dtsm

The two travel agencies I use have been in business for over 30 years each and are Chinese owned/operated. They know the consulate folks on personal basis.

I don't know what other 'guan-xi' will help....

moondog

I suspect that individual consulate generals have a great deal of latitude with respect to interpreting Beijing's directives. And, if the head honcho has made up is mind, even slick guanxi might not be sufficient to change it.

tauphi

So could you qualify by adopting a Chinese national?

thqu60

Just saw this from the Chinese Consulate website:


Notice about Adjustment of Visa Fee for U.S. Citizens

2010/06/09
According to the instruction from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of China, starting from June 10, 2010, visa fee for U.S. citizens will be adjusted on a reciprocal basis. The details are as follows:

1. Visa fee for the individual applicants will be $140 per person, regardless of the types of visa applied for.

2. Visa fee for group visa will be $120 per person.

3. Expedited service fees will remain unchanged.

anacapamalibu

TIT FOR TAT

US raised price first

For a number of reasons, including new security enhancements, the $131 fee set on January 1, 2008, no longer covers the current, actual cost of processing nonimmigrant visas.

Under the new schedule of fees, applicants for all visas that are not petition-based, including B1/B2 tourist and business visitor visas and all student and exchange visitor (F, M and J) visas, will pay a fee of $140.

Also Feds are proposing a future 10% increase in immigration fees. But China won't
have to respond to that as they don't have an immigration policy.

iahphx

Well, I paid a visit to the China visa office today in DC.

As I kind of expected (Monday morning in June) in was a mad-house. Arrived at 10:30, and there were 100 people ahead of me. Security guard told me there was no way I'd get called before the 12:30-1:30 break, so I should take a number and come back.

I came back at 1:40, and they were 25 people past my number. But the security guy said no problem, just work your way up to the clerks before they call the next number (now I was feeling like I was in China ). I did so, and the clerk was happy to process my family's visa, but I didn't have a "photo copy of the photo page from our passport." Say what? Apparently, it's a new rule (not stated on the embassy's website which, btw, is a complete and illogical mess at the moment).

Conveniently, there's a photo copy machine in the office that takes quarters. So after making the copies, I again worm my way up to the clerk. I then start the "what visa can you give us" negotiations, not really expecting much. She says I can get 1-year, multiple entry. I'm a bit surprised. I ask for 2 years. She shakes her head no.

I'll let you guys know what the visas actually say when I get them back in a few days.

I wish I had known about the visa fee increase, as I would have done it a week ago. When you're taking your family, these fees can be a bit punishing, especially when they're not good for multiple trips.

moondog

Without a letter or Chinese blood, your chances for 2 years were zero. (I was hoping you'd get a letter for the sake of data in addition to your own well being. I would pressed one of my clients on your behalf if you emailed me.)

iahphx

Now you tell me. I would have guinea-pigged it just for the heck of it.

In a way, it would have been in the Chinese gov't's interest to give me 2 years. $140 a pop per person is real money. If I could get free entry, I probably would have at least stopped in China on my next Asia trip just because I felt good about not having to get a visa. Or maybe made a brief off-season "shopping trip" on some crazy airfare. Now, more than likely, I'll just stick to other countries next time.

Everybody wants to "reciprocate" against the US fees, but it's not necessarily the rational thing to do.

RichardInSF

And they don't ever "reciprocate" the US practice of giving multi-year visas in many instances.

I have avoided visits to China when I don't have a business purpose because of this fee. It's particularly annoying to be asked to pay this ridiculous fee just to visit Shenzhen from HK.

But it fits well with Chinese foreign policy and it's a huge profit source for the Chinese government (as it is for the US government, despite claims to the contrary).

moondog

It's not hard for me to believe that the US government actually squanders $140 (in reasonably direct costs) per visa applicant.

Consider the following:

-US Embassy in BJ: $640 million plus operating costs
-Consulates in Shanghai, Guangzhou, Chengdu, Shenyang
-Smaller missions in Xiamen and Nanning
-~500 expatriate employees on full benefits packages
-personal interviews required for all first time applicants
-$2.6 billion BCIS budget

dtsm

Moondog already addressed the USA side.
As far as China is concerned, visa revenue generates a mere pittance of their FX reserves. They probably make more exporting apple iphones, ipods, etc.

iahphx

I guess it's like rent-a-car taxes: there's no logical constituency to keep the entry fees reasonable.

I guess at some point, the local tourist industry thinks to complain -- but even they're pretty clueless.

RichardInSF

Which is totally irrelevant to the groups wanting the profits from the visas as all that other stuff is not part of their budget.

Indeed, you are actually making a strong argument for lowering the fees. I contend the amount realized by the fees is a mere pittance compared to the increased tourism China would get by eliminating the whole advance visa requirement for tourists.

moondog

I'm replying to this post (instead of Richard's more recent post) because you've framed the issue at hand in a concise manner.

My read:

-what's rational for your or me, isn't necessarily rational for them
-"face" is an important concept in China things like Visa reciprocity give its politicians a chance to express it on an international level
-the people that make these decisions could care less about how they affect Joe's Youth Hostel
-one of the major reasons that China's economy is potentially in for a rough ride is the imbalance between the coastal region and the interior; relaxing visa restrictions would only exacerbate this imbalance because, as a general rule, tourists don't go to the poor areas (Lijiang and Shangri-La don't qualify and the Chinese clearly don't want "us" tramping around Tibet)
-Americans aren't the only foreigners that like to visit China
-I think a lot has to do with the large amount of expense the US side invests in bullying Chinese people that aspire to see the US, whether as tourists or business people. In this sense, I increasingly think they have a point.

iahphx

I generally agree with you Moondog.

That said, I don't think $140 a visit is in China's self-interest. Well, unless they want to discourage Americans from visiting!