Later this summer (over a week surronding a big holiday) I have non stop tickets for EWR to YVR and back on the seasonal nonstop CO flights.

I successfully used expiring HP miles to upgrade to first class and have seats assigned. I noticed today that the outbound has 0 available seats in all classes sans Y2. Does CO overbook first class? It seems to me they have probably sold more seats on this plane then there are seats.. but I was wondering if they overbook first, or just coach?

If so does anyone have any experience with being bumped from first class and what type of comp would one get? We (self and girlfriend) would probably be willing to take a later connecting flight (NW? through MSP or CO through IAH) but would have to be worth it.

Unfortuntatly for me I would be much more willing to take a bump on the return flight but that does not appear to be nearly as full at this point.

Gate Agents tell me they never overbook FC INTENTIONALLY. He said that he's seen screw-ups between NW and CO where they had more butts than seats to put them in. He's seen it happen "once or twice".

Revenue trumps all. Someone who paid for FC is obviously not going anywhere. He said after that that order of Elites determine who loses (ie: a Silver will be sent back to coach before a Gold would). We didn't get to finish the conversation, as he then got bombarded by customers.

I don't know if there is any compensation. I would think that if it were an Elite upgrade, there probably wouldn't be much if anything. I don't know if using miles puts you ahead or behind Elites.

Great question though!


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"I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own."

Jon,

While my upgrade was not for money... it was not free. I used miles which I view as a form of currency.

I would think that would put me ahead of an elite upgrade.

In this case since the flight is still 5 weeks out and ITN shows A0, D0, F0, etc. that no elite upgrades will be had unless there are no shows when the plane is boarded.

I was just curious if the A0, D0 meant that it was oversold - or just sold to capacity.

It certainly looks as if some people are going to get bumped from this... but I don't think it will be me as I am not willing to give up my first class non stop for $300 and a coach connecting seat. (Now talk real $$ and a first class connection and we may have something).

They do not intentionally overbook FC, I dont think any airline would.

On a recent HP flight, LAS-JFK, they had 3 extra people in FC than seats, duplicate seat assignments. The flight was full, they needed 3 FC volunteers, I happily gave up my seat for $1000 in vouchers.
Why was I so happy, the next flight out was cancelled, the morning flight they rebooked me on, was oversold in coach, I got bumped off that one for $600. They then rebooked me on a flight to EWR, which I got bumped for $500, and finally back on the red-eye 24 hrs later, back in FC

As for oversold, you need to call the airline and ask. They'll even tell you by how many it is oversold.

It is indeed rare that I see a pre-departure overbook in A - and when I have seen it it's always been on a larger plane - example a 757 booked 24 25 25 or a 777 booked 48 49 49

Boy, I'd hate to be the 49th on the list for FC on a 777

Depending on the route, and day of the week, there is a "no show" factor of at least 10 percent, since these are "no penalty" tickets for the most part.

Correct - also called the "show" factor. Here's a (very) non-scientific eample:

Say a 757 flight(which has 24 seats in A and 159 in Y, for a total of 183 'ACTUAL' seats) is authorized for booking up to 24/181.

On the day of the flight, all 24+181 authorized bokings have been made. Therefore, the boked total is 205.

OK, say for Thursday, this flight has a 88% 'show' factor. 205 times 88% = 180.4
(Round up to 181).

So, if yield management had done its job, there will be but 2 empty seats for those forlorn nonrev standbys to utilize

Many years ago I had access to non rev status with one of the majors for a very brief period. I made the mistake of believeing I could fly non rev to Tampa for the weekend ... not realizing that it was the tail end of Presidents week and all of the families needed to leave on Sunday eve with me (or w/o me as the case might be).

Getting in to FL on Friday was doable... but when I went to leave my nice Tampa ... EWR became Tampa...MSY...IAH...EWR.

Which quickly taught me that in season non rev tickets are worth less than the price paid.

I do appreciate the information. It sounds like if I am holding first class seats I am unlikely to have or be offered a bump unless something happens to foul the system and they overbook by mistake.

"Revenue trumps all. Someone who paid for FC is obviously not going anywhere. He said after that that order of Elites determine who loses (ie: a Silver will be sent back to coach before a Gold would"


Actually, I think a boarding pass in your hand and a doopah in that seat trumps all. If you have a legal, valid, boarding pass, I don't see how they can force you to go anywhere. What are they going to do, call a cop when they already agreed with you that you would sit there, for whatever the consideration was- be it dollars, miles, or an upgrade earned simply by virtue of elite status-- the latter by the rules the airlines themselves make.

Now if they make it worth your while to move, and do so on the spot, well that's another story.

I would SUSPECT that upgrades via miles would trump Elite, as you are using airline scrip.

You also have the advantage of being confirmed in FC days, weeks or even months before the upgrade window opens.

However I can't say this for certain.

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"I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered. My life is my own."

I'm sure each airline has a specific, and slightly different, policy for these type of situations. Probably written by their legal dept.

On my trip last weekend, the HP flight with multiple people with the same first class seat number on their boarding pass. I asked the HP supervisor, she was already on board, trying to work things out, who would get bumped if they didnt get volunteers? She told me, she'd have to give the seat to the person who's name was on the passenger manifest, which in this case was not the person sitting in the seat.

Of course, at this time, all seats coach and FC were taken. They doubled the offer of compensation from 500 to 1000 and got the volunteers they needed. I think one or 2 FC passengers ended up getting coach seats, I'd suspect they were given some compensation also.

Since I was hoping to get bumped, I was a very happy person. I'm also going to assume that there were no Non-revs on the flight, as I'd imagine they'd be bumped before a rev.

One of the other volunteers asked me if we should have held out till they raised the offer. I said, no, I think they would get 3 volunteers without us at $1000.
Of course it was vegas, but I took the sure thing rather than gamble. Turned out to be a good thing, as I "let it ride" twice and ended up with $2100.

don't be so sure they won't take you off.

on friday the wknd of july 4th, i was travelilng through mem on nw, when i met a bunch of ladies (about 7 of them) at the really GOOD bbq place in terminal b. they were all there because they were booked on a morning flight to msy that was WAY OVERBOOKED. nw asked for volunteers, and kept upping the offer, but could not get the amount of passengers needed. so, they then did a computer random selection to pull people off the plane!!!

the ladies got free tickets and food vouchers but had no other recourse. and the worst part was they were not even guaranteed seats on either of the next two flights (also heavily overbooked). they potentially may have had to wait until saturday morning for a flight. needless to say, they were not pleased. they had bought their tickets in february, and still got bumped involuntarily. this random computer serach actually pulled a woman off and left her husband on the flight.

i have never heard of something so OUTRAGEOUS!!!

Now if you tell me her husband was a computer programmer, then i might understand

?Really good bbq place in terminal B? I am not really familiar with IAH but will be making a conneciton there in 3 weeks from FLL ... IAH ... SFO.

Will I be in Terminal B?

What is the name of the BBQ place and what gates is it near?

Haven't had good BBQ since my brother lived in Ft Worth and I used to go to the railhead.

Thanks