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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   TSA Adjusting Prohibitions/Designated "Ask Bart" Thread (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/589864-tsa-adjusting-prohibitions-designated-ask-bart-thread.html)

Bart Aug 26, 2006 7:08 am

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Bart Aug 26, 2006 7:13 am

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Bart Aug 26, 2006 7:16 am

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Bart Aug 26, 2006 7:20 am

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SirFlysALot Aug 26, 2006 7:29 am


Originally Posted by Bart
Can your brother-in-law get a note from the doctor explaining his need to have constant access to water? This should be enough to be treated as a "non-prescription" medication issue at the checkpoint. To be honest with you, however, the question could be asked why he can't simply have the water that is offered on the airplane. The doctor's note should address this point.

Hope this helps.

That 4 ounces of water the FA gives you goes a long way. So does the second. They even seem slightly put out if you ask for a second cup. There is no way they will give you the bottle like you might ask for the can of soft drink.

I would prefer to bring my water on board for an almost 3 hour trip each way.

GoingAway Aug 26, 2006 8:09 am


Originally Posted by Points Scrounger
But the airlines like it this way? :confused:

No the airlines have a mixed feel about the guidelines, they are in no way prepared for the addtl luggage which is requiring additional luggage handlers, as well as additional costs for all the baggage delivery that is going on, but the FAs and GAs are enjoying the respite from slower passenger loading and fights over overhead space. And the airlines do enjoy the quick turn if they can figure out how to do that and manage the luggage at the same time.

Bart Aug 26, 2006 8:24 am

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Katja Aug 26, 2006 9:01 am


Originally Posted by bethster
Denial of water is a clear violation of the Air Carriers section of the Americans with Disabilities Act. It is what I plan to cite when I sue the TSA (and possibly United and American airlines).


I'd be interested in seeing your citation for this "clear violation".

If you're going to sue, you might want to get your statutes straight.

The Americans with Disabilities Act Title I is about employment and covers employers with 15 or more employees. Enforcement is effected by filing complaints with the U. S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC).

ADA Title II covers public transportation, but not air travel. Complaints go to the Office of Civil Rights, Federal Transit Administration, U.S. Department of Transportation.

ADA Title III covers businesses and nonprofit service providers that are public accommodations, including restaurants, retail stores, hotels, movie theaters, private schools, convention centers, doctors' offices, homeless shelters, transportation depots, zoos, funeral homes, day care centers, and recreation facilities including sports stadiums and fitness clubs. So this includes airports but not airplanes. Title III complaints are filed with the Department of Justice.

The Americans with Disabilities Act has no provisions of any kind regarding water, hydration, or nourishment. Here is the full text of the Act.

Airlines are covered by the Air Carrier Access Act (14 C.F.R. Part 382), which is not a part of the Americans with Disabilities Act. It doesn't talk about nourishment or hydration either, as its function is to provide equal access. It talks about things like boarding, lavatories, equal access to information, seating accomodations, and attendents. Here is the text of the Act.

ETA: I do not post this because I support the TSA ban on liquids, but because I get very tired of people citing the ADA and ACAA when they clearly are unfamiliar with either act. It makes it more difficult for those who need the protections of these acts to even get what the act provides.

DeafFlyer Aug 26, 2006 9:04 am


Originally Posted by Bart
It's all in how the doctor writes the note and explains the importance of having constant access to water.

I know that this is reasonable advice, but as a disabled person, I'm getting tired of needing doctors notes for every little thing.

oldpenny16 Aug 26, 2006 9:23 am

absolutely
 

Originally Posted by DeafFlyer
I know that this is reasonable advice, but as a disabled person, I'm getting tired of needing doctors notes for every little thing.

DeafFlyer, you are so correct. We shouldn't have to be going through all this. Begging to have water, lip baum and basic human comforts. Ridiculous!

My husband's doc's advice about his eye drops: 'no guaranty the TSA will honor my Rx. Just put the bottle in your pocket and forget you have it.'

We are being forced to be sneaky!

Loren Pechtel Aug 26, 2006 9:31 am


Originally Posted by Cholula
My point is that for those who are seriously stressing about getting essential items confiscated, check the stuff in your freakin' suitcase.
Yeah, the suitcase may not get there exactly when you do but it'll eventually show up and you'll be reunited with your stuff.
Trying to get a hard and fast "Yes or No" from TSA isn't going to happen.
As Bart and others have stated, there's too much individual TSA discretion nowadays as to what's allowed and what isn't.
This BS isn't getting fixed in the short-term so if in doubt, check it rather than lose it.

And you've never lost anything in checked baggage??

If it's a choice between checking my medicine or not flying I'm not going to fly.

Bart Aug 26, 2006 9:32 am

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Traveller Aug 26, 2006 9:42 am


Originally Posted by Bart
Hopefully, TSA will be forced to reconsider this ban. It's not fun having to enforce it.

It seems that the once a year traveller is obeying these new bans and saying anything for security. TV shows the same attitude. As frequent flyers, what can we do to force the TSA to reconsider the bans?

Wally Bird Aug 26, 2006 10:41 am


Originally Posted by Traveller
As frequent flyers, what can we do to force the TSA to reconsider the bans?

Nothing. There have been numerous examples that the TSA cannot be forced to do anything - they are out of control simply because they can be. Occasionally they relent on some of the more intrusive policies, but usually only when it makes things easier for them, not us.

In the current climate (paranoia just doesn't do it justice), I would expect more restrictions to be umm.. eased in, not less. The Great American People are thoroughly cowed, the media are actually enjoying this and Congress have their collective thumbs you-know-where.

Just keep on 'whining' and I think the picketing idea is an excellent one. The TSA no doubt anticipates riding out any small, inconvenient dissent, all we can do is try to outlast them.

GoingAway Aug 26, 2006 11:34 am


Originally Posted by Bart
I do not support this ban and believe a more reasonable restriction is possible. My point here is that you are not denied your basic needs or comforts. You just don't have the convenience of carrying these items with you as a general rule. Hopefully, TSA will be forced to reconsider this ban. It's not fun having to enforce it.

I would respectfully disagree with the bolded statement above.

First a basic need is hydration – an airline is unable to pack enough water to truly keep all passengers on board hydrated. Many people suffer hydration issues and are unaware of it – I am not! I require and drink a LOT of water every day – it is SPRING water, not what is served on board most airlines. These new regs deny me the comfort of having a beverage I not only prefer but it’s the only type I drink as well as the “need” to address my hydration issues (I end up with diet 7-up or an alcoholic beverage as the only other things I drink from what is available).

There are ample reports prior to this idiocy that STRONGLY RECOMMENDED people bring their own water on board to supplement what is provided by the airlines (in my case, for ex-USA trips I totally replace it). Those reports addressed the needs of the passengers to remain sufficiently hydrated and the comfort of ensuring that hydration is available when it was needed. Having the airlines pack a few extra liters hardly addresses this lack now does it, not to mention that the airlines serve those tiny cups of water and the FAs then disappear for the next hour or two – that is totally insufficient to address the needs of most passengers.


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