tsadude

As I said before, I will now rely on the moderators to keep this forum on topic. Rules is rules, even if you are new, and even if you say you work for the TSA.

Gotcha, 10-4 good buddy.

tazi

Thank you

tazi

Why Not Implant a Microchip?

Sound crazy? Well, it is. But as a thought experiment, it well illustrates how incremental incursions on liberty can lead to dramatic losses of privacy over time. Consider our experience with Social Security numbers.

People worried when the Social Security Act was passed in 1935 that the Social Security number (SSN) would become an all-purpose identifier--an understandable public response, at the time, to a rather dramatic institutional change. But government officials reassured the public that the SSN would not be used for any such purpose. Equally important, they showed restraint and only gradually expanded the federally mandated uses of the SSN--not mandating its use by other federal agencies until 1943. A step at a time, during the 1960s the SSN became the taxpayer identifier used by the IRS, the identifier for federal civilian and military personnel, the Medicare identifier, and more. In the 1970s Congress passed laws requiring the SSN's use for legally admitted aliens and anyone seeking federal benefits--and also gave the states free rein to use SSNs for identification purposes. A series of federal laws passed in the 1980s required the issuance of SSNs to ever-younger children if their parents wanted to claim them as dependents on federal tax forms--by age 5, age 2, age 1, now at any age. People got used to it.


[This message has been edited by tazi (edited 01-21-2003).]

tsadude

I did the search but I like my link better
http://www.epic.org/privacy/id_cards/

tazi

That is a great link! I'll have to check out some of the other information in the stories it provides links to later when I get home. This did catch my eye:

Larry Ellison, head of Oracle Corporation, the California based software company, has called for the development of a national identification system and offered to donate the technology to make this possible

Donate my arse!

Spiff

Absolutely not. No trusted traveler program is needed or desired.

We keep wanting to do something different or new when there really isn't any need to do either!

No credible weapons, no bombs, no problem.

------------------
"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

freshair

I guess what I am missing is - since "they" already know so much about "us", why should we have to pay to get a "Trusted Traveller" status? Wouldn't TSA/Homeland Security save time and effort by just issuing an ID or other clearance mechanism at no additional cost (Please no implants!)? I mean, if we are already paying x-dollars for each segment for security fees - and the agency could save x-dollars per trip by not having to subject TT's to detailed searches...(how much do the screeners make per hour?), why should we have to pay more? Isn't in their interest as well to speed things up?...

essxjay

IF it were voluntary and IF it were free of charge (ala INSPASS), I would welcome a TTP (Trusted Traveler Program). I would happily supply my Passport number, residency info and proof of my extensive travel for the past five years. Being as though I've already been fingerprinted, even if that were asked for I still wouldn't mind.

But that's just me!

I'm sick of the unwarranted hassle as much as anyone. It's just that it's not going away anytime soon and I'm unwilling to continue to put up with this screening BS if the folks who granted power to the TSA to touch my breasts lest I be denied travel say I can sidestep it. Period.

JS

Hmmm, I just thought of something. Maybe it's not so bad after all.

Since I have a good background, I should have no trouble getting a special "no security check needed" ID card. Then I can buy a gun and take it on every flight.

In the unlikely event of a hijacking, my fellow passengers and I will stand a better chance of surviving since I can shoot the bad guys rather than trying to beat them up.

NoStressHere

Another wasteful program trying to solve a problem that we have not even taken the time to identify. Still,if there is a problem and it proves to be a WONDERFULL success and works 99% of the time. This is being rather generous, but follow along.

So, if 15 million people fly a month (I heard that number someplace) and 1% of them slip through this program, that means that 150,000 got through. But, lets assume only 1% of them are bad guys, then we have only 150 bad guys.

So, is this really worth all this effort?

And this assumes that someone "trusted" today is still to be trusted next month?

tazi

Unfortunately, this is not all the information that would be gathered. I'll go through the crotch wanding I was recently subjected to before I will allow myself to be 'microchipped'.

essxjay

Just curious: what else do you think might be asked for? I mention this only because I'm familiar with some policy wonks who've been studying this idea pretty exhaustively for about a year now. (By policy wonks I mean a private think tank with strong a free-market, personal-privacy stance.) They propose to testify before a Congressional transportation committee of some type, hopefully sometime this year.

And as I stated above, "if" the several criteria I mentioned were the only ones required would I agree to a TTP. Anything more would be a deal breaker for me.

JS, just to be perfectly clear, I never suggested that I shouldn't/wouldn't be expected to undergo a pre-9/11 x-ray of my bags as part of the TTP ID.

[This message has been edited by essxjay (edited 01-21-2003).]

JS

Essxjay, if you still have to walk through the magnenometer and X-ray your bags, what is the point?

essxjay

My point is about the post-9/11 hassle-factor (secondary screenings regardless of setting-off the magnometers, feel-ups, riduculous list of proscribed items in carry-ons, etc.). A trusted traveler ID should allow one to bypass this particular part of the nonsense.

I know, it sounds like 'too bad for innocent infrequent travelers', but since they're the ones who favor this current set-up let 'em have their cake. Just don't expect me to choke it down without a fight. It's not called elite status for nothing.

[This message has been edited by essxjay (edited 01-21-2003).]

tmspa

Trusted traveler? If we can't even trust a pilot (who has had every background check in the book and cleared by USDOT) then why should we trust hoardes of passengers that have some card stating that their "okie dokie"!

http://dailynews.attbi.com/cgi-bin/n...estgundc211717