Delta Holiday Grinch Move: DL45 DUB>ATL via JFK
Dec 13, 2017, 12:10 pm
#106
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Dec 13, 2017, 12:23 pm
#107
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It's actually quite expensive to do that. More pad time in the schedule means less productive utilization of the assets -- e.g., you can't schedule as many flights per day per aircraft. Not a pretty picture for the financials just to bolster on-time performance because there are other repercussions. So I'd be skeptical that DL is "heavily" padding schedules, unless you also want to claim that DL is mismanaging its investments (which could be the case, I don't know).
Dec 13, 2017, 1:39 pm
#108
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I tried to get ahead of this (and obviously failed) by nicely asking the onboard crew to alert or do something about this.
They, obviously, ignored my request - and didn't do anything to help, other than offering shallow hope that we'd make the connection.
In the CDG case (and CDG is way more complex than JFK, IMHO), either the remote stand or the regional jet crew alerted someone to do something, then CDG actually took action.
JFK? Notsomuch.
They, obviously, ignored my request - and didn't do anything to help, other than offering shallow hope that we'd make the connection.
In the CDG case (and CDG is way more complex than JFK, IMHO), either the remote stand or the regional jet crew alerted someone to do something, then CDG actually took action.
JFK? Notsomuch.
DL's Ops Center knows exactly where the aircraft is, when it lands and when it arrives at the gate and when passengers are offloading. While DL does not know where you are physically within the airport, the GA at the onward flight also has a dynamic list of connecting passengers and can see where you are, e.g. in the air, at the gate, etc. Again, the GA can't tell whether you might be the first off, whether you are running, waiting for assistance or stopped off somewhere, but the GA certainly knew at 7:35 PM (T-15 for your onward flight) that you were physically on the ground and likely enroute to the ATL gate.
All of this is to say that there is nothing for you or for the crew to do. It also does not matter.
While the delay may not have been DL's fault, it was not your fault either. But, misconnecting is not about fault, it is simply about flying a schedule.
Dec 13, 2017, 3:06 pm
#109
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It's actually quite expensive to do that. More pad time in the schedule means less productive utilization of the assets -- e.g., you can't schedule as many flights per day per aircraft. Not a pretty picture for the financials just to bolster on-time performance because there are other repercussions. So I'd be skeptical that DL is "heavily" padding schedules, unless you also want to claim that DL is mismanaging its investments (which could be the case, I don't know).
Dec 14, 2017, 7:13 pm
#110
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It's disappointing that DL would stoop that low and not wait a few extra minutes to get you on. It also illustrates how bogus "direct" flights are now. I can see trying to run a tight schedule when the flight needs to get out and the next flight can take the displaced PAX. But to do this for a flight marketed as direct and being the last of the day? That's a harsh thing to do.
I'm not surprised at all. I've had similar things happen to me. In the end they really only care about how to get your money. It's not to get you from A to B in a cared-for manner.
If the pilots were close to timing out for an ontime flight, then that's DL's fault too. It shouldn't happen. Really no excuse for not waiting a few minutes. The only excuses we can give them are needing to pad their performance metrics or giving them a pass for poorly planned operations.
It certainly is possible that this thought out and was the best solution. But it doesn't appear reasonable, and we have no evidence to show it.
It's not at all expensive when you have a surplus of aircraft, are a hub-and-spoke carrier, and are into off-peak season. If you look at turn times, DL usually has leisurely turn times. They aren't pushing aircraft utilization very high, so padding schedules isn't an issue on the financial side. LCCs commonly look to maximize utilization because of their limited assets, but current legacies have more aircraft than needed most of the time.
Bingo.
It is surprising that the flight was not held, but as others have mentioned, Delta does calculate the impact of such things, and I would be willing to be there was more to the situation than just getting the flight out on time. JFK can have long taxi times, and the crew may have been at risk of timing out, and with Ops melting down everywhere, there may have been other circumstances we will never know. Going forward, if I was presented with a flight that was delayed that would make the connection close (because it would be nice if they hold the flight but it can't be counted on), I would be looking at alternative routing ex-Dub and even if I cannot make it to the final destination, choosing a place to get stranded at that will be 1) helpful and 2) well-positioned to get me home.
If the pilots were close to timing out for an ontime flight, then that's DL's fault too. It shouldn't happen. Really no excuse for not waiting a few minutes. The only excuses we can give them are needing to pad their performance metrics or giving them a pass for poorly planned operations.
OP: I think it's important that you at least acknowledge the possibility that Delta did in fact make a thoughtful decision about this. It is possible that when weighing many factors that this was the very best option that would cause problems for the smallest amount of people.
You will never be able to know this as this is information that DL does not make available, but I do think it's important that you consider this. I fully agree that it's possible that this is not what happened, that it's possible that someone was being careless or lazy and that you felt the brunt of it. But you don't know that.
You will never be able to know this as this is information that DL does not make available, but I do think it's important that you consider this. I fully agree that it's possible that this is not what happened, that it's possible that someone was being careless or lazy and that you felt the brunt of it. But you don't know that.
It's actually quite expensive to do that. More pad time in the schedule means less productive utilization of the assets -- e.g., you can't schedule as many flights per day per aircraft. Not a pretty picture for the financials just to bolster on-time performance because there are other repercussions. So I'd be skeptical that DL is "heavily" padding schedules, unless you also want to claim that DL is mismanaging its investments (which could be the case, I don't know).
Bingo.
Dec 24, 2017, 7:30 am
#112
Join Date: Jun 2006
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I really hope Delta folks are monitoring this forum.
On December 10, Delta 45 (DUB > ATL via JFK) was delayed 5 hours, 36 minutes (Delta (DL)
#45 ? 10-Dec-2017 ? DUB / EIDW - KJFK ? FlightAware).
Those of us who "stuck it out" and remained on the flight were auto-rebooked on flight 2816 (JFK > ATL). *edited flight number
Well instead of holding the flight for us (at least a dozen), they "rolled-forward" the departure time, thereby screwing us.
This shows Delta's true colors.
On December 10, Delta 45 (DUB > ATL via JFK) was delayed 5 hours, 36 minutes (Delta (DL)
#45 ? 10-Dec-2017 ? DUB / EIDW - KJFK ? FlightAware).
Those of us who "stuck it out" and remained on the flight were auto-rebooked on flight 2816 (JFK > ATL). *edited flight number
Well instead of holding the flight for us (at least a dozen), they "rolled-forward" the departure time, thereby screwing us.
This shows Delta's true colors.
Last edited by OHDL1; Dec 24, 2017 at 7:41 am
Dec 29, 2017, 11:46 am
#113
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Which is why the government statistics (and the coverage) are focused on on-time arrivals, not departures.
Dec 29, 2017, 12:29 pm
#114
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It's not at all expensive when you have a surplus of aircraft, are a hub-and-spoke carrier, and are into off-peak season. If you look at turn times, DL usually has leisurely turn times. They aren't pushing aircraft utilization very high, so padding schedules isn't an issue on the financial side. LCCs commonly look to maximize utilization because of their limited assets, but current legacies have more aircraft than needed most of the time.