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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 3:42 am
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JFK TSA fun

Just got in from HKG on CX830. We got in early and beat the BA flight in, so CBP was almost empty. I was second off the plane and got through the winding corridor in about 2 mins.

Once I got to an agent, it took longer to get through then it took to walk from the gate. They asked all the standard questions, but she couldnt seem to understand why I was taking [another] round the world trip on my own or how I could afford it. She asked me 3 times how long I was going to be in the US. I showed her my itinerary and eticket receipt for the ticket that has me enter/leave the US. Then she couldnt understand why that ticket was charged in Yen ("What's this?" pointing to the 6 digit number. "It was billed in yen...").

Got through after 5ish minutes of questions, waited another 10 mins for my bag and went to customs. I had marked on my card that I had food (chocolate bisects). The person checking the customs cards seemed confused that I didnt have anything else (like alcohol or cigarettes given that I dont drink or smoke, why would I?) I got waved through and headed off to T8. AA wouldnt let me use the elite lane (as OW Sapphire).

There were 2 barkers. One near the TDCs telling everyone to have ID etc out, another near the checkpoints demanding everyone take out liquids and take off shoes.

I pull out my laptop, put it in a tray and put my bags on the belt. Push them into the machine then move to the WTMD. They tell me to take my shoes off, I refuse for medical reasons. At the time, there was someone in the box getting a patdown, so I get told to wait. Once the box is free, they have me go through the MD and sit down in the box. Another TSO gets called over and picks up a hand wand, asking the first if I alarmed. They didnt, its the shoes. I get asked to take them off, I say cant, medical reasons. He disappears out of the box and finds a 2 strip to ask what to do. She comes in and asks the same thing. She gets the same reply. They grab my things from the belt and take them to the ETD machine then a number of TSOs have a huddle to decide what to do. By this point its now the assist TSO, the 2 stripe, a 3 stripe and the FSD.

They then go ahead with a full secondary screening, starting with a full pat down and grope. After the pat down, he disappears again to get the swab and swabs my shoes. Tests that, comes back to swab my hands. Both come back clear, and they go back into their huddle. Then the FSD comes in and starts with the dy..ft if I dont take my shoes off for xray.

I take them off while making a point not to put my feet on the floor and rubbing my buggered knee. They take my shoes, put them in a tray and run them through the xray. Comes back clean, they have me put them back on then go to the ETD where another TSO (thats 4 TSOs and the FSD now) starts going through my bags. Emptying one section at a time and swabbing everything. He finds my wallet and passes it to me to hold open while he looks inside without touching it.

He repacks my bags and Im free to go. Took about 20 minutes.

While I was waiting in the box, there was a young girl, about 8, who had a soft toy and was about to go through the WTMD. She gets yelled at to put it on the belt. She does then comes back, where she gets told to go put it on the belt again (not sure how she could when she already did).

While at the ETD, they call a bag check and find a half empty water bottle in the bag. Their bag gets a swabbing while the water bottle got put into a little box next to the ETD machine. About 30 seconds later the bottle was taken out and handed back to the passenger.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 6:38 am
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How about JFK TSA harassment? I'd file a complaint with TSA.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 8:14 am
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I'd tell the CBP it's none of her 'bleeping bizness' how I can afford a trip around the world...

These people really pizzzzzzz me off sometimes....stupid questions that have nothing to do with someone being admissable or not...yeah, yeah I know they are trying to check if someone is lying but whether or not I can afford my trip is NOTFB!
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 8:18 am
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Originally Posted by bluenotesro
I'd tell the CBP it's none of her 'bleeping bizness' how I can afford a trip around the world...

These people really pizzzzzzz me off sometimes....stupid questions that have nothing to do with someone being admissable or not...yeah, yeah I know they are trying to check if someone is lying but whether or not I can afford my trip is NOTFB!
You're not actually correct on this point. There have been several detailed discussions on this point, but the short version is that the CBP officer actually has a lot of latitude in terms of the questions that can legitimately be asked of an inbound passenger, especially a non-US citizen. Asking about who purchased the ticket the passenger traveled on, and the line of work the passenger is in certainly fall within these legitimate questions.

Annoying, but true
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 8:25 am
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Originally Posted by Himeno
They then go ahead with a full secondary screening, starting with a full pat down and grope. After the pat down, he disappears again to get the swab and swabs my shoes. Tests that, comes back to swab my hands. Both come back clear, and they go back into their huddle. Then the FSD comes in and starts with the dy..ft if I dont take my shoes off for xray.
If there was no unresolved alarm, it sounds like this dirtbag just violated the ADA.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 9:15 am
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Originally Posted by star_world
You're not actually correct on this point. There have been several detailed discussions on this point, but the short version is that the CBP officer actually has a lot of latitude in terms of the questions that can legitimately be asked of an inbound passenger, especially a non-US citizen. Asking about who purchased the ticket the passenger traveled on, and the line of work the passenger is in certainly fall within these legitimate questions.

Annoying, but true
Yep, Australian travelling on VWP. I sort of have to answer the questions or risk getting refused entry and stuck with paying outrageous amounts for visas the next time I want to come back.

She asked (some a number of times):
Reason for trip
Length of stay
Travelling with anyone
Any family in US
Any friends in US
Work
How much ticket cost
How could I afford it
Number of bags
and one or two others

Apparently someone working in a supermarket for almost 7 years and is now a department manager can’t afford a AU$15k airfare – even though I get paid ~US$600/week and started on ~$450/week. Maybe she didn’t like that I get paid more than she does?
So... someone who is single, traveling alone, has few living costs at home and has had a steady job for years can't use their leave each year to travel around the world on a holiday and meet up with their friends? The US is really too paranoid for its own good. At least she didn't send me to secondary like BOS did in 2007.

She finally let me through when I mentioned “credit card”.


The TSO who checked my bags looked a bit disappointed for a moment when he saw that the drugs in my bag are prescription medicine.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 9:20 am
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"While I was waiting in the box, there was a young girl, about 8, who had a soft toy and was about to go through the WTMD. She gets yelled at to put it on the belt. She does then comes back, where she gets told to go put it on the belt again (not sure how she could when she already did)."

This really pi$$es me off. Our two year old has had her Yo Gabba Gabba doll taken away from her twice by these morons. I am sick of my family being treated as criminals every time we get on a flight.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 9:21 am
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Originally Posted by Himeno
Once the box is free, they have me go through the MD and sit down in the box. Another TSO gets called over and picks up a hand wand, asking the first if I alarmed. They didnt, its the shoes. I get asked to take them off, I say cant, medical reasons. He disappears out of the box and finds a 2 strip to ask what to do. She comes in and asks the same thing. She gets the same reply. They grab my things from the belt and take them to the ETD machine then a number of TSOs have a huddle to decide what to do. By this point its now the assist TSO, the 2 stripe, a 3 stripe and the FSD.
They were actually huddling around to figure out how much they could detain you and exactly what they could do to harass you. They were probably also trying to determine just exactly how far they could push you without being called out for forcing retaliatory screenings on you.

Originally Posted by Himeno
They then go ahead with a full secondary screening, starting with a full pat down and grope. After the pat down, he disappears again to get the swab and swabs my shoes. Tests that, comes back to swab my hands. Both come back clear, and they go back into their huddle.
Yep. Their conversation this time went something like "This guy isn't showing any problem areas, and there's nothing much more we can really do without it becoming retaliatory. How about we assert our authority on him by bringing out an illegal threat?"

Originally Posted by Himeno
Then the FSD comes in and starts with the dy..ft if I dont take my shoes off for xray.

I take them off while making a point not to put my feet on the floor and rubbing my buggered knee.
Ahh... so they got what they wanted-- simply to harass you for absolutely no reason whatsoever.

Originally Posted by Himeno
They take my shoes, put them in a tray and run them through the xray. Comes back clean, they have me put them back on then go to the ETD where another TSO (thats 4 TSOs and the FSD now) starts going through my bags.
In full retaliatory screening mode at this point, even though you've bowed and genuflected to them. This was to teach you another lesson about "who's boss" at their checkpoints, and had nothing to do with good security or proper precautions.

Originally Posted by Himeno
Emptying one section at a time and swabbing everything. He finds my wallet and passes it to me to hold open while he looks inside without touching it.
I would have refused. They have no right to look inside a wallet once it's been through the X-ray unless they saw something suspicious in it.

Originally Posted by Himeno
He repacks my bags and Im free to go. Took about 20 minutes.
File multiple complaints about this experience, and be sure to include the wait time. 20 minutes to go through a screening is retaliatory-and-a-half.

Originally Posted by Himeno
While at the ETD, they call a bag check and find a half empty water bottle in the bag. Their bag gets a swabbing while the water bottle got put into a little box next to the ETD machine. About 30 seconds later the bottle was taken out and handed back to the passenger.
But, but, but, but... the war on liquids! Heavens... we're all in danger now... Someone made it through with a water bottle. Surely this must have caused a terminal dump?
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 9:27 am
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if the question re: affordability every comes up, just tell them you got a lot of MR and SPG pts that you redeemed.........that should shut 'em up.....for now
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 9:50 am
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Originally Posted by mrx900
if the question re: affordability every comes up, just tell them you got a lot of MR and SPG pts that you redeemed.........that should shut 'em up.....for now
It’s the first time I recall that question coming up when entering the US.
My travel history:
2005: US (enter SFO)
2006: Japan, UK, US (enter JFK and YYZ), Canada
2007: Hong Kong, Singapore, EU (enter Germany), US (enter BOS)
2008: US (enter LAX and YVR), Canada, EU (enter Spain), Singapore, Japan
2009: US (enter LAX), UK, Singapore, Malaysia, Japan

The “affordability/money” question has only come up at LHR last year and JFK this year.


Heavens... we're all in danger now... Someone made it through with a water bottle. Surely this must have caused a terminal dump?
Not before my MQ flight to BWI got stuck in the take off queue for an hour.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 10:49 am
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Originally Posted by Himeno
.....After the pat down, he disappears again to get the swab and swabs my shoes. Tests that, comes back to swab my hands. Both come back clear, and they go back into their huddle. Then the FSD comes in and starts with the ‘dy..ft’ if I don’t take my shoes off for xray.

I take them off while making a point not to put my feet on the floor and rubbing my buggered knee. They take my shoes, put them in a tray and run them through the xray. Comes back clean, they have me put them back on.....
why did you take your shoes off with a medical condition? if your shoes tested negative on the swab, that's it. the tso's and the fsd were flat out wrong

see this (look at page 3) and carry a copy with you for when you have to deal with the tsa

Last edited by goalie; Jul 28, 2010 at 10:55 am
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 11:41 am
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Sincerely doubt it was an FSD, they live in ivory towers and don't interact with pax, most likely a screening or terminal manager (the suits).
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 1:35 pm
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Originally Posted by Himeno
Yep, Australian travelling on VWP. I sort of have to answer the questions or risk getting refused entry and stuck with paying outrageous amounts for visas the next time I want to come back.

She asked (some a number of times):
Reason for trip
Length of stay
Travelling with anyone
Any family in US
Any friends in US
Work
How much ticket cost
How could I afford it
Number of bags
and one or two others

Apparently someone working in a supermarket for almost 7 years and is now a department manager cant afford a AU$15k airfare even though I get paid ~US$600/week and started on ~$450/week. Maybe she didnt like that I get paid more than she does?
So... someone who is single, traveling alone, has few living costs at home and has had a steady job for years can't use their leave each year to travel around the world on a holiday and meet up with their friends? The US is really too paranoid for its own good. At least she didn't send me to secondary like BOS did in 2007.

She finally let me through when I mentioned credit card.


The TSO who checked my bags looked a bit disappointed for a moment when he saw that the drugs in my bag are prescription medicine.

You may not like it nor understand it but the questions asked are used in this case to determine admissibility. This is based upon your ties to your home country which the questions help determine. It also assists in gauging the likelihood of the subject engaging in illegal employment while in the United States.

Also, just for your information, if the officer had as little as three years in service you do not make more then her based on your information. Not even close actually. An officer fresh out of the academy makes the top figure you have posted. Not that how much the officer makes has any bearing on the laws that are being enforced.

FB
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 1:49 pm
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So once you found out you might not be able to fly, your "medical reason" went away huh?

Maybe sticking to the truth will help expedite things next time.
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Old Jul 28, 2010 | 2:02 pm
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Originally Posted by DeaconFlyer
So once you found out you might not be able to fly, your "medical reason" went away huh?

Maybe sticking to the truth will help expedite things next time.


while making a point not to put my feet on the floor and rubbing my buggered knee.

Please learn to read.
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