chargesmart.com
Dec 10, 2010 | 9:35 pm
#16
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 292
The large payment security fee 
appears to simply be a ploy to work around the fact that VISA's rules only permit flat fee convenience charges (with an exception for tax payments).
See this document:
http://usa.visa.com/download/merchan...tions-main.pdf
...and search for rule: 5.2.E
As I read the rule they wouldn't be permitted to charge any fee: The requirement for an alternate payment channel means that Mail/Telephone Order and Electronic Commerce Merchants whose payment channels are exclusively non-face-to-face may not impose a Convenience Fee., but that's probably been discussed elsewhere.
appears to simply be a ploy to work around the fact that VISA's rules only permit flat fee convenience charges (with an exception for tax payments). See this document:
http://usa.visa.com/download/merchan...tions-main.pdf
...and search for rule: 5.2.E
As I read the rule they wouldn't be permitted to charge any fee: The requirement for an alternate payment channel means that Mail/Telephone Order and Electronic Commerce Merchants whose payment channels are exclusively non-face-to-face may not impose a Convenience Fee., but that's probably been discussed elsewhere.
Anyhow, I have downloaded and at least glanced at the document you refer to, as it looks like a great reference to have for many other situations. Thank you!
Dec 10, 2010 | 9:46 pm
#17
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 292
Assuming that the "large payment security fee" is not a "bait and switch" sales tactic, then I guess the fee must somehow be dependent on information entered after step 1, such as the type of credit card being used. So, conceivably, you might be charged different numbers if you were to use a another brand of credit card such as MasterCard or Discover, or a debit card or a gift card.
Dec 29, 2010 | 5:26 am
#18
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Georgia
Programs: Delta Gold, Marriott Platinum, Amex Delta Reserve + Platinum MR. Y, I book.
Posts: 158
Quid Pro Quo, Yo!
I wanted to like this program ...
At step 4 I was shown a large payment security fee ... which is an insurance payment passed along to me - Joe Consumer - by ChargeSmart because other members of ChargeSmart might not pay their debt.
This killed it for me - because if I were to commit to CS for a year - that fee alone would be 420 bucks for the year + 180 for the flat fee for 21600 miles.
If there is such a large number of charge-offs to warrant this high fee - then I would propose an alternative to the company that would make the deal worth while to me.
Offer the consumer either the large payment security fee - or the option to make an initial security deposit equivalent to the maximum amount I will charge using the service monthly. IE ... my 1800 mortgage + my 300 car payment would require me to make a one time deposit of 2100.00. That money would still be mine but held by them. ChargeSmart could keep any interest earned off the account until such time as I withdraw the money /and or close the account. If the amount being charged exceeds the 'security DEPOSIT' - then the large security fee would be the only one listed for use at payment time.
Keeps their charge-offs down - and keeps me from repeatedly wasting money on that insurance fee.
At step 4 I was shown a large payment security fee ... which is an insurance payment passed along to me - Joe Consumer - by ChargeSmart because other members of ChargeSmart might not pay their debt.
This killed it for me - because if I were to commit to CS for a year - that fee alone would be 420 bucks for the year + 180 for the flat fee for 21600 miles.
If there is such a large number of charge-offs to warrant this high fee - then I would propose an alternative to the company that would make the deal worth while to me.
Offer the consumer either the large payment security fee - or the option to make an initial security deposit equivalent to the maximum amount I will charge using the service monthly. IE ... my 1800 mortgage + my 300 car payment would require me to make a one time deposit of 2100.00. That money would still be mine but held by them. ChargeSmart could keep any interest earned off the account until such time as I withdraw the money /and or close the account. If the amount being charged exceeds the 'security DEPOSIT' - then the large security fee would be the only one listed for use at payment time.
Keeps their charge-offs down - and keeps me from repeatedly wasting money on that insurance fee.
Dec 29, 2010 | 6:49 am
#19
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,905
Please see the discussion on ChargeSmart's well-known bait and switch tactic in this thread:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...tuition-3.html
Suggest moderators merge thread into the existing one, or extract pertinent posts related to ChargeSmart into new thread.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...tuition-3.html
Suggest moderators merge thread into the existing one, or extract pertinent posts related to ChargeSmart into new thread.
Jan 12, 2011 | 1:20 pm
#20
Join Date: May 2004
Location: SFO sometimes
Programs: UA 1K, AA gold, A3 gold
Posts: 1,635
with a $500 max on a giftcard, I can't figure out how to make the math work for the cashback to offset the high fees chargesmart.com charges...
1. bigcrumbs appears to offer a profitable giftcards.com rebate: a 2.4% rebate on $500 card fees are $4.95 activation + $0.44 US mail shipping, so you make 1.322%. This is important to the topic of this thread because the gift cards are Visa or MasterCard and chargesmart.com does not yet accept American Express (but their customer support says they are actively working on it).
2. I recently called chargesmart.com and was told that they now no longer authorize car payments above $1,500/month, even if you call on the phone. Also, you are not allowed to do payments on certain account numbers for some car loans from at least one car loan company that they list. I am not sure the reason, but customer service made clear it is not a software problem but a real business issue (maybe loans from certain states, intermediated by certain financial institutions, who knows).
3. williampaid started accepting American Express a couple of weeks ago. Also message #151 at http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...online-11.html indicates that an updated promotion for FlyerTalkers from WilliamPaid may be forthcoming.
[Edit 12/3/2010: I hasten to hasten to add a warning that I have not completed a purchase from any of these vendors yet.]
[Edit 12/3/2010: Changed "almost 1.4%" to "1.322%" for giftcards.com. Sorry for the bad math! Also specified US mail shipping.]
2. I recently called chargesmart.com and was told that they now no longer authorize car payments above $1,500/month, even if you call on the phone. Also, you are not allowed to do payments on certain account numbers for some car loans from at least one car loan company that they list. I am not sure the reason, but customer service made clear it is not a software problem but a real business issue (maybe loans from certain states, intermediated by certain financial institutions, who knows).
3. williampaid started accepting American Express a couple of weeks ago. Also message #151 at http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...online-11.html indicates that an updated promotion for FlyerTalkers from WilliamPaid may be forthcoming.
[Edit 12/3/2010: I hasten to hasten to add a warning that I have not completed a purchase from any of these vendors yet.]
[Edit 12/3/2010: Changed "almost 1.4%" to "1.322%" for giftcards.com. Sorry for the bad math! Also specified US mail shipping.]
Jan 12, 2011 | 2:54 pm
#21
Flyertalk Posting Legend Moderator: Credit Card Programs, American Express, Capital One, Chase, Citi, Diners Club, Eco Travel, Signatures
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA, IHG & Marriott Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 51,863
Moderator action
Closed because there is substantial discussion of Chargesmart in this thread:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...e-tuition.html
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...e-tuition.html
