Intl pax held 4 hours on 100-degree plane at BDL, more DHS and airline stupidity
Jun 24, 2010, 11:00 am
#46
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
Programs: United 1K, JAL Sapphire, SPG Lifetime Platinum, National Executive Elite, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 42,333
Jun 24, 2010, 12:18 pm
#48
In Memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Benicia CA
Programs: Alaska MVP Gold 75K, AA 3.8MM, UA 1.1MM, enjoying the retired life
Posts: 31,849
Seems like conflicting reports as to whether the pilots would be arrested....
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...pl_1gD9GHPNU00
HARTFORD, Conn. — The pilot on a Virgin Atlantic flight that spent several hours on the tarmac after being diverted to Connecticut had asked for permission to unload the stranded passengers, but a customs official threatened to have them arrested if they did, the airline said Thursday.
Customs officials denied the airline's allegation.
The trans-Atlantic flight's captain was told by a customs official at Bradley International Airport in Windsor Locks that passengers couldn't get off the plane until more immigration officials arrived, Greg Dawson, an airline spokesman in London, said in an e-mail to The Associated Press. It took more than two hours for the officials to arrive, he said.
The London-to-Newark, N.J., was diverted because of storms. Passengers sat on the tarmac in Connecticut for four hours late Tuesday and early Wednesday in rising heat and darkness. Travelers said they were offered water but no food; some fainted.
A federal rule limiting tarmac time to three hours does not apply to international flights.
U.S. Customs and Border Protection did not receive a call from the pilot, and no one from the agency refused a request to allow passengers off the plane, said Theodore Woo, an agency spokesman in Boston.
Customs officials denied the airline's allegation.
The trans-Atlantic flight's captain was told by a customs official at Bradley International Airport in Windsor Locks that passengers couldn't get off the plane until more immigration officials arrived, Greg Dawson, an airline spokesman in London, said in an e-mail to The Associated Press. It took more than two hours for the officials to arrive, he said.
The London-to-Newark, N.J., was diverted because of storms. Passengers sat on the tarmac in Connecticut for four hours late Tuesday and early Wednesday in rising heat and darkness. Travelers said they were offered water but no food; some fainted.
A federal rule limiting tarmac time to three hours does not apply to international flights.
U.S. Customs and Border Protection did not receive a call from the pilot, and no one from the agency refused a request to allow passengers off the plane, said Theodore Woo, an agency spokesman in Boston.
Jun 24, 2010, 12:23 pm
#49
In Memoriam
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Easton, CT, USA
Programs: ua prem exec, Former hilton diamond
Posts: 31,801
Yeah, wondering why all the mouthpieces are coming from London when Virgin's HQ is in America is in Norwalk, CT.
Apparently they are trying to find something to fine them for
Federal transportation authorities are investigating possible fines against Virgin Atlantic for stranding passengers Tuesday night for four hours on the tarmac at Bradley International Airport in Connecticut, reports Thomas Frank of USA TODAY.
And the blame game is beginning:
Virgin Atlantic says its pilot asked for permission to unload passengers stranded on a grounded plane in Connecticut but a customs official threatened to have them arrested if they got off the plane.
The news reports are saying the paramedics came on board, so it would seem the door was open for at least part of it, but they would not let anybody off.
Apparently they are trying to find something to fine them for
Federal transportation authorities are investigating possible fines against Virgin Atlantic for stranding passengers Tuesday night for four hours on the tarmac at Bradley International Airport in Connecticut, reports Thomas Frank of USA TODAY.
And the blame game is beginning:
Virgin Atlantic says its pilot asked for permission to unload passengers stranded on a grounded plane in Connecticut but a customs official threatened to have them arrested if they got off the plane.
The news reports are saying the paramedics came on board, so it would seem the door was open for at least part of it, but they would not let anybody off.
Jun 24, 2010, 12:31 pm
#50
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: LAX/TPE
Programs: United 1K, JAL Sapphire, SPG Lifetime Platinum, National Executive Elite, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 42,333
U.S. Customs and Border Protection did not receive a call from the pilot, and no one from the agency refused a request to allow passengers off the plane, said Theodore Woo, an agency spokesman in Boston.
Jun 24, 2010, 12:35 pm
#51
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Marriott or Hilton hot tub with a big drink <glub> Beverage: To-Go Bag™ DYKWIA: SSSS /rolleyes ☈ Date Night: Costco
Programs: Sea Shell Lounge Platinum, TSA Pre✓ Refusnik Diamond, PWP Gold, FT subset of the subset
Posts: 12,509
Phone recordings surfaced in the XE fiasco last summer. It would be interesting if that would be the case here again, or if something was captured on a LiveATC.net stream.
Jun 24, 2010, 12:47 pm
#52
In Memoriam
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Easton, CT, USA
Programs: ua prem exec, Former hilton diamond
Posts: 31,801
I'm sure it will come down to the exact timing of everything
Customs officers headed for the airport "as soon as we got the call at 11 p.m.," Woo said. At that point, customs had enough officers to "escort passengers to a safe area," he said.
Airport officials have said there was only one customs official at the airport Tuesday night when the flight arrived in Connecticut.
The airport called for customs inspectors around 11 p.m. when it learned the Virgin flight was canceled, said John Wallace, a Bradley spokesman. Passengers were allowed off the plane about an hour and 15 minutes later, when customs officials arrived, he said.
It would appear that the plane was already on the ground for over two hours before anybody even notified customs (acccording to the airport and customs). Even though they say there was a customs official at the airport when they landed.
Once they start going through the logs and files and the rest, I'm betting Virgin will not come out so good.
I'm still at a loss as to why the local and state police couldn't just escort them to the safe area and wait for customs, unless Virgin didn't even bother to ask for that.
The time the ambulance or paramedics were diapatched, etc could all be used to see who is telling the truth and who is leaving stuff out (notice Virgin did not say when they asked for Customs to let people off)
Customs officers headed for the airport "as soon as we got the call at 11 p.m.," Woo said. At that point, customs had enough officers to "escort passengers to a safe area," he said.
Airport officials have said there was only one customs official at the airport Tuesday night when the flight arrived in Connecticut.
The airport called for customs inspectors around 11 p.m. when it learned the Virgin flight was canceled, said John Wallace, a Bradley spokesman. Passengers were allowed off the plane about an hour and 15 minutes later, when customs officials arrived, he said.
It would appear that the plane was already on the ground for over two hours before anybody even notified customs (acccording to the airport and customs). Even though they say there was a customs official at the airport when they landed.
Once they start going through the logs and files and the rest, I'm betting Virgin will not come out so good.
I'm still at a loss as to why the local and state police couldn't just escort them to the safe area and wait for customs, unless Virgin didn't even bother to ask for that.
The time the ambulance or paramedics were diapatched, etc could all be used to see who is telling the truth and who is leaving stuff out (notice Virgin did not say when they asked for Customs to let people off)
Jun 24, 2010, 1:26 pm
#53
Moderator, Hilton Honors
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: on a short leash
Programs: some
Posts: 71,423
Jun 24, 2010, 1:50 pm
#55
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 39
If I had been one of the passengers on that plane, I would have been screaming bloody murder after 2 and half hours in 100 degree temp. (unless my seatmate was a hot woman who kept removing her clothing one after another to keep cool, or asked me to rub ice cubes on the back of her neck or something.......
)
Last edited by gelplanes; Jun 24, 2010 at 3:55 pm
Jun 24, 2010, 5:42 pm
#56
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,726
The majority of the news being reported on major networks are not even fact-checked before being aired. Schools of Journalism are where college students go when they can't hack Schools of Education.
Jun 24, 2010, 8:12 pm
#57
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Given VS's assertion that DHS threatened to have people arrested for getting off the plane at BDL, it sounds like VS was put into a bad situation by DHS.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100624/...anded_on_plane
DHS -- and fear of DHS -- is making this as bad as it is?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100624/...anded_on_plane
DHS -- and fear of DHS -- is making this as bad as it is?
Last year, the agency's investigation of an overnight stranding of Continental Express passengers on a runway in Rochester, Minn., revealed the flight's captain requested passengers be allowed entrance to the closed airport terminal.
An employee of another airline — the only person still working inside the terminal — refused to open a gate. Audio recordings showed the employee cited the absence of Transportation Security Administration workers in turning down the request.
The Transportation Department should consider including Customs and Border Patrol and the TSA in future regulations related to tarmac strandings, Hanni said.
"They appear to be a roadblock," said Hanni, founder of Flyersrights.org. "Often airlines tell us customs or TSA refused to allow passengers off planes."
Two years ago, the TSA told a task force on tarmac strandings that the agency wouldn't object to passengers being deplaned if they could be contained in a secure room inside the airport, Hanni said.
An employee of another airline — the only person still working inside the terminal — refused to open a gate. Audio recordings showed the employee cited the absence of Transportation Security Administration workers in turning down the request.
The Transportation Department should consider including Customs and Border Patrol and the TSA in future regulations related to tarmac strandings, Hanni said.
"They appear to be a roadblock," said Hanni, founder of Flyersrights.org. "Often airlines tell us customs or TSA refused to allow passengers off planes."
Two years ago, the TSA told a task force on tarmac strandings that the agency wouldn't object to passengers being deplaned if they could be contained in a secure room inside the airport, Hanni said.
Last edited by GUWonder; Jun 24, 2010 at 8:20 pm
Jun 24, 2010, 9:03 pm
#58
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Salish Sea
Programs: DL,AC,HH,PC
Posts: 8,974
I doubt CBP was talking directly to the captain. No telling who it was. Could have been a TSO
, sure sounds like one.
Jun 24, 2010, 9:30 pm
#59
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38,417
Sounds like Virgin was at the mercy of a incompetent local customs official. Instead of the stupid three hour rule passed by Congress, Congress should have mandated that airports and airlines establish written contigency plans dealing with distressed flights, including handling airlines that do not fly into their respective airport (like the case here) and handling International flights. The airlines should have been required to draw up procedures for a/c stranded either in an airport with a presence or one that the airline has no gates (staff). All plans should have been sent to the FAA for approval with the appointment of a special staff to review contigency plans.
This way everyone would have had protocol to follow when dealing with distressed flights.
This way everyone would have had protocol to follow when dealing with distressed flights.
Jun 24, 2010, 10:06 pm
#60
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: PHX
Programs: UA *Alliance
Posts: 5,702
Somebody mentioned it further up thread. The point in all this is that at some point it would have been reasonable to allow the pax to deplane into a secured facility that they couldn't wander off from. Heck an air conditioned (or not) hangar or out building on the airport grounds would have been preferable to the cabin of the plane.