NY-FLA

I'd missed this one from this summer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tianjin...es_Flight_7554

A quote:
[According to the flight captain, sounds of screaming and fighting emerged from inside the plane at 12:32 pm and 5,700 metres (18,700 ft) above ground. The three hijackers in front were attempting to break down the door to the cockpit, according to the China Daily, injuring a flight attendant who resisted them. Witnesses note that the attackers were armed with the sharp ends of a disassembled aluminum crutch. Simultaneously, the three men in the back brandished metal bars and explosives, beating seated passengers while announcing "whoever stands up will die".

Upon hearing this declaration of intent, Fu Huacheng, a passenger and the minister of education for Lop County, recalled running out of his seat and shouting in Uyghur to his fellow passengers: "Come on! Let's stand up and fight them." Up to six mostly Uyghur plainclothes police responded to Fu's call; microbloggers confirmed witnessing plainclothes policemen removing homemade explosives from the suspects. ...

When the captain heard confirmation from a flight attendant that the events in the cabin were indeed an attempted hijacking and not just a fight, he turned the aircraft back to Hotan. The jet returned safely at Hotan Airport at 12:45 pm. The CAAC reported that seven passengers, two security officers, and two flight attendants sustained injuries from the fighting. In addition, two of the suspects died from injuries on board; another two of the four detained were taken to hospital for self-mutilation]


Proves again what most rational observers believe to be the case after the first 3 hijackings on 9/11/01; Boarding pass and ID checks, liquid and gel bans, BDO programs, accomplish nothing but constitutional failure and untold squandering of $$$$.
There are two "layers" that have an effect on terrorism and air piracy; Passengers willing to take action and fight back, and reinforced cockpit doors.

saulblum

Yeah, but this scheme has one fatal flaw: there's no money to be made by any companies in the homeland security sphere. Think of the detriment to our economy if the fine folks at Rapiscan and its ilk were on the unemployment line!

LaserSailor

The basis for a airline security system will never rely on passenger intervention as a primary deterrent, except in movies.

saulblum

And yet, in real life, every attempted attack against a plane since 9/11/01 has been thwarted by passengers and crew.

Funny how that works.

InkUnderNails

The ultimate security of the flight will rely on the actions of the passengers and crew. That is fact. It may not be the first layer or even the primary layer as TSA likes to call them.

It will always be the ultimate and final layer when the rest fail.

Denigrating its importance because of its uncontrollable and random nature disconnected from the "system" makes it no less important.

WillCAD

Hogwash. In the movies, passengers and crew are frightened sheep who are rescued by the likes of Arnold, Steven, and Kurt. The only pax who take action in the movies are the action heroes or those who are off-duty LEOs or soldiers or some such ilk.

In real life, if you threaten a man's life, he will fight you.

In real life, if you threaten a mother's children's lives, she will tear you limb from limb with her teeth and nails like a cheap slasher film.

In real life, passengers have subdued the Underwear Bomber, the Shoe Bomber, and dozens of drunks and people with mental problems who weren't actually a danger to the plane but who scared the bejeebus out of the other pax.

But you're right - the Security Establishment will never consider passengers to be any part of their vaunted Layers system, because they consider passengers to be the actual security threat. Which is insane, because the passengers are supposed to be iwhat they're protecting!

All except the Printer Cartridge Plot, which I believe was foiled by Brittish Intelligence.

nachtnebel

Yes, and it ignores the fact that UA flight 93 changed everything wrt terrorist options. they can't take over a plane like they used to. Armed pilots and reinforced locking cockpit doors. And the butt bomber incident showed they now also have very limited opportunities to do *anything* aboard the aircraft.

Which would lead you to an easier target: under the wing. Where of course, precious little screening and monitoring is done. Oh, and did I mention bribes to carry "contraband"?

Like LaserSailer says, only in the movies. So let's continue to grope old people, disabled people, children. In the abundance of a lack of any clue.

Superguy

I'd be ok paying for their unemployment. It'd be much cheaper than what they're paid as contractors.

NY-FLA

So instead we'll rely on the layers that in reality let the Times Square bomber float through JFK and onto his intended getaway plane?
And not rely on layers that are cheaper and demonstrably more effective?