Having never before used the flight attendant call button in my life, it actually took me a few seconds to find it. But I think the flight attendant was already on her way in response to the yelling because she arrived almost immediately after the call light went on.
Shocked and bewildered, I explained the events to her as best as my adrenaline and limited understanding of the event would allow. The assailant just kept repeating that he didnt want my seatback in his space. She told him that it was up to me to recline if I wanted and asked him if he had directed profanity at me. He said that he had called me a jerk, and I interjected that that was not what he had said. I used a worse word, he admitted. The flight attendant then told him that any further disruptions would result in security meeting him in Salt Lake.
In the moment I wanted this guy hammered for his actions and I was frustrated that he only garnered an admonition, but I felt a little better when the flight attendant made it clear that my opinion was paramount in determining what to do with him. She also returned twice more before we landed to ask how I was doing and to ensure that Mr. Slap Happy was behaving. During that time I carefully considered the situation.
Although I initially wanted the man arrested, my adrenaline soon dissipated and my thoughts turned to my wife and six-week-old son, who were waiting for me in the park-and-wait lot. What I wanted most was to just get the heck off the plane and go spend the afternoon with my family, as I had originally planned. So I just dropped it and left, stopping only at the cabin door to hear the emphatic apologies of the flight attendant, who told me that she had never before seen such an event.
Now, just over 24 hours later and for a variety of reasons, I regret having not pressed charges.
So, fellow FlyerTalkers, how would you have responded to his attack? Id love to hear your reasoning, as well. Also, how would you have reacted to the initial knees-in-the-back moment? Has anyone ever had a similar event happen to them? I'm looking to learn from this event and I thank you in advance for whatever contribution to my learning you are willing to offer.
It might help you to know that I never antagonized him in any way. Prior to his eruption I did not address him, gave him no dirty looks, never even looked him in the eye. Those are all bad ideas when facing someone who seems to be looking for trouble. I only addressed him at all during his slap attack, asking only, What is wrong with you? A pretty reasonable question, given his actions.
Now, as a disclaimer, Im not looking for some ridiculous recompense. I dont blame Delta or SkyWest for this because I dont believe they could have anticipated the event, much less prevented it. That is, unless the guy had behaved similarly on prior flights, which theres not really any way of me knowing. I dont feel like Delta and SkyWest owe me anything because of this bizarre experience, although I certainly wouldnt say No to a little goodwill kicked my way. In fact, just ensure that next years Diamond Medallion VIP line can actually fix Deltas mistakes without trauma and Ill be happy. You know, the kind of customer service that a long-term, high-yield repeat customer might have the audacity to expect. (Sorry for the digression, but Im more steamed about getting the runaround over Delta charging me twice for a special fee and making it hell to fix than I am about what happened yesterday. But dont confuse that with an anti-Delta bias, because I am a lifelong and unabashed Delta fanboy. Even when Delta leaves its socks on the floor.)
For further clarification, I have never had a conflict with anyone on a plane, ever. Lifes just too short, and air travel can be stressful enough at times. Also, I fly enough to have been Platinum for years, even back when you used to have to fly to get it; enough, anyway, that I thought I had seen it all. (Ha!)
One last thing: I feel like the flight attendant did an outstanding job of taking control of the situation and getting my new BFF to sit down, shut up, and keep his hands to himself. ^
My experience with this guy began when he took his seat behind me and immediately jammed his knees into the small of my back. He appeared to be of average height as he passed me, so I was confused about how he could physically pull this off. I fly enough to know that letting strange and/or selfish actions by others bother me only makes the journey tougher for me, so I elected to ignore him. But ignoring him got a little harder once we passed 10,000 feet.
As most fliers would, I attempted to recline my seat, only to meet significant resistance. At first I thought my seat was broken, but then the man behind me explained the situation by announcing that I would not be able to recline because his knees were pressed against my seat to prevent me from doing so.
That was a new experience for me. I got the impression that keeping me from reclining was as important to him as reaching his destination. I was curious enough about how he was managing what seemed to me to be a tricky maneuver that I made a lavatory trip to eye his contortions from the aisle. He was sitting with his tailbone more or less on the very edge of his seat, his shoulders meeting his seatback about midway up, and his knees and upper shins pressed quite firmly into my seatback. Quite a feat for a guy appearing to be around 65. (Im 40-ish and in excellent health, but I cant fathom sitting like that for an extended period of time, so please dont flame me.)
After considering my options, I elected to ignore him and read my book. After all, an hour and 35 minutes in the air is a pretty short flight. But about an hour in, my lower back was starting to hurt, so I was quite relieved when he stood to allow his traveling companion access to the aisle. Once his seatmate was clear, I eased into a recline, wholly unprepared for what happened next. Captain No-Recline violently slammed his body into my seatback and started yelling at me. Then he leaned over my right shoulder and tried to press the wrong seat button. Realizing his mistake, he leaned over my left shoulder and started slapping aggressively at my left arm, which was blocking his access to the button. He continued to scream, demanding that I get my seatback out of his space, then called me an a$&hole.
Having never before used the flight attendant call button in my life, it actually took me a few seconds to find it. But I think the flight attendant was already on her way in response to the yelling because she arrived almost immediately after the call light went on.
Shocked and bewildered, I explained the events to her as best as my adrenaline and limited understanding of the event would allow. The assailant just kept repeating that he didnt want my seatback in his space. She told him that it was up to me to recline if I wanted and asked him if he had directed profanity at me. He said that he had called me a jerk, and I interjected that that was not what he had said. I used a worse word, he admitted. The flight attendant then told him that any further disruptions would result in security meeting him in Salt Lake.
In the moment I wanted this guy hammered for his actions and I was frustrated that he only garnered an admonition, but I felt a little better when the flight attendant made it clear that my opinion was paramount in determining what to do with him. She also returned twice more before we landed to ask how I was doing and to ensure that Mr. Slap Happy was behaving. During that time I carefully considered the situation.
Although I initially wanted the man arrested, my adrenaline soon dissipated and my thoughts turned to my wife and six-week-old son, who were waiting for me in the park-and-wait lot. What I wanted most was to just get the heck off the plane and go spend the afternoon with my family, as I had originally planned. So I just dropped it and left, stopping only at the cabin door to hear the emphatic apologies of the flight attendant, who told me that she had never before seen such an event.
Now, just over 24 hours later and for a variety of reasons, I regret having not pressed charges.
So, fellow FlyerTalkers, how would you have responded to his attack? Id love to hear your reasoning, as well. Also, how would you have reacted to the initial knees-in-the-back moment? Has anyone ever had a similar event happen to them? I'm looking to learn from this event and I thank you in advance for whatever contribution to my learning you are willing to offer.
It might help you to know that I never antagonized him in any way. Prior to his eruption I did not address him, gave him no dirty looks, never even looked him in the eye. Those are all bad ideas when facing someone who seems to be looking for trouble. I only addressed him at all during his slap attack, asking only, What is wrong with you? A pretty reasonable question, given his actions.
Now, as a disclaimer, Im not looking for some ridiculous recompense. I dont blame Delta or SkyWest for this because I dont believe they could have anticipated the event, much less prevented it. That is, unless the guy had behaved similarly on prior flights, which theres not really any way of me knowing. I dont feel like Delta and SkyWest owe me anything because of this bizarre experience, although I certainly wouldnt say No to a little goodwill kicked my way. In fact, just ensure that next years Diamond Medallion VIP line can actually fix Deltas mistakes without trauma and Ill be happy. You know, the kind of customer service that a long-term, high-yield repeat customer might have the audacity to expect. (Sorry for the digression, but Im more steamed about getting the runaround over Delta charging me twice for a special fee and making it hell to fix than I am about what happened yesterday. But dont confuse that with an anti-Delta bias, because I am a lifelong and unabashed Delta fanboy. Even when Delta leaves its socks on the floor.)
For further clarification, I have never had a conflict with anyone on a plane, ever. Lifes just too short, and air travel can be stressful enough at times. Also, I fly enough to have been Platinum for years, even back when you used to have to fly to get it; enough, anyway, that I thought I had seen it all. (Ha!)
One last thing: I feel like the flight attendant did an outstanding job of taking control of the situation and getting my new BFF to sit down, shut up, and keep his hands to himself. ^
Sep 26, 2009, 4:24 pm
#4
Join Date: May 2001
Programs: UA 2MM, DL MM
Posts: 3,172
You did the right thing - pressing charges would have required hours of your time both after the flight and later on in the process. As a middle ground it might be worth calling the airline to see if they placed a "note" on your friend's name highlighting the incident so that if it does happen again it would be difficult for him to board a plane.
Sep 26, 2009, 5:07 pm
#5
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: RDU
Programs: AA, EXP. DL, DM 1MM. HHonors, Diamond. Hertz, PC. National, EE.
Posts: 259
Plain and simple; You were assaulted. The person that assaulted you will probably do it again to someone else, while I understand you not going forward with the matter, the flight attendant should have reported the incident to the captain and taken over from there.
If it were me, and I was suddenly attacked like that, reflexes probably would have the attacker leaving the plane on a stretcher, there is nothing at all wrong with protecting yourself from injury by an apparently unstable person.
If it were me, and I was suddenly attacked like that, reflexes probably would have the attacker leaving the plane on a stretcher, there is nothing at all wrong with protecting yourself from injury by an apparently unstable person.
Sep 26, 2009, 5:15 pm
#6
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Happily living in Frenaros Cyprus having escaped the near-death experience called Sofia Bulgaria
Programs: Etihad Guest Gold, DL FO and 1MM, and a bunch of others at a low level
Posts: 2,053
I would have pressed assault charges. I would have discreetly asked the FA for Mr. Slap-Happy's name and her recommendation on how to contact the appropriate authorities upon deplaning. I would have gotten names and contact information from all the passengers who witnessed the event.
This kind of behavior is inexcusable. And if a man of 65 does not have proper manners at his age, then I would have to believe that the only way to teach him manners would be to have the authorities teach him. I am assuming that he did not have some kind of mental condition that caused the unpleasant behavior.
Yes, this might turn into a lengthy process and require a lot of my time, but in my opinion, I would spend that time. I am sick and tired of the rudeness of people these days and feel it is time to take action. So that is what I would have done.
This kind of behavior is inexcusable. And if a man of 65 does not have proper manners at his age, then I would have to believe that the only way to teach him manners would be to have the authorities teach him. I am assuming that he did not have some kind of mental condition that caused the unpleasant behavior.
Yes, this might turn into a lengthy process and require a lot of my time, but in my opinion, I would spend that time. I am sick and tired of the rudeness of people these days and feel it is time to take action. So that is what I would have done.
Sep 26, 2009, 5:25 pm
#7
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: KUL/TPA/OTP
Programs: UA1k, DL
Posts: 3,138
Plain and simple; You were assaulted. The person that assaulted you will probably do it again to someone else, while I understand you not going forward with the matter, the flight attendant should have reported the incident to the captain and taken over from there.
If it were me, and I was suddenly attacked like that, reflexes probably would have the attacker leaving the plane on a stretcher, there is nothing at all wrong with protecting yourself from injury by an apparently unstable person.
If it were me, and I was suddenly attacked like that, reflexes probably would have the attacker leaving the plane on a stretcher, there is nothing at all wrong with protecting yourself from injury by an apparently unstable person.
OP, I think you handled the situation well. Kudos to you^
Sep 26, 2009, 5:30 pm
#8
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Atlanta
Programs: DL:PM - Reserve, 2MM, FC, RW; HH: SILVER MR: SILVER
Posts: 1,225
+1 ^ When I read the title, I thought this was about "rough air", not a rough passenger. No excuse for that kind of behavoir, and as others have said, he could do it again. If you change your mind, you can still file charges.
Sep 26, 2009, 5:44 pm
#10
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: JFK,ATL,LGA (the rest of the world follows)
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Posts: 3,190
Trying to read more these days
So, two thumbs for you. ^^
If you run out of well done job cards (Send to FF to use,) you can always send a comment to the medallion desk and say you wish you could give one to XXX because of XXX, and I believe that they would send one on their behalf.
Sep 26, 2009, 5:57 pm
#11
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: MA
Programs: DL
Posts: 1,559
What a story.
I was on an ATL-BOS flight last year on a 738, just coming off an red-eye from ANC. I had no sleep really, I was tired, I was holding on to the rope to stay awake. Mom put us in the aisles, 11C/D, I got the D side. Once we were up at crusing altitude, I wanted to recline to get a little sleep. I tried reclining, but it wouldn't budge. I looked back and the guy behind me had his laptop out, and IIRC, his knees were up to the traytable. I didn't want to bother, so I just tried to fall asleep. Eventually my head rolled to the young lady in 11E, and I had to put my left hand on my head to keep it from falling any more.
You should always press charges, no matter what it is. It gives people a lesson that life isn't Burger King - your not going to get your way all the time. Putting that idiot in jail would have taught him a valueable lesson that he obviously needs to learn. I hate extreme selfish people like that guy. Like he doesn't think the Golden Rule exists. Like it's a one way street. The fact is that there is no such thing in this world. Eventually your not going to do or get what you want. I don't get why people think that.
Also just be glad that you made it home okay.
That truly was one of the longest posts I've seen on FT.
I was on an ATL-BOS flight last year on a 738, just coming off an red-eye from ANC. I had no sleep really, I was tired, I was holding on to the rope to stay awake. Mom put us in the aisles, 11C/D, I got the D side. Once we were up at crusing altitude, I wanted to recline to get a little sleep. I tried reclining, but it wouldn't budge. I looked back and the guy behind me had his laptop out, and IIRC, his knees were up to the traytable. I didn't want to bother, so I just tried to fall asleep. Eventually my head rolled to the young lady in 11E, and I had to put my left hand on my head to keep it from falling any more.
You should always press charges, no matter what it is. It gives people a lesson that life isn't Burger King - your not going to get your way all the time. Putting that idiot in jail would have taught him a valueable lesson that he obviously needs to learn. I hate extreme selfish people like that guy. Like he doesn't think the Golden Rule exists. Like it's a one way street. The fact is that there is no such thing in this world. Eventually your not going to do or get what you want. I don't get why people think that.
Also just be glad that you made it home okay.
That truly was one of the longest posts I've seen on FT.
Sep 26, 2009, 6:31 pm
#12
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: DCA
Programs: DL Diamond, HH Diamond, Avis First
Posts: 553
With family waiting on you, best just let it go. Not worth missing family time just to deal with airport police/security. As for myself, if I needed to be somewhere, home, client, etc, I would also have let it go, but if I had a few hours to burn, I totally would have had airport police meet the plane and had the guy arrested.
Sep 26, 2009, 6:44 pm
#13
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Northern VA
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Posts: 286
Like vicarious_MR'er, I too would have 2nd/3rd/4th guessed myself.
I've always had the impression that FT'ers have an above-average respect for travelers and the proper protocols of behavior, and are always willing to give people the benefit of the doubt.
So I'd like to think I wouldn't have pressed charges... but something tells me this chap had it coming to him.
I'm sure someone could correct me, but I was under the impression that any type of physical contact (in an aggressive manner, such as grabbing your left arm) on a flight was grounds for an arrest at the gate. Could be wrong about that, though.
I've always had the impression that FT'ers have an above-average respect for travelers and the proper protocols of behavior, and are always willing to give people the benefit of the doubt.
So I'd like to think I wouldn't have pressed charges... but something tells me this chap had it coming to him.
I'm sure someone could correct me, but I was under the impression that any type of physical contact (in an aggressive manner, such as grabbing your left arm) on a flight was grounds for an arrest at the gate. Could be wrong about that, though.
Sep 26, 2009, 7:14 pm
#14
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: SRQ
Programs: DL DM FC 3MM, AA Platinum, UA 1K
Posts: 89
Unbelievable incident. I would only hope that I didn't lose my temper if it happened to me.
I would have called the FA as soon as the guy blocked my recline.
But as things played out for you, and with your family waiting, I can understand not pressing charges, which would probably have taken a long time and been another emotional drain.
I would have called the FA as soon as the guy blocked my recline.
But as things played out for you, and with your family waiting, I can understand not pressing charges, which would probably have taken a long time and been another emotional drain.
Sep 26, 2009, 7:17 pm
#15
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: KUL/TPA/OTP
Programs: UA1k, DL
Posts: 3,138
These actions would warrant arrest as they constitute assault, on a flight or not.