KLC

Never said I "didn't like" the thread; just pointing out related discussion. You know I'm not an argumentative person.

bwhite

The ignore list is your friend. It works wonders to accomplish what you seek but still allows free speech and thought.

wonderbleu

I have had equal opportunity to fly CO and NW for many years... and split my business because both products in our area were good. I truly feel there has been a big quality downgrade with the SM program. On a relative basis to WP and OP, SM comes in a distant, distant third. Pretty disappointed and finding myself flying DL less. -- Not really complaining...just stating the facts.

thepla

What surprised me was after merger and we were learning how SM and WP were going to be one that DL seemed to announce day after day something that got sooooo many people upset. Now there is a thread almost everyday like this, which surprises me, since everyone knows how DL ruined a good thing for EVERYONE... not just WP people.

I did go through some old threads and it seems when LUT fares were only getting 50% EQM their was a revolution here by some of the same people that now seem to tell us DL is great (fewer and fewer of these people even exist anymore, either they are posting on CO or complaining about DL).

Maybe they think it is smart to take away, get a complaint, and try to bring back at a higher level to acquire. Maybe they think it is smart to jump over a dollar to pick up a dime, I don't quite understand how a company could make so many negsative changes in such a short time... like I said everyday it seemed for awhile DL announced something negative.

Than the oh our next big and exciting enhancement to show best in class was going to be announced in a few months. ALL of us said wow, DL is going to come through for us. Here comes DL, what a bust.

Need we forget the BIG next announcement. Roll-over, what a joke that turned out to be when combined with DM. Jeff found a way for a loyalty program to promote dis-loyalty. HE will for sure be the topic of a business law review at Harvard on what to do to destroy a company.

Time will tell but I believe DL is on a fast path to the bottom and no way will dig their way out.

redtailshark

Interesting. I posted this originally in NW, but it was moved to DL.

But maybe this is more informative. Some of you must have been DL members for some time too, before the merger. I cannot believe that even SM was historically as abysmal as it clearly is now or DL would have many fewer elites than they apparently do following the force majeure.

It's strange how some people feel impelled to personalize this reflection on SM vs previous WP qualities. You can see fangs baring and hear the snarling and invective. But if those people had ever used the NW award system, they would understand what a gigantic difference there was between WP, which was best in class, and SM, which is :-: best in class :-: Then they would appreciate why commenting on, and analyzing the reasons for perception of, such differences by former WP members is highly rational and helpful. It places the SM program in comparative context with systems that many new DL medallions are familiar with.

And on that note, SM sucks compared to every WP benchmark. I cannot think of a single aspect of SM that I prefer to WP. Or to OP, come to that. Now, DL itself, could make a somewhat different case for the hard product. But that's not what I wanted to discuss in this thread.

Stripe, I have respect for your opinion. I do think that for those of us who travel a lot because of work obligations, that a decent FFP can be life enhancing in some meaningful ways - I don't contest there are more significant issues in life, but this is FT and the focus of our discussions here is the various FFP. Things like, particularly, effective redemption mechanisms to allow us to take families on vac as part-payment to them, ease of access through Elite facilities at airports, food in F, etc. All of this eases the discomfort of flying 100k plus per year.

I was a little hopeful, if skeptical, at this time last year. But that was before I'd experienced SM fully. Now I'm mildly cynical about SM and very glad I maxed out all redemptions on NWA.COM before it vanished. But since I don't load much paid travel onto DL any more, it is just an occasional frustration.

howl0007

+1

Stripe

True enough. NW's plat companion upgrade, good award redemption options, and access to the CO club in my home airport (to see others off or greet them, even when I wasn't flying) were significant benefits to my family. I put way more value on those than I would ever value something that benefits only me.

redtailshark

This is what I mean. I don't really care so much about F - if it's there, I'll ride in it - but I wouldn't trade the family life-enhancing FFP morsels for that.

Instead if MsShark and SharkJr want to go to LIS, then I want us to be able to go there on vacation, in J, once in a year. To do this, we need a reliable and honest award ticketing mechanism that sets out how many miles and $ we need for such redemption. And not at 550k!

Each business flight I take must advance us in some predictable way towards that goal or it's not worth selecting the airline concerned for that business travel. And as you say, companion upgrades, on all fare classes, when space available, are another broader benefit. The NW system was much better than the others in that respect. I didn't realize how useful it was until DL colonized WP. Then lounge access, yes. And irop recovery, Elite line handling of reservations. All of these attributes were effective family-wide benefits.

mike101

Wow.. if there is anyone that needs to get a life, it is you. If people are unhappy with the SkyMiles program, what do you get out of trying to silence us? Are you a DL stock owner, employee, or what? If you love the program so much and are confident that there is no better program out there, then support your argument with facts and prove us all wrong. Otherwise, the only way you can get us to praise Delta is to get these problems fixed, if you have the power to do so. If you were the only customer/employee etc etc of Delta, I can guarantee you that the company wouldn't exist.. Wake up and realize that a business is a business.

It is these kinds of posts that truly make me wonder just how many people Delta pays to make it appear as though some people actually haven't woken up to all the SkyMiles shenanigans yet.. not that you are one of these people, but with arguably one of the most deteriorated FF programs in the world, it is extremely odd to see these 'angry' posts attempting to silence the truth from being told.

So my advise for you if to move on and ignore the posts you do not wish to read, otherwise, you would just have to deal with it, and realize that MANY people are frustrated with this program and that you have nothing to gain from defending a FF program which IS NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE to defend at this point.

....


To answer the OP..

The SkyMiles program is MUCH WORSE than I thought it would be. Around August 2009 I began looking into Delta SkyMiles and already was let down because of all the downgrades, not to mention DL's choice to retain their expensive and useless Amex card over the WP Visa offered by US Bank. However this was not the end of it and in late 2009 early 2010, it became clear to me how dishonest and lousy the SkyMiles program was, especially with the website shenanigans and 'worst in class' SkyMiles shenanigans - particularly the devaluation of SkyMiles, false advertising on 'Low' awards, and difficulty of booking award tickets... In the present I am just glad that Delta lost their bid on JAL, which would have surely encouraged this abusive airline to raise prices...I am also in the process of transitioning over to AA and OneWorld, but am also considering the Star Alliance. What a shame because I live in a major Delta hub, and to lose your 'hub captives' says a lot about an airline, or in this case the FF program

Jaimito Cartero

DL is about 75% worse than I ever expected.

Many of the changes seemed designed to piss their elites off. Also the sneaky manner of many of the changes, and "Best in Class" dog and pony show got tiring very easily.

Don't get me wrong, DL is not 100% bad. A lot of their crews are nice, and I look forward to some better service on some of my Asian award flights. That is, if I can ever find any Biz seats at low.

I've had pretty good luck with calling into DL. Waits have been a few minutes longer at times than the NW line, but under 5 minutes.

It is rather amusing that the few DL apologists often seem to go postal over some of these complaints. I know many of them are by people who have really woken up and smelled the rancid DL coffee. They thought it might a little harder to book awards, but are now faced with reality that it's very difficult.

fti

I was a member of SM before the merger. Used it mainly for tickets when I wanted a stopover on domestic award tickets. That is one nice benefit that still remains (at least for now).

For the past few months, I have managed to live with the website re: award travel, mainly because I could fall back to nwa.com and figure out award availability that way. But just this morning I tried to look for an award ticket for a friend, using the "one way" trick. Well, one way cost 60K miles MSP-LYH even though round trip with the same outbound date only cost 42,500. How could that be?

I will live with the quirks for now, but am already booking away from DL when it fits for me. I certainly won't be transferring MR points to DL unless I am 100% sure I will be using the points immediately for an award ticket I found and booked. I am already topping up my AA and AS accounts with credit card miles before their annual fees kick in (first year free, etc).

indufan

I see not a damn thing has changed here. I thought I might come back and make a few posts and just see what it is like but I guess I will have to come back in a few more months or maybe not at all.

I want to make one thing very clear, there are a few posters that have completely ruined this forum. And there are many, many posters that don't come here anymore because of this. Me and many others simply got tired of saying what pbarnette said.

Seriously folks, how many times can you say the same thing?

Now, I am going to make one more post in this forum for now. You will see it in a little bit.

mike101

Are you serious? I was disgusted enough that Delta charges a r/t fare for one-way award tickets, but this is just taking it to another level. Just how inconsistent and chaotic is this website of theirs anyway? On the same note, I also wanna share that many times when I look for an award ticket on DL.com, the boxes (green, orange, red) are absolutely no indication of whether the price will be Low, Med, or High.. you just need to click each one to find out for sure. How frustrating is that.

mike101

I am pretty sure it's the other way around... there are very few posters such as pbarnette that ruin threads like this and turn simple discussions into arguments. It has become typical (in my opinion) for what some people call 'Delta apologists' to be the first ones to insert emotional, personal, and insulting remarks aimed at other users.. as can be verified by reviewing this thread. I see no reason why we cannot share our experiences with DL whether it be good, bad, or neutral. Unfortunately right now, these experiences are mostly bad (as you hinted) and that in my opinion is the fault of the SkyMiles program, not the people. The fact is that you feel that the same thing keeps getting repeated over and over again. The truth is that I believe this is because new people keep finding out these flaws we have mentioned in this thread on a regular basis and take the initiative to express their views. AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, despite all these complaints, NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE (which should be a wake up call to some of you). I don't think it is the same people starting the complaints/threads on a daily basis, do you think that is realistic? If you feel like taking a break from this forum, well it is sad to see you leave, but it is even sadder to know that someone still has yet to address the facts we are pointing out in here regarding the SkyMiles program, and instead chooses to make it appear as though everyone is complaining for absolutely no reason at all.

If the website had minor problems and the SM program was just slightly imperfect.. fine.. we might be whining.. but when there are new topics addressing new shenanigans that surprise people on a daily basis.. and NONE OF THESE PROBLEMS EVER SINCE HAVE BEEN FIXED despite all these concerns and complaints, then it's time to wake up!

motytrah

The biggest issue for me personally is International upgrades. Between the Y/B/M price model and the lack of visibility to the inventory online I'm having to think about other options for miles. This includes moving to a system based on either the US Bank FlexPerks or Amex MR.

I'm not sure what's gained by shouting people down. Worst case DL get's better and improves the program? Is that a bad thing? These situations take two to tango. And some here have pretty full dance cards.

I've read posts in this forum going back years. It wasn't all kumbaya. It's just easier to form "sides" now.

If anything, I wish people could learn to disagree without being disagreeable.