Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Dec 2, 2017, 11:36 am
#2866
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
No. I had to explicitly ask for a receipt, and it only said I paid by Visa. They had a stylus attached to the terminal, so digital signature capture may be supported.
Dec 2, 2017, 11:37 am
#2867
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SFO
Programs: *G^2, Bonvoyed, NEXUS
Posts: 3,516
That means it was not performed. It doesn’t mean it is not supported. It is still supported in Apple Pay AMEX direct issued cards. What card/wallet are you using?
Dec 2, 2017, 3:17 pm
#2868
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Canada
Programs: BA Gold (OWE), Star Alliance Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,194
Android Pay and Samsung Pay, it's on all transactions. Direct Amex issued cards. My Visa in the same wallet doesn't give the no ODA tag on the same terminals.
Dec 2, 2017, 3:18 pm
#2869
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SAN
Posts: 1,171
When I got a WF credit card I applied in-branch. I had a choice of something like five designs, only one of which came with contactless. I chose one of the non-contactless designs. It wasn't until I called and requested an EMV card that I got one from them with contactless.
Dec 2, 2017, 3:24 pm
#2870
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SFO
Programs: *G^2, Bonvoyed, NEXUS
Posts: 3,516
The TVR for Visa Contactless is always all 0s
Dec 2, 2017, 3:44 pm
#2871
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
The one Taco Bell that I know of around here with MX915s still doesn't have EMV enabled. Probably not too much of a surprise though.
Also, the IKEA here isn't using EMV yet either.
Also, the IKEA here isn't using EMV yet either.
Dec 2, 2017, 7:29 pm
#2872
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Well my local water machines got an update. Wouldn’t you believe the thing even takes EMV! I can see people being confused by the location of the EMV reader.
Dec 2, 2017, 10:29 pm
#2873
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: New England
Programs: American Gold, Marriott Gold, Hilton Silver
Posts: 5,644
Is that thing hooked up to the tap/water supply? Because that's the only way they'd make money after processing fees :O
I'd also imagine that the margin is pretty slim.
I'd also imagine that the margin is pretty slim.
Dec 2, 2017, 11:05 pm
#2874
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
I presume that's 25c/gallon, meaning that a five gallon container would cost $1.25. That amount is about typical for vending machines and they manage to make it work.
Dec 2, 2017, 11:08 pm
#2875
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
Saw this at a Haggen-Daz. Has anyone seen this message with PAX terminals before? Can this message mean that Quick Chip could be supported? (I used contactless, but the cashier had to push a button to do so, so QC likely wasn't used. I'll be glad once that goes away.)
Dec 2, 2017, 11:12 pm
#2876
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MCN
Posts: 179
Looking at their website, they refer to a "five-step filtration process" so I'm sure it's just hooked up to the municipal water supply. If they're selling a gallon which costs somewhere between 1-3 cents wholesale for 25 cents (or more; I'm seeing prices of 35-40 cents/gallon as typical), they're making good money even with electricity, filters, maintenance, and card processing fees.
Dec 3, 2017, 12:53 am
#2877
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,723
California Pizza kitchen uses a similar system to Village Inn with RXXXX on the receipt and the same ui on the VX820. Android Pay Visa worked great but amex physical card said use chip reader.
Dec 3, 2017, 1:47 am
#2878
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
Selling a cup for $0.25 is still a 500% profit margin most likely.
Dec 3, 2017, 8:56 am
#2879
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: RDU
Programs: DL(PM), UA(Silver), AA(EXP) Marriott(Ti), HH(Gold), Hertz(PC)
Posts: 2,669
Dec 3, 2017, 9:12 am
#2880
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: FRA/SXB
Programs: FB Gold
Posts: 1,999
Getting irritated at the messed-up implementation of contactless in the US....
Whereas my Paypal Debit Mastercard is the most favourable contactless outside the US, a lot of places in the US don't like it.
"Card Read Error"......"Card not accepted" ......"Card not read, try again" happens more often than not.
The swipe and insert works fine. But I guess the MSD implementation used in the US doesn't take well to a debit MC.
Whereas my Paypal Debit Mastercard is the most favourable contactless outside the US, a lot of places in the US don't like it.
"Card Read Error"......"Card not accepted" ......"Card not read, try again" happens more often than not.
The swipe and insert works fine. But I guess the MSD implementation used in the US doesn't take well to a debit MC.