k2

Reminds me of watching that show Whale Wars. The activists were such bumbling idiots that I found myself rooting for the Japanese whalers.

JohnnyRockets

No point counting just at ATL unless DL wants to fly to Doha. Whatever number DL gets from this can't really indicate how QR is doing or ME3 is affecting DL. The only thing DL will get is the load to Doha.

I would say this is more of 'in your face' retaliation similar to the haha no A380 gates for you.
Maybe in the future we might see an always broken on arrival CRJ occupy that gate before needing to tow out resulting in 50 mins delay and agents handing out HOOS along with AMEX application for QR pax.

DLERT

And another point - the counter clicker is just counting bodies boarding -
QR could have loads of non-revs moving around to give the image of
a profitable flight but then non-revs are just that NON-REVENUE so if QR
wants to paint a different picture (a losing one subsidized) well so much
for the profit picture.
Strange all these passengers coming and going to the same airport convention
all consistently dressed the same with the same carry ons !
Hey weren't those the same arriving passengers !
Curious if the clicker counter was observing the first/business class boarding
as well as the coach. Possible with 2 jetway bridges to enter by one - exit
by the other and then do it over again - with a 300 passenger aircraft do
this 6 times with 50 pax and voila flight full with 300 !
The ramp activity certainly is monitored observing the loading and unloading
of the baggage cargo containers and free cargo space.
Can you believe that they are loading the same inbound containers that
just came in and with the way the loading machinery is handling them -
THEY ARE EMPTY - they move too easily to be full - Oh well if you are running
a subsidized operation never mind never matter it is just a matter of giving a false impression !

ptcflyer

The service on QR is amazing relative to the Delta One offerings. The financial impact to Delta will be substantial. If QR were to take just 4 premium passengers per QR flight that would have paid $8,000 round trip on Delta One x 365 days per year = $11,680,000. (Destinations like MNL, SIN, BKK, HKG, JNB are directly competitive (Although going the opposite direction that Delta would take you). Nearly 100 more cities are competitive that would have been on a DL / SKYTEAM alliance flight). Once ATL Delta passengers realize the differences in service and value, that number could grow to 20 premium Passengers per QR Flight or a $58 Million impact from just the front cabin. The "Paying" Premium paying passengers are very difficult to replace.. and the lost of revenue would almost come significantly off Delta's Bottom Line! More importantly, QR would represent an additional wedge potentially helping sever the relationship between the SkyMiles Frequent Flyer and Delta. QR will school the Atlanta Flyers on what premium service should be.

Currently, QR offers approximately 11 Flights a day to North America. Between all of the ME3 Flights -- There are over 40 daily flights -- nearly a dozen with A380s. You start talking serious revenue and bottom line impacts to the US3. The US3 profits are being eroded from the bottom by Frontier / Spirit models and from the top by the ME3 and other Pacific carriers. The US3 have pushed their revenue / service monetization models about as far as they can and profit could contract significantly.

With every click on the DL agent's "clicker" -- Delta is seeing $$ go out the door. They need to be studying not only how many passengers are going out ATL's Gate F9 Every Day... but why they are going!

Ber2dca

They know why they're going. Their argument is that the Gulf carriers can offer a better product without charging more because they do not have to run sustainable businesses due to government subsidy.

DL is counting their pax to see just how unsustainable that route would be if QR had to operate like a regular airline in the market.

kop84

I think that the US3 are concered about ME3 flights from DOH/DXB/AUH to the US, but their much realer concern is more 5th freedom routes like MXP/JFK.

If you consider this a negotiation with the government, then you always ask for more than the base you're willing to accept. The US3 are asking for a halt to their US expansion from the Middle East. I think they'ed accept a halt to 5th freedom routes to the US. And I think many of the US3's EU counterparts are in strong agreement, and may find the support they need there.

As good as the service is on the ME3 - JFK/LAX/SYD is ~8,000 miles, but JFK/DXB/SYD is ~14,000 miles. The US3 and their partners in Australia are going to win a lot of that even with service that may not be ME3's A+, they can win with a B just due to time savings.

Now if the ME3 start more 5th freedom routes then the US3 and the EU and Asian carriers are in for a world of hurt.

And I don't know how many times I have to say this, but the ME3 are not anyone's friends. They aren't running superior service at a severe deficit because they want to help out the flying public. They're aiming to destroy international carriers and forcing them out. Then once the competition has fallen by the wayside, they'll jack up the prices.

The UAE and Qtar are trying to be less oil dependent for their economy. So they have subsidized their airlines to gain market share. They aren't looking to run at a loss forever, so all those trumpeting how great the ME3 are, lets pick up this discussion in 10 years if they get their way and see how happy you are when SkyTeam, OneWorld, and Star have all had to dramatically scale down their TATL/TPAC offerings and now you're only choice is the ME3. Doubtful you'll be finding those amazing fares for amazing service.

Pharaoh

Easy there. The fact is correct and directly addressed a few questions. Advisability, practicality and value attained were not addressed.

MS02113

By what definition does an employee quietly and unobtrusively counting a competitor's enplanements qualify as "retaliation"?

avcritic

Go Girl. I think Qatar folks are having difficulty to figure out on how to deal with her. If she was in plain clothes they can report to security. DL should send Jordan Schlansky to drive them nuts.

DL probably collecting information for upcoming DoS meeting with UAE/Qatar on Open Skies allegations by US3.

I think both DL and QR are confusing bloggers who were happy with writing about service and food with high quality images. Now poor bloggers have to deal with international politics, way beyond their education level.

btonkid12345

Or Jesse Watters. Not in a political sense...just to give them the runaround and make fun of them. That is the single thing he's good at.

FlyingWithers

OK, if DL does not immediately stop this OPEC will stop selling us oil.

What a nothing post.

FlyingWithers

Well, they can frighten them to death with the finger counter used by a disinterested DL employee.

ptcflyer

While there is some truth here as customers gravitate toward quality service, in reality, The UAE and Qatar use these airlines and the corresponding airport infrastructure as the "foyer" to their country. Since, virtually all, expats who are recruited to work in Qatar and UAE fly to and from via the ME3 Carrier gateways, having a first class, quality airline not only key to their airline operations and profits, but to the success and pride of the respective countries. The expectations of the National citizens are also quite high for quality service. The Quality will always be there to serve the locals and expats.

The cross connecting traffic will be used to help keep the flights full and provide incremental revenue for the expanded flight offerings that serve these growing ME O&D economies / markets. Like UAE, in Qatar, there are dozens, if not hundreds of large buildings under construction. These buildings are being filled with white collar expats, and the blue collar work force that serves them, from all over the world. A quality airline operation and airport infrastructure are key to helping recruit these people to live and work in Qatar. (Same for UAE). In the US, our airlines are transportation. In the ME, the carriers are an extension of national pride. Two very different operational criteria and business models.

Ber2dca

The attempts by Qatar and the Emirates to become global business hubs a la Hong Kong or Singapore are also part of their 'diversification' attempts.

The reality is that the rulers of these places have had a large quantity of money and were/are desperate to invest it in something that could outlast their oil supplies. That's fairly sensible but their approach has been marked by what you might call excessive investment. They flood the market with money to instantly buy credibility and brand power.

They inflated real estate prices in London by paying well over market value, just like they inflated the prices of soccer players via their investment in clubs such as Manchester City and Paris St. Germain. I find that quite comparable to their approach in the airline business. They hired prominent industry professionals to run the clubs and gave them carte blanche to spend enormous, unheard of sums on players who otherwise wouldn't want to join clubs which either didn't have much history of success (Man City) or play in a secondary league (PSG).

In the airline business, they eagerly hired industry pros to run the carriers and fulfill key functions, they bought flashy new planes, they equipped them with state-of-the-art cabins, they upgraded/expanded or built airports etc. In other words they invested and continue to invest incredible sums to acquire credibility as high-end carriers in order to convince people to travel using airlines without a historical reputation of being safe, reliable or high in quality and based in countries of dubious repute.

They have of course applied the same approach in upgrading the reputation of Dubai, Doha or Abu Dhabi as places. Lavish investment in new skyscrapers, new shopping malls, luxury hotels, infrastructure projects, securing international events etc.

DL probably doesn't care what those rulers do with their money in their countries, but DL rightfully is concerned when that sort of free-spending investment logic is used to bully them in their own market.

FlyingNone

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How was she not poised ? She calmly sat there grinning, not even answering the guy challenging her. That's pretty hard to do, stay calm and smiling when someone is trying to intimidate you. Odd method, I guess but certainly not against the law.