|
Originally Posted by kb1992
(Post 14874311)
I know what you mean.
CAL playbook is based on Air IAH/EWR/CLE philosophy so you don't need to offer a lot of benefits to elites when you are the only player in town. Do that trick to UA elites in SFO/ORD/IAD, and see what happens. I hope Jeff is smart enough to realize that he can't run UA as the way he ran CO. Regardless of that, they are very careful and efficient operationally. And that's not a bad thing. For example, CO achieves the highest rate of aircraft utilization in the industry, and this is achieved through careful planning and keeping the fleet as simple as possible. Of course, no matter what, that's all going to change now to some extent as the scope of the airline is so much greater. But I would expect CAL to bring its terrific tradition of efficiency to the combined operations of UaCo. Where they can take this too far, is if they eliminate a product like UA P.S. simply because it requires a sub-fleet whose planes could not be deployed on other lines. What the folks at UAUA will have to show them is that so-called inefficiencies are fine if they are sources of net revenue... |
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14874242)
All agreed.
As far as the tulip goes, I think you can understand it's an emotional, sensitive topic for them. I remember when I first saw TWA planes painted in the "transition livery," it was very painful to me. We all need to remember that the brick does not love you. ;) |
A Low Dull Ache
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14874638)
Continental, the airline has disappeared. Airlines change their livery every so often but yet their name remains on the planes.
I had a love/hate relationship w/ EAL for many many years but I was much sadder than I could have imagined when it shut down I was on their last flight from ATL to SRQ that final night I've got about 40 years (of 50 flying) w/ CAL (very sad indeed) My sympathy SFOgate |
Originally Posted by carvalh2
(Post 14865012)
Me too. I was just chatting with a 17 year veteran FA today and she wasn't happy. Said there was a lot of animosity with the old timers. Something about how UA used to be nasty and mean when CO was at the bottom. She gave me some examples that I cannot remember now. I asked about Norma, and she said she heard that she is going to hang it up. She does not want to work with UA ppl.
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14873628)
G:rolleyes::rolleyes:d Grief......how long is this pi$$ing in the wind going to continue.
We all have horror stories.....get over it already. |
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14874344)
Where they can take this too far, is if they eliminate a product like UA P.S. simply because it requires a sub-fleet whose planes could not be deployed on other lines.
What the folks at UAUA will have to show them is that so-called inefficiencies are fine if they are sources of net revenue... |
Originally Posted by BearX220
(Post 14873366)
...Where employees think nothing of telling customers the premium cabins are full so they can stock them with non-revs, deadheaders and friends ("employee class");
With the new GIDS and enhanced technology, do you really think a GA is going to just skip over a bunch of 1ks clearly on the list in order to put all the non-revs up front? :rolleyes:
Originally Posted by BearX220
(Post 14873366)
I've been flying United for forty years and I share the conclusion the Wall Street Journal reached during UA's years-long abuse of the bankruptcy laws: it just isn't a very good airline.
|
Have been with One pass since 1988 (actually got some Eastern miles transferred when I joined). I think the program started in 1987. Am a bit sad, but I certainly do not miss the virtual non availability or hit or miss availability of awards. Actually I had better luck with united.
Now we will how the new program will look like. It appears that the programs will be integrated only in fall 2011 or early 2012. |
Originally Posted by BearX220
(Post 14873366)
I've been flying United for forty years and I share the conclusion the Wall Street Journal reached during UA's years-long abuse of the bankruptcy laws: it just isn't a very good airline. Every credible industry ranking and survey bears this out. Say what you will about Joe Brancatelli, but he was right about UA when he wrote this column:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25083833/ There are plenty of UA loyalists/apologists on Flyertalk, of course, although I think they may not realize how different the 1K experience is from the standard deal. And I'm sorry to see you're among them, as I've always enjoyed and valued your contributions here.. 1. I respect Joe Brancatelli and value his views. The article is spot on, but, like the "Summer From Hell," is dated. A lot has changed at UA since 2008. Not everything, mind you, but a lot. For one thing, UA started making money. Their profit margins, in fact, easily exceeded those of CO. Second, UA will be the number-one on-time carrier in the United States in 2010 for the second year running. 2. I feel awkward of even defending UA because I don't have any stake in it. I'm a former CO elite who decided to start flying UA in 2006 and I have always been very pleasantly surprised. I only recently achieved the lowest elite tier (Premier) and have, in fact, only done one roundtrip as a Premier. Otherwise, all my flights on UA were as a non-elite and I never had a single experience with a single UA employee in five years that was anything but friendly and professional. I am not saying that poor service doesn't happen, but it has never happened to me. 3. As far as the issues with the UA bankruptcy, sure they were questionable, but then again Continental has been through two bankruptcies itself, and while the common analysis pawns off the dirtiest tricks in these bankruptcies to Frank Lorenzo, the fact is these dirty tricks were key to righting the carrier and allowing it to compete. And speaking of Joe Brancatelli's article and its provocative title, naming United the "Worst Airline Ever." Alas, United has a lot of competition in this category including my own favorite TWA (The Worst Airline) and also Continental, which was perhaps the first carrier to fall from its grace following airline deregulation in 1978. After all, Gordon Bethune titled his book "From Worst to First," meaning, of course, that CO had been the worst. So the point it things are changing all the time. CO was once the worst but yet you do not refuse to fly them, which makes sense, of course, because they have long since improved. While the time frame with United is a little different, and while I do not think United has become "The First," they have improved dramatically as well and deserve an open mind from you. Finally, you mentioned all of UA's comically failed low-cost ventures such as Ted or Shuttle by United, and yes, these were both failures. But to be fair, let's not forget that Continental tried much the same thing with Continental Lite, which was a dismal failure and cost the airline a lot of money. United definitely has issues. But so does Continental. And I think in 2010 United, surprisingly, can bring a lot to the table that can improve the combined carrier. |
Thinking positive... I'm a United flyer who loves Continental
I've learned to have very low expectations of air travel in general, no matter what logo appears on the tail wing. But I have had wonderful experiences on UA since I started flying them in July 2009.
For New Yorkers, some good news...In my experience, the New York based crews have been the best (when talking to FAs, they have told me it's because the ORD and SFO bases are so large that nobody knows anyone else, so crew morale is not the same). ORD is definitely busy and feels impersonal compared to JFK, but United has been good to me overall. I'm really happy being a NY based 1K (and was also just as happy when I was a Premier and Premier Exec). My recent experience on Continental EWR-PVG in BusinessFirst really impressed me...the food was good, the seats were excellent (new configs both ways), and the FAs were wonderful. I personally find economy seats more comfortable on UA compared to CO (seat cushion and recline seemed a bit more generous), but maybe things will change with the merger. I really hope E+ is added to Continental's fleet. I'm hopeful that we will see a merger of good qualities from both airlines. I've been lurking around the OnePass forum for a while, and I think we have a lot in common as loyal frequent fliers. I wish we had a totally new logo, but what can we do. So even with my low expectations, I've been a very happy customer on both airlines. I look forward to flying more on CO routes. And FWIW, welcome to United!
Originally Posted by CHIC SILBER;
I've been avoiding that forum for quite a while
but it seems that we'll all share that sandbox before long I STILL remain optimistic |
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14875657)
1. I respect Joe Brancatelli and value his views. The article is spot on, but, like the "Summer From Hell," is dated. A lot has changed at UA since 2008. Not everything, mind you, but a lot. For one thing, UA started making money. Their profit margins, in fact, easily exceeded those of CO. Second, UA will be the number-one on-time carrier in the United States in 2010 for the second year running.
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14875657)
Otherwise, all my flights on UA were as a non-elite and I never had a single experience with a single UA employee in five years that was anything but friendly and professional. I am not saying that poor service doesn't happen, but it has never happened to me.
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14875657)
And speaking of Joe Brancatelli's article and its provocative title, naming United the "Worst Airline Ever." Alas, United has a lot of competition in this category including my own favorite TWA (The Worst Airline) and also Continental, which was perhaps the first carrier to fall from its grace following airline deregulation in 1978.
CO during the 1980s and early 1990s was truly an awful airline to fly. To this day, some of the absolute worst flights I've ever had in my life were CO flights during the Lorenzo years. They really remind me of US right after the HP merger, when nothing ran smoothly, and the senior management seemed to be doing anything they could to p!$$ off their customers. Unfortunately CO ran like that for a good 10+ years before almost ceasing to exist. And yes, I miss the CO of the late 1990s and very early 2000s. They're still very good, but in those days, they were a stellar operation all around (other than the 31" pitch/hard seat thing). ;)
Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1
(Post 14875657)
United definitely has issues. But so does Continental. And I think in 2010 United, surprisingly, can bring a lot to the table that can improve the combined carrier.
|
Originally Posted by ssullivan
(Post 14876950)
For the most part, my UA flights over the last 18 months have not only been on time, but often, rather early. I've had flights arrive as much as 45 minutes ahead of schedule. I think it's a combination of UA making a conscious effort to fix problems that were causing delays, as well as increasing the padding on schedules. I once had a LAX-IAD flight depart the gate 30 minutes late, and arrive 40 minutes early. You can't tell me the schedule wasn't heavily padded there. In any case, I still got where I needed to be before I expected to be there.
Either you've been lucky, or I've been unlucky. Some of the worst airline employees I've ever seen in terms of friendliness and helpfulness were UA gate agents at LAX, IAH, and IAD. However, the last time I encountered one of these truly nasty employees was in mid-2008. I think even the one at IAH that I saw chew out a FA during boarding of a DEN flight over something ridiculous while standing in the middle of the F cabin on a 757 is gone. I've encountered some really angry UA people, but that seems to have improved a lot over the last two years. I haven't seen any of them in the last 12 months, and most have been very good. Actually, BN was probably the first to really fall from its grace after deregulation. They didn't have the sharp decline in customer service; they just quickly went belly up and closed shop. CO during the 1980s and early 1990s was truly an awful airline to fly. To this day, some of the absolute worst flights I've ever had in my life were CO flights during the Lorenzo years. They really remind me of US right after the HP merger, when nothing ran smoothly, and the senior management seemed to be doing anything they could to p!$$ off their customers. Unfortunately CO ran like that for a good 10+ years before almost ceasing to exist. And yes, I miss the CO of the late 1990s and very early 2000s. They're still very good, but in those days, they were a stellar operation all around (other than the 31" pitch/hard seat thing). ;) Yep. I'm still cautiously optimistic that, in the end, the strengths of both airlines will survive the merger craziness, and the end result will be an even stronger product overall. For over a year I've said it's only a matter of time until we see an announcement that E+ is coming to CO; they've been inching that way for quite some time now. We've already seen some CO rub off on UA, with UDU, complimentary drinks in the Red Carpet Clubs, and complimentary Wi-Fi for all Red Carpet Club patrons, regardless of the credentials used to access the club. UA's customer friendliness, interior maintenance on its aircraft, and reliability have also improved greatly over the last two years, which may, in part, be part of CO's partnership (after all, similar improvements happened with NW in the late 1990s when the CO/NW partnership was formed, and CO's management jumped on NW about reliability and aircraft appearance). There really is a lot of good in both companies, and hopefully, it will not only survive the merger, but become something even better. Like you, I am optimistic about the merger and certainly hope--and believe--that the two carriers will have much to add to the table, that in this case the combined carriers will be greater than the sum of the parts. One comment, though, you have clearly flown a fair amount of UA recently and so your assessment is up to date and informed. My impression is that the most vociferous critics of UA are those who primarily flew it only in the past, formed a negative image of it (which it deserved at the time) and have remained steadfast in their refusal to give the carrier a new look. Imagine if they had flown with CO in the Lorenzo years and adopted a similar stance with Continental? So the point is things have changed dramatically and I think it is absolutely accurate to say that UA brings a lot of value into the new combined carrier. |
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14874195)
Day 1 saw the RCC no longer charging for wi-fi and drinks. That upset people....... I know you can't please all of the people all of the time but why complain just to be complaining.
Wifi was already free, so no biggie there (saves scratchoff cards for non-RCC members I guess). Though if bandwith slows down like I've heard it does at PCs (with people camping outside to get the free signal), that will be annoying. EDIT: I found the drink complainers - but I agree with them as our drink chits will now expire in 4 weeks. That does kind of stink - I liked getting top shelf booze for free (or even with a double chit after inflation), but don't have a lot of interest in Bud LIght. |
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14874195)
It is what it is. I like what Jeff stands for: open communication, relaxed dress code, funding the future, taking care of the employees and customers, while working to make money. Mistakes will occur and changes will happen.
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14874195)
Day 1 saw the RCC no longer charging for wi-fi and drinks. That upset people....... I know you can't please all of the people all of the time but why complain just to be complaining.
|
Now Now Young Lady
Originally Posted by sfogate
(Post 14874195)
That upset people.......
I'm sure you were referring to the "World Travel Facility" (but I don't think we have a reciprocity agreement) |
Originally Posted by UA-NYC
(Post 14877971)
I'd love to know who all these people are who are complaining about free drinks - please point them out to me. As long as it doesn't come at the expense of RCC's superior food offerings, no problem.
Much like some may want to believe that CO can do no wrong there are some who think that the policies can never be right. Irrational bias is what it is; the trick it learning to look past it.
Originally Posted by UA-NYC
(Post 14877971)
Wifi was already free, so no biggie there (saves scratchoff cards for non-RCC members I guess). Though if bandwith slows down like I've heard it does at PCs (with people camping outside to get the free signal), that will be annoying.
|
| All times are GMT -6. The time now is 3:16 am. |
This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2026 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.