JonIND

I received this same message for a flight this wednesday from IND-IAH on which I was was waitlisted as part of a First/BusinessFirst reward ticket (NOT reward upgrade) to Palau. I'm traveling on my honeymoon, and my wife is already confirmed in First. From previous threads, I thought that passengers on F/BF reward tickets *were* eligible to be confirmed at the airport as standbys at relatively high priority on the standby list (PR1). I called the Elite Desk and was told, no, that's not the case - I will not be eligible to standby at the airport for First because the airport does not have access to reward inventory.

What's the real story here????

J.Edward

It sounds like the elite desk was wrong. If you have redeemed a BF/F award (and it sounds like you have) you are eligible to standby at the airport for first class at the PR1 level. Remember, when you get to the airport avoid using the word "upgrade" as the semantics will cloud the issue. Rather say you have paid for a First Class ticket and do not yet have a seat in that cabin and need to be placed on the PR1 standby list.

The agent may come back and say something like: we can't do mileage upgrade at the airport / we have no way of knowing if you took out the correct amount of miles / only revenue F customer may be placed on the PR1 list / etc.

If this happens tell them again this is not an upgrade and to reference "gg onestandby" lines 87-91 and they should (I think) be able to verify the mileage paid for the trip by checking the fare basis as it will be the reward code used.

Either way congrats on the honeymoon! Sounds like your marriage is off to a great start as you've got the concept regarding the Mrs. right...she flies first...period.

JonIND

Thanks, J.Edward, for confirming what I thought, and for the SONIC "gg" reference.

I just found an earlier posting from Scott that also seems to confirm this:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showt...53#post5933053

However, he also says that for First Class/BusinessFirst Standard & EasyPass Awards, "Waitlists are valid up to check-in." So why did mine expire 24 hours beforehand? It sounds like CO's waitlist canceling program is not properly distinguishing between passengers waitlisted for upgrade rewards vs. passengers waitlisted for First/Businessfirst travel rewards. Perhaps Scott can clarify...

J.Edward

Glad I could help. Regarding the waitlist being canceled here's how I think it works:

Waitlisting and standing-by are two separate processes governed by different entities. Waitlisting occurs before a flight goes to airport control while 'standby' refers to the domain of the airport. Granted from the customers' perspective waitlisting and standing by are the same thing: a list governing who'll be next in line to receive empty seats but from the operational side they are two different things.

Hence when the 24-hour mark rolls around all waitlists are canceled and the customer notified of the cancellation. In the upgrade case this is would be the 'end' as you cannot standby for a mileage-based upgrade at the airport (EUA's not withstanding). However, in your case you can as you're technically a displaced first customer.

So to sum up:

Waitlist: governed by the world of reservations and OnePass. They are valid until canceled when the flight goes to airport control at about the 24-hour mark.

‘Standby’ lists: governed by the airport agents.

CO 1E

I don't have any experience with airport waitlists on F/BF reward tickets, as I've just never found myself in a situation with a F/BF reward that was only confirmed in coach as of the 24 hour mark. I'm wondering, however, what your experience has been in this area: do you find that when you're traveling on a F/BF reward that did not clear into F/BF before the 24 hour mark, the airport agents know what you're talking about when you ask to stadby for F? In addition, what has your success rate been with respect to clearing the standby list at the airport?

J.Edward

So far my lucks been good (knock on wood)

The recent experience I have with this is a ticket I made for mom to go from IAH-EWR-PEK-EWR-IAH. Redeemed the BF award but she did not clear the overwater segments. As Mom was leaving about the same time I was for the CLE do late last year I thought I'd go with her to the airport and make sure there was no confusion regarding the issue.

Good thing I did as it took a 4 way conference call with me, an IAH PClub agent, the lead concierge in EWR and the OP Int'l reward desk before we finally reached a resolution due to uncovering the sonic refrences (and she did get the upgrade both ways ^)

Anyway, the source of confusion revolved around a semantics issues IMHO as the concierge are trained to know "NO BF MILEAGE UGPRADES ON THE DAY OF DEPATURE" but not so much on the other fine points of OnePass. Hence the thing I had to battle against was proving this was NOT and upgrade, rather re-seating a customer in the class of service they paid for. Thankfully in the end I was able to get a hold of the exact sonic reference stating reward customers could standby for the front cabin on the day of departure and that saved my (or I guess Mom's) backside.

That said, it has been my experience that most agents will only vaguely know this rule. As soon as they here "upgrade" and "BF" they immediately say no as they assume (and justifiably so) the customer wants to use mileage to upgrade...which you can't do. That's why it's important to know exactly what you're talking about as well as the supporting references to back up your case. Agents can easily dismiss a customer who appears to only poor grasp on what s/he's talking about but when you start pulling out sonic references you'll often catch their attention and be taken more seriously.

The success rate has been quite good for me (100%) as on the international flights there's virtually no competition for empty seats. That said, I've got a HKG BF reward coming up which has not yet cleared...and I suspect will clear at the airport, if at all.

ContinentalFan

IMHO, the real story is that Continental needs to do something to streamline the whole process in some way. There just seem to be too many questions about the whole upgrade/mileage reward process. I don't see an upside to having frustrated customers. I have no idea what the answer is; I do know that there seems to be an issue.

bocastephen

On this, we are in agreement for sure. Although CO considers the BF product very much above offerings from UA and AA, I can't imagine those carriers are not suffering revenue loss from people pulling the same 'inside 24hr' shenanigans that CO suffers from - yet they don't have similar restrictive procedures.

In this day and age there must be a way to track who is doing this activity and stopping them - or perhaps taking the opposite approach and permitting 'trusted customers' to earn the privilege of a streamlined upgrade process up-through and including departure time.

Btw, how in the world did you get almost 12,000 posts in under 1 year? That is like an average of 37 posts each and every day. I thought I was on this website too much

Bonehead

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=644286

Search for Continentalfan...

craz

What if the IAH-EWR portion cleared but not the EWR-PEK, will CO refund any of the difference between BF & Coach mileage? Could one simply tell them since EWR-PEK hasnt cleared I want to remain in Coach for the whole way, yet leave it stilll in Limbo for the return? I imagine if nothing cleared on the IAH-EWR-PEK routing and one stays in Coach that CO will refund the difference

CO 1E

If only the domestic portion of an international BF reward itinerary clears into F, CO will refund the difference between BF and standard coach for that entire portion of the itnerary (in your example, IAH-EWR-PEK).

J.Edward

As I understand it CO bases refunds solely on the BF flights (EWR-PEK in Mom's case) regardless of class of travel for the non BF flights.

If the IAH-EWR protion cleared and the EWR-PEK section did not, CO would refund the mileage difference between the standard F and standard Y reward. A BF reward to Asia (Series 4) is 60,000 miles one-way for F so CO would refund 30,000 in this case. Should Mom have flown in Y for the IAH-EWR and J for EWR-PEK than no refund would be forthcoming.

It will always be in the customers best interests to take the big seat on the 'non-BF' segments as CO does not base the refund qualification of class flown on such segments.

It's the same for mileage upgrades to BF too.

A little more than a year ago I tried to upgrade a DEN-EWR-HKG ticket and the DEN-EWR cleared immediately but the EWR-HKG upgrade never materialized. CO still refunded me the mileage in full, as per their policy, for my outbound upgrade as the BF sector did not clear even though the domestic/non-BF upgrade did clear.

craz

Thanks, now lets try and take it 1 step further, Can I cash out for a BF tkt even though it cant be confirmed but CO can confirm me in Coach? (FWIW Im based right near EWR so Im not trying to game the sysytem for a free FC UP on the Dom part , knowing that the BF wont ever clear, although thats not a bad game), Its just that most Intl flights a free BF isnt attainable and yet there very likely will be open seats if they didnt sell out, my way theres nothing to lose as long as its BF that one wants, so it clears great if not the miles difference goes back in, nothing lost

J.Edward

You certainly can my friend!

Here are the instructions: "Plan B" for BF reward travel

CO 1E

Yes - you just have CO deduct the BF mileage from your account and select a seat in coach for the international portion. As you say, if it clears at the airport or before, great - you fly upfront; if not, oh well, take your bulkhead coach seat and spend your refunded miles on another reward.