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NoMoreFlying May 28, 2014 6:19 am

Flying while Transgender
 
Exclusive: Transgender travelers singled out in TSA screenings, docs show

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/5/26/groin-anomalies-andpatdownstravelingwhiletrans.html

FliesWay2Much May 28, 2014 6:36 am

They must be proud...
 

T5 PM shift a transgender male passenger alarmed the AIT for a groin anomaly. The male passenger had breast implants but also a penis which lead to the E0 assuming is was a female with a groin anomaly. The passenger presented himself as female so the RFD was conducted by a female LTSO. During the RPD, drugs were discovered in the pocket.

The passenger was ultimately arrested.

SeriouslyLost May 28, 2014 8:56 am

It's only been 10+ years. You can't expect TSA to have worked out all the wrinkles in their processes yet. :(

GUWonder May 28, 2014 9:28 am

I welcome more government-issued ID listing X under the sex field on the IDs. When even LDC countries where the self-proclaimed Taliban runs amok can issue passports and other ID with non-F/non-M sex designators, it begs the question when all of the US will do the same.

Some of the harassment that people in the trans/intersex group face when traveling by air is due to ID sex listings.

alphaod May 28, 2014 8:06 pm

It's the TSA. What did you expect?

Himeno May 28, 2014 11:24 pm

So TSA can't even call her by the proper gender, then has her arrested when they find her HRT medicine?

Vidiot Sep 21, 2015 7:53 pm

Flying while Transgender
 
Shadi Petosky, a trans woman, attempted to fly MCO-MSP today. She tweeted out some disturbing reports of being harassed and detained by TSA at MCO, including being told that she couldn't take pictures and that she had to give up her phone.

I don't know her and I haven't heard anyone else's side on this, but here are some of her tweets from the evening. I redacted TSO names due to FT policies, and did not include tweets related to her dispute with American Airlines:

*

I am being held by the TSA in Orlando because of an "anomaly" (my p---s)
*

The TSA at the Orlando Airport told me I couldn't take photos but this is denigrating. I have missed my flight
*

The TSA has left me in a room alone. There is an officer holding the door. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPdCw-SVAAEyk2X.jpg
* T

SA agent B----- told me to get back in the machine as a man or it was going to be a problem.
*

TSA agents are now saying their are explosives alarm from my hands and the officers gloves when she gave me a full body pat down.
*

I asked TSA agent B----- if he had any training in trans issues. He said "I know what I am doing"
*

Cop asked me what sex I was. I told him I wasn't going to answer that question. I am complying but come on.
*

They're telling me they have to take my phone. I told them that I want to use this to keep a record of what is happening
*

A man a brown suit came and whispered to TSA agent S----- to make sure I am not taking photos or video.
*

There are now 2 police officers, 1 explosives specialist and four TSA agents. They're taking my phone for screening
*

I am through. It was about 40 minutes, 2 full body pat downs, fully disassembled luggage. I missed my flight.
*

A TSA agent is telling me to leave the airport. I asked them to please call a supervisor, I just want to get to an American Airlines gate
*

TSA told me to rebook at the gate but it is closed so they are making me leave until a
*

To get a new boarding pass through American Airlines. So I am back out of the secure area being escorting by a police officer.
*

They told me to get myself together, I am sobbing, not belligerent.
*

American Airlines manager is telling me that "in the future ask for a private screening"
*

I literally want to no lectures from American Airlines on how to travel while trans. I want the same privileges as cis people.
*

When the police officer asked me what sex I was I told him I wasn't to respond. He said this was not a game. Are trans civil rights?
*

TSA supervisor R---- luckily heard the officer and stepped in and said me disclosing sex/gender was not an issue.
*

Then he told me I looked like a woman to him. Which I am sure he meant as a compliment, but what if I didn't?
*

I paid for a ticket. The @tsa told me they'd escort me through, but these agents have no idea what I'm talking about
*

What @tsa and @AmericanAir is doing publically is completely different than what I am experience
*

Back in the TSA line. Here goes nothing
*

The TSA agent said "step back in please" and the manager ran over and was like "no no, you're good!"
TSA hasn't commented on Twitter, other than to say:
*

TSA takes all potential civil rights violations very seriously. We are looking into the situation now for further information.

Vidiot Sep 21, 2015 8:00 pm

Mods, if there's a better/preferred way to embed tweets, I'm happy to edit this. Wasn't sure how to do it best.

My reactions to this story:
--I can understand a trans woman presenting the MMW scanners with the Gumby software as an "anomaly." She said she flies all the time and has never run into this problem before, however. I think that if her descriptions are accurate, TSA could still have handled this much better, by explaining the need for a patdown, not doing the apparently-retaliatory explosives-scan patdown, dismantling her luggage, sensitively offering her a private screening and the opportunity for a witness, et cetera.
--Why did the TSA detain her? TSA has no detention authority, and it sounded like it was not a law enforcement detention predicated on reasonable suspicion of criminal behavior, though LEOs were eventually present.
--Why was she told she couldn't take pictures or document her experience at the checkpoint? This is, once again, contrary to what TSA says on its site and in all its communications (save for the request not to take photos/video of scanner screens.)
--Why did TSA tell her she would have to leave the airport, once she'd made it into the sterile area, past the checkpoint?

FliesWay2Much Sep 22, 2015 1:40 am


Originally Posted by Vidiot (Post 25459985)
Mods, if there's a better/preferred way to embed tweets, I'm happy to edit this. Wasn't sure how to do it best.

My reactions to this story:
--I can understand a trans woman presenting the MMW scanners with the Gumby software as an "anomaly." She said she flies all the time and has never run into this problem before, however. I think that if her descriptions are accurate, TSA could still have handled this much better, by explaining the need for a patdown, not doing the apparently-retaliatory explosives-scan patdown, dismantling her luggage, sensitively offering her a private screening and the opportunity for a witness, et cetera.
--Why did the TSA detain her? TSA has no detention authority, and it sounded like it was not a law enforcement detention predicated on reasonable suspicion of criminal behavior, though LEOs were eventually present.
--Why was she told she couldn't take pictures or document her experience at the checkpoint? This is, once again, contrary to what TSA says on its site and in all its communications (save for the request not to take photos/video of scanner screens.)
--Why did TSA tell her she would have to leave the airport, once she'd made it into the sterile area, past the checkpoint?

There's lots of stuff that don't seem to make sense. But, we have to remember that the victim was obviously stressed out because of the TSA harassment. There's no doubt in my mind that the TSA clerks did what she is accusing them of doing.

It's interesting that the TSA software tripped on the victim's groin area when the clerk assumed the victim was a biological female and plumbing showed up. Apparently, a female clerk groped the offending area and everything else. I don't know why unless it was pure harassment. Since the victim was already being detained in what looks like the former Voyeur Booth and didn't witness any of the glove swabbing of the female clerk, there's a high degree of probability that the lead clerk falsified the positive alarm just to pile on more harassment.

It also sounds like one of the clerks wanted to force the victim to declare that the victim was a male, which would have given the male clerk justification to set the <deleted by moderator> to "male." In the clerk's feeble mind, the <deleted by moderator> would have been set to "male" and the victim would have gotten through because the plumbing would have been ignored.

I hope the victim gets a good lawyer and comes forth with a more coherent story than what you can tell in 140 characters or less. As the rights of the LGBT ("T" in this case) become more and more established, the TSA needs to change how they do the <deleted by moderator>. I can't imagine that the TSA would bother to do anything about accommodating transgendered people because it's cheaper to just pay out a couple of lawsuits every year.

GUWonder Sep 22, 2015 2:19 am


Originally Posted by Vidiot (Post 25459985)
Mods, if there's a better/preferred way to embed tweets, I'm happy to edit this. Wasn't sure how to do it best.

My reactions to this story:
--I can understand a trans woman presenting the MMW scanners with the Gumby software as an "anomaly." She said she flies all the time and has never run into this problem before, however. I think that if her descriptions are accurate, TSA could still have handled this much better, by explaining the need for a patdown, not doing the apparently-retaliatory explosives-scan patdown, dismantling her luggage, sensitively offering her a private screening and the opportunity for a witness, et cetera.
--Why did the TSA detain her? TSA has no detention authority, and it sounded like it was not a law enforcement detention predicated on reasonable suspicion of criminal behavior, though LEOs were eventually present.
--Why was she told she couldn't take pictures or document her experience at the checkpoint? This is, once again, contrary to what TSA says on its site and in all its communications (save for the request not to take photos/video of scanner screens.)
--Why did TSA tell her she would have to leave the airport, once she'd made it into the sterile area, past the checkpoint?

My suggestion: avoid use of the strip search machines. Opting-out of the strip search machines may help, at least sometimes, with reducing the chances of such a TSA encounter. Unfortunately, it's the TSA, so there's no guarantee that it would reduce the negative TSA encounters.

Himeno Sep 22, 2015 2:36 am

... :(
I guess it's a good thing I don't have to deal with any TSA in FL my next trip then.
Though if TSA at BOS, LAX, LAS, DCA and JFK are doing things like this, I might have 'issues'... :/

DBCme Sep 22, 2015 2:55 am

Tempting to place fault at TSA, but there are still some unanswered questions. But generally, TSA doesn't stand out as an organization particularly sensitive to differences in culture and gender. Add a splash of resistance by the OP, and the outcome won't be pretty.

GUWonder Sep 22, 2015 3:38 am


Originally Posted by DBCme (Post 25460980)
Tempting to place fault at TSA, but there are still some unanswered questions. But generally, TSA doesn't stand out as an organization particularly sensitive to differences in culture and gender. Add a splash of resistance by the OP, and the outcome won't be pretty.

"resistance" being the word the TSA uses to refer to passenger genitalia.

petaluma1 Sep 22, 2015 5:03 am

The violations of procedure committed by the TSA are too numerous to count. Hope she finds a good lawyer.

Boggie Dog Sep 22, 2015 7:36 am

http://www.tsa.gov/travel/frequently-asked-questions


Transgender persons should use the name and gender that appears on their government-issued ID when making flight reservations and at the security checkpoint. You may ask that carry-on bags be screened in private if a bag must be opened by a TSA officer to resolve an alarm. Screening can be conducted in a private screening area with a witness or companion. You may request private screening or to speak with a supervisor at any time during the screening process.
If the TSA screeners based the screening on appearance seems these screeners may have been in violation of TSA policy.

Vidiot Sep 22, 2015 9:54 am

According to this story in The Advocate, the TSA has released a statement:

“Our officers are trained to properly screen members of the transgender community. TSA takes all potential civil rights violations very seriously and conducted a review of the incident. After examining closed circuit TV video and other available information, TSA has determined that the evidence shows our officers followed TSA’s strict guidelines. Supervisory personnel and a Passenger Support Specialist participated in the screening to ensure guidelines were met.”
I don't see how guidelines were met if the TSA detained her illegally, conducted a retaliatory patdown, tried to take her phone away, told her she could not take photos or video, and told her she'd have to leave the airport.

Also, it's interesting that this statement does not appear in the press section of the TSA website. I guess the website is just out of date.

Boggie Dog Sep 22, 2015 10:39 am


Originally Posted by Vidiot (Post 25462451)
According to this story in The Advocate, the TSA has released a statement:


I don't see how guidelines were met if the TSA detained her illegally, conducted a retaliatory patdown, tried to take her phone away, told her she could not take photos or video, and told her she'd have to leave the airport.

Also, it's interesting that this statement does not appear in the press section of the TSA website. I guess the website is just out of date.

Simple answer, TSA screeners never do anything wrong.

iMedic Sep 22, 2015 10:52 am

I was following this on Twitter yesterday and this morning. I felt so bad for her and I hope some good comes from this.


Beside that, I'm curious as to why the OP felt the need to censor the word penis? Do you normally censor yourself when talking about anatomy?

chgoeditor Sep 22, 2015 11:32 am


Originally Posted by iMedic (Post 25462744)
I was following this on Twitter yesterday and this morning. I felt so bad for her and I hope some good comes from this.


Beside that, I'm curious as to why the OP felt the need to censor the word penis? Do you normally censor yourself when talking about anatomy?

FT blocks the posting of many words, and the OP may have assumed that penis would automatically be blocked or censored.

mikeef Sep 22, 2015 12:29 pm


“Our officers are trained to properly screen members of the transgender community. TSA takes all potential civil rights violations very seriously and conducted a review of the incident. After examining closed circuit TV video and other available information, TSA has determined that the evidence shows our officers followed TSA’s strict guidelines. Supervisory personnel and a Passenger Support Specialist participated in the screening to ensure guidelines were met.”
And, in other news, water is wet and the sun comes up in the east. :rolleyes:

Mike

Skatering Sep 22, 2015 1:05 pm

Well, this was fun to read.

I'm actually in the same position as her anatomically. I transitioned when I was a teenager and I'm now in my late twenties. Being trans doesn't really affect my life in any way until I have the joy of airport security.

I was extremely fortunate to encounter WMTDs every time I flew, until last week at MCI when I was in my first body scanner line. I considered opting out but I figured I'd see if I'd get an anomaly first as I was on my own so it was no big deal if it happened. As soon as I walked through the two male TSA agents ran away (yeah, really) leaving the lone female agent to awkwardly ask me about my gender and explaining that I had an anomaly in the private area. She then proceeded to pat down the other parts of my body that had flagged but went nowhere near my private parts. And then I was on my way, almost feeling guilty for not opting out and putting her through the awkwardness.

But reading this, it seems transgender training hasn't reached all of the TSA, or more likely, they're plain ignoring it, because they can. I look forward to the day this inevitably happens to me. Hopefully I'll be travelling alone or with people who are already privvy to my medical history.

Vidiot Sep 22, 2015 2:50 pm


Originally Posted by chgoeditor (Post 25462953)
FT blocks the posting of many words, and the OP may have assumed that penis would automatically be blocked or censored.

This, exactly. Since FT blocks words, I assumed that "penis" wouldn't make it through. No judgment on the word on my part was intended.

FliesWay2Much Sep 22, 2015 3:42 pm


Originally Posted by mikeef (Post 25463249)
Quote:




“Our officers are trained to properly screen members of the transgender community. TSA takes all potential civil rights violations very seriously and conducted a review of the incident. After examining closed circuit TV video and other available information, TSA has determined that the evidence shows our officers followed TSA’s strict guidelines. Supervisory personnel and a Passenger Support Specialist participated in the screening to ensure guidelines were met.”




And, in other news, water is wet and the sun comes up in the east.

Mike

Well, jeepers, if they are all properly trained, why did they need a supervisor clerk and a passenger support clerk on the scene?

After this blow-off, I hope there's a civil rights lawyer out there who will take a case pro bono.

tanja Sep 22, 2015 5:02 pm


Originally Posted by Vidiot (Post 25463981)
This, exactly. Since FT blocks words, I assumed that "penis" wouldn't make it through. No judgment on the word on my part was intended.

After what I have read we cant even use genitals words at a TSA check point. Cause TSA gets offended.
I am like this if you "touch" those parts you have to be able to hear them and spell them."

tanja Sep 22, 2015 5:06 pm


Originally Posted by Skatering (Post 25463475)
Well, this was fun to read.

I'm actually in the same position as her anatomically. I transitioned when I was a teenager and I'm now in my late twenties. Being trans doesn't really affect my life in any way until I have the joy of airport security.

I was extremely fortunate to encounter WMTDs every time I flew, until last week at MCI when I was in my first body scanner line. I considered opting out but I figured I'd see if I'd get an anomaly first as I was on my own so it was no big deal if it happened. As soon as I walked through the two male TSA agents ran away (yeah, really) leaving the lone female agent to awkwardly ask me about my gender and explaining that I had an anomaly in the private area. She then proceeded to pat down the other parts of my body that had flagged but went nowhere near my private parts. And then I was on my way, almost feeling guilty for not opting out and putting her through the awkwardness.

But reading this, it seems transgender training hasn't reached all of the TSA, or more likely, they're plain ignoring it, because they can. I look forward to the day this inevitably happens to me. Hopefully I'll be travelling alone or with people who are already privvy to my medical history.

Dont feel guilty at all. I think you are very strong person. All the best to you.

tanja Sep 22, 2015 5:08 pm


Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 25464202)
Well, jeepers, if they are all properly trained, why did they need a supervisor clerk and a passenger support clerk on the scene?

After this blow-off, I hope there's a civil rights lawyer out there who will take a case pro bono.

YES . Do Agree to 100 %.

84fiero Sep 22, 2015 7:46 pm

The body scanners should be eliminated altogether. Yet another incident illustrating why. Sad that TSA pretty much never finds its clerks are at fault.

SeriouslyLost Sep 22, 2015 10:25 pm

Well, I'm jolly glad that TSA were able to find that video so quickly and determine that they were perfect yet again in Stopping the Twerrorists!

Oh, wait...

Himeno Sep 22, 2015 11:23 pm


Originally Posted by 84fiero (Post 25465042)
The body scanners should be eliminated altogether. Yet another incident illustrating why. Sad that TSA pretty much never finds its clerks are at fault.

They never should have been rolled out in the first place. They don't work and have no place in airports.

GUWonder Sep 23, 2015 4:15 am


Originally Posted by 84fiero (Post 25465042)
The body scanners should be eliminated altogether. Yet another incident illustrating why. Sad that TSA pretty much never finds its clerks are at fault.

Their use has been expanding in the world, largely due to USG/DHS advocacy for/on behalf of this kind of technology. AMS and CPH have way too many of these machines, and use this unnecessary dichotomy of male vs female as if the spectrum of human sexuality consists of just two separate points.

kmflinkle Oct 2, 2015 12:56 pm

flying while transgender
 
I am a transgender woman, and planning to fly from Boston to Buffalo in November. This is my first flight since I publicly transitioned, I changed my legal name, and the name and gender marker have been updated on my driver's license which I will be traveling with.

I'm just not sure what to expect, I know many trans* folk fly each year without incident but after hearing the story of Shadi Petosky this past month, I am legitimately worried. Any advice would be greatly appreciated...

FlyingUnderTheRadar Oct 2, 2015 1:08 pm

Welcome to FT.

If you have PreCheck, make sure you are not wearing anything metal that might set off the metal detector. I go through wearing only medically required items - eye glasses and wedding ring.

If you do not have PreCheck you will need to go through either a pat down by another female or go through the body scanner. The latter of which are notorious for giving false positives which will result in a cursory pat down. As such, make sure everything is out of your pockets and you are not wearing bulky clothing.

Anything you take off put into your carry on bag - not into the bowls that others maybe tempted by if for some reason you are held up or distracted.

All of the above really applies to all fliers which helps them avoid a secondary inspection.

chollie Oct 2, 2015 1:24 pm

You might read the second entry (April 27, 2014) on this blog:

https://takingsenseaway.wordpress.com/page/2/

The author is a female former TSO who opts out of the NoS and wanted to travel unharassed while 'packing'. You may find her post helpful. Keep in mind that your experience may differ from one airport to another or even from one checkpoint to another in the same airport. Do NOT expect consistency and you won't be disappointed.

Himeno Oct 2, 2015 5:56 pm


Originally Posted by kmflinkle (Post 25509526)
I am a transgender woman, and planning to fly from Boston to Buffalo in November. This is my first flight since I publicly transitioned, I changed my legal name, and the name and gender marker have been updated on my driver's license which I will be traveling with.

I'm just not sure what to expect, I know many trans* folk fly each year without incident but after hearing the story of Shadi Petosky this past month, I am legitimately worried. Any advice would be greatly appreciated...

It will likely depend on how far you've transitioned.

They don't care what the gender marker on any ID might be once you've past the TDC (I've been traveling with new name and corrected gender marker for a year, but they won't let me go on HRT until work and family know about the whole thing, and there has been 'complications' with that). I've had more 'issues' with the gender marker listing F but still appearing otherwise from airline staff then from security or immigration staff (mostly confusion between name on boarding pass/manifest and appearance - once they've seen passport/pass, there's no problem).

The "issue" with the mentioned case last month was that she had been taking HRT and presented at the checkpoint as female, then opted to use the body scanner. As she appeared to be female, the scanner operator selected the female option. However, since she had not had surgery, the scanner alarmed and things went down hill from there.

kmflinkle Oct 3, 2015 7:42 am


Originally Posted by Himeno (Post 25510829)
It will likely depend on how far you've transitioned.

They don't care what the gender marker on any ID might be once you've past the TDC (I've been traveling with new name and corrected gender marker for a year, but they won't let me go on HRT until work and family know about the whole thing, and there has been 'complications' with that). I've had more 'issues' with the gender marker listing F but still appearing otherwise from airline staff then from security or immigration staff (mostly confusion between name on boarding pass/manifest and appearance - once they've seen passport/pass, there's no problem).

The "issue" with the mentioned case last month was that she had been taking HRT and presented at the checkpoint as female, then opted to use the body scanner. As she appeared to be female, the scanner operator selected the female option. However, since she had not had surgery, the scanner alarmed and things went down hill from there.

I've been on HRT for 18 months, full time since June, legal name / marker change in July. I'm non-op, so haven't had GRS nor do I intend to.

Skatering Oct 3, 2015 8:21 am

The thing to remember about the story from last month is it likely an isolated incident. Additionally, I think she declined requests I would consider reasonable, such as going back through the body scanner but with the 'male' button pushed instead, to see if the anomaly in the private parts disappears. ID documents, and any gender markers on them, should be irrelevant.

As a trans woman who opted out of having genital surgery, I'm always prepared for fun and games at security. However, it's only likely to present itself as an issue if you're selected for a body scan. I've only been through one once, and the TSA agent found the situation a whole lot more awkward than I did. She followed procedure perfectly, asking me what gender I was, and whether I wanted to be patted down by a male or female agent. Don't be offended if you're ever asked this...they're supposed to do this in case you might be genderqueer or somewhere in the middle of the spectrum (or even transitioning the other way). Confidence and courtesy is the key in these situations...not least because they're often prepared for confrontation themselves in these situations.

You should consider opting out of a body scan. If you do, you can decide whether or not to disclose your private history to the patting down agent or not.

chgoeditor Oct 3, 2015 11:59 am


Originally Posted by Skatering (Post 25512471)
The thing to remember about the story from last month is it likely an isolated incident. Additionally, I think she declined requests I would consider reasonable, such as going back through the body scanner but with the 'male' button pushed instead, to see if the anomaly in the private parts disappears. ID documents, and any gender markers on them, should be irrelevant.

As a trans woman who opted out of having genital surgery, I'm always prepared for fun and games at security. However, it's only likely to present itself as an issue if you're selected for a body scan. I've only been through one once, and the TSA agent found the situation a whole lot more awkward than I did. She followed procedure perfectly, asking me what gender I was, and whether I wanted to be patted down by a male or female agent. Don't be offended if you're ever asked this...they're supposed to do this in case you might be genderqueer or somewhere in the middle of the spectrum (or even transitioning the other way). Confidence and courtesy is the key in these situations...not least because they're often prepared for confrontation themselves in these situations.

You should consider opting out of a body scan. If you do, you can decide whether or not to disclose your private history to the patting down agent or not.


It's not entirely clear whether this would work based on the scanner images I've seen, but I'm wondering if you could do the tuck/tuck & tape and avoid the issue of having a gender mismatch.

kmflinkle Oct 3, 2015 2:58 pm

I usually wear long flowy skirts and layer, this generally eliminate the need to tuck because I find it super uncomfortable. What I've heard from other women who have tried tucking is that it still seems to alarm when going through the body scanner.

I'm thinking about signing up for pre check once I get my updated birth certificate - usually how long does a pre application take to process? The trip is not for another month and a half.

Skatering Oct 4, 2015 7:10 am


Originally Posted by chgoeditor (Post 25513262)
It's not entirely clear whether this would work based on the scanner images I've seen, but I'm wondering if you could do the tuck/tuck & tape and avoid the issue of having a gender mismatch.

I did think about that, but I read somewhere on here that an earring triggered an anomaly, so I think it's way too sensitive.

IMO, this is probably the only situation where the NoS beats the gendered body scanner. I suspect a naked image of me would look largely unremarkable. Still, it'll be opt-outs with free massages for me whenever I'm directed away from a WMTD in future.

SeriouslyLost Oct 6, 2015 11:42 am


Originally Posted by kmflinkle (Post 25513910)
I'm thinking about signing up for pre check once I get my updated birth certificate - usually how long does a pre application take to process? The trip is not for another month and a half.

As an aside, might I suggest considering Global Entry rather than Pre-Check? There are greater advantages to it and it takes you one (small) further step away from having to deal with TSA.


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