Global Blue is so bad I'd rather just pay the tax and have it go to the country I enjoyed rather than go through a huge hassle to get less than half the tax and let them take most of the tax...

This is not so much DCC but Global Blue taking maximum advantage of multi-currency processing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=6982&p=3 #21

Hotels.com and Agoda does this too - but since they are selling not refunding they don't levy a fee.

But still better than taking cash - I've a mate who's taken cash refund in UK and left his card detail as deposit. Global Blue claimed he did not submit stamped docs in UK within the required 21 days and fined him gbp 40. His refund was only half that. He charged back (he photoed his stamped docs) but bank refused chargeback in the first instance, he's escalating the complaint.

When buying in EU I tend to think the refund is a contingent asset I may or may not get and discount the refund accordingly. Ah I better copy this post to my wife - we're there in a fortnight.

No DCC so far experienced in Malta.. which is kinda surprising..

We bumped into the same thing in Europe this summer, though I forgot to check the rate exactly. I made sure to give them my multi-currency ICBC card for the refund so I'd get EUR back and I ended up getting it in USD. A little over 600EUR became 680USD.

This is why my family prefers tax-free shopping in Japan; the tax is taken off at the store, and all you have to do is drop off the slip at Customs when you leave.

The mate visits Japan a lot more than EU and said as much.

This scam is so annoying it hurts. Traveling throughout Europe I was constantly offered the option for DCC. Just for laughs I would always as the server or front desk what they suggested and they almost always suggested I use my local US currency or said it didn't matter. I then explained to them that it does matter... and what they are saying is untrue. One nice waitress sat with me while we checked the conversion rates and when she saw the difference she was aghast. She said she'd never again offer it to any customers. Such a scam and so many people are unaware. This should be illegal.

That's very nice. Here in Asia most wait staff just do what their employers want to do as opposed to the right thing by their customers, especially visitors when the customers aren't likely to be repeat customers.

I have never felt that DCC was encouraged in Asia rather that it was impossible to opt out under some circumstances.

"Impossible to opt out" is a subset of "encourage".

I have actually never seen a pos machine, in which opting out is truly impossible, but figuring out the opt out can waste a lot of time.

What is painful is seeing how many people fall for the DCC scam. People see their home currency and think they're getting a deal. I've seen quite a few people selecting DCC for ATM withdrawals at UK airports, where the rates built in a 12% markup, no better than exchanging money at the bureaux de change counter at the airport!

Is that covered by their best rate guarantee?

That's the thing, the MAJORITY of customers want DCC, even when they know the exchange rate markup, I think most people are indifferent - they'll try to opt-out if possible (usually) if they know the difference, but they don't really care much.

That's how DCC survives. There's no real alternative. Amex, but they have very few FTF-free cards. Discover can stop DCC, but as I learned it can also result in FORCED DCC.

That's not true anymore... Amex has been removing fts from many of its cards now. Starwood Amex, Delta Amex and Premier Rewards Gold Amex no longer have ftfs.

The funny thing is. In the UK all of the Amex issued cards have a forex fee. Almost non of the Amex cards issued by third party banks in the UK do.

I thought Discover was immune to the DCC disease?

I'm uncertain if a majority of customers want DCC when they're aware of the markup, especially if they have a 0% FTF card. I think the scam continues because people end up paying for their ignorance. They first pay by not using a 0% FTF card and pay again when being corralled toward DCC. I got ripped off multiple times on my first trip (and subsequent trips) to Spain simply because I was ignorant of what it was. I remember asking the waitress in Spanish why I was seeing USD on the receipt and her reply was something to the effect of, "It's only for your information." I fell for it at the time, and it was only after visiting the fine city of Macau with a fixed exchange rate to HKD (and my association USD) how much I was getting ripped off. :mad::mad::mad:

I will not prevent people from paying for their ignorance (although I try to coach), but at least give those in the know a way to opt out.

For stateside issued cards, AmEx has become a viable option to prevent DCC, but we've determined informally on this thread that the exchange rates aren't as favorable as a 0% Visa/MC if you're converting from a currency without a fixed exchange rate. For example, with a USD-denominated card you're okay to use AmEx in HK or China since the exchange rate is fixed for HK or a narrow band for China. In fact, my wife mandated I use AmEx after an upscale dinner in Hong Kong one night to avoid a scene when the bill came. :D