Should CX have a F and Diamond only lounge?
Sep 13, 2017, 12:24 pm
#136
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2016
Programs: Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Explorist, Marco Polo Gold
Posts: 1,084
No more. Next year I will be Cathay GO (OWS), China Eastern GO (SkyTeam Elite Plus), and Sichuan Air Platinum. Thanks Cathay for letting me realized how the airline industry have caught up to you (or how you have sunk to their average level).
Sep 13, 2017, 6:59 pm
#137
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
Yes, definitely can.
However, I'm not sure I could retain DM too. I think that's a stretch for me. Your friend / fellow poster is extreme! I put too much random business to non-alliance airlines (EK, Alaska / JetBlue in the US), as well as random star alliance (SQ, some BR, LH and ANA) and skyteam (Delta in the US a few times a year, and Air France once or twice a year) flights. I'd essentially have to end this free wheeling approach to buying my travel and really focus harder on OW only.
Except for CX I'm not very loyal to any airline, just what gets me around and has a good product. I avoid AA when I can and absolutely refuse to fly UA under any circumstances.
However, I'm not sure I could retain DM too. I think that's a stretch for me. Your friend / fellow poster is extreme! I put too much random business to non-alliance airlines (EK, Alaska / JetBlue in the US), as well as random star alliance (SQ, some BR, LH and ANA) and skyteam (Delta in the US a few times a year, and Air France once or twice a year) flights. I'd essentially have to end this free wheeling approach to buying my travel and really focus harder on OW only.
Except for CX I'm not very loyal to any airline, just what gets me around and has a good product. I avoid AA when I can and absolutely refuse to fly UA under any circumstances.
Granted my last longhaul to Europe was last Easter!
But otherwise it is mostly regional in the afternoons - and never had a problem there (mainly fly leisure times)
Sep 13, 2017, 9:48 pm
#138
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 121
Last Sunday at Heathrow T3 lounge around 11am F side was completely full. Much more room on the J side. I actually prefer the J side to the F side in the morning, the breakfast buffet is better for me than the a la carte - there is no staff member to judge my sausage eating shame before the flight. Only a third of the lounge on the F side left when the flight was called, rest must have been OWE on other flights that day.
Sadly no chance of a DM/F only lounge in LHR though
Sadly no chance of a DM/F only lounge in LHR though
Sep 14, 2017, 3:21 am
#139
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: HKG, TXL
Programs: CX DM
Posts: 566
Last Sunday at Heathrow T3 lounge around 11am F side was completely full. Much more room on the J side. I actually prefer the J side to the F side in the morning, the breakfast buffet is better for me than the a la carte - there is no staff member to judge my sausage eating shame before the flight. Only a third of the lounge on the F side left when the flight was called, rest must have been OWE on other flights that day.
Sadly no chance of a DM/F only lounge in LHR though
Sadly no chance of a DM/F only lounge in LHR though
In LHR I feel like at least 1/2 of the CX lounge's guests are flying on other OW airlines. It's just a no-brainer choice compared to the other OW lounges in T3.
Here's where airlines should really be giving out lounge invitations to their own lounge when checking in to their flight...
Sadly, once people find out the CX lounge is by far superior, there's no rules stopping you from getting in as long as youre OWS/E
Sep 14, 2017, 3:54 am
#140
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: ORD [formerly] + HKG
Programs: CX Diamond, AA exExPlat, BAEC exGold, HH Diamond, Hyatt Globalist, Starriott Titanium, GE
Posts: 2,966
LHR is quite a different ballgame though. In HKG even if the guests of the Pier/Wing F are OWE, most likely they're on a CX/KA flight.
In LHR I feel like at least 1/2 of the CX lounge's guests are flying on other OW airlines. It's just a no-brainer choice compared to the other OW lounges in T3.
Here's where airlines should really be giving out lounge invitations to their own lounge when checking in to their flight...
Sadly, once people find out the CX lounge is by far superior, there's no rules stopping you from getting in as long as youre OWS/E
In LHR I feel like at least 1/2 of the CX lounge's guests are flying on other OW airlines. It's just a no-brainer choice compared to the other OW lounges in T3.
Here's where airlines should really be giving out lounge invitations to their own lounge when checking in to their flight...
Sadly, once people find out the CX lounge is by far superior, there's no rules stopping you from getting in as long as youre OWS/E
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
Sep 14, 2017, 4:24 am
#141
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: HKG, TXL
Programs: CX DM
Posts: 566
I'm not sure if that is the case. Sometimes I nosily peek at the iPads of the dragons, and further to a brief chat with them last week, the two AA and BA flights are huge 'culprits'. And CX loves them as technically CX's own flights don't gain themselves any $ here at HKG.
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
In LHR, there are quite a lot of OW flights leaving from T3 which are mostly long haul which most likely cater to more OWS/E card holders than those four non-CX flights out of HKG.
Sep 14, 2017, 4:51 am
#142
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: BA(GGL) QF LTS CX AM, Hilton Diamond, PPL(A)
Posts: 1,654
I'm not sure if that is the case. Sometimes I nosily peek at the iPads of the dragons, and further to a brief chat with them last week, the two AA and BA flights are huge 'culprits'. And CX loves them as technically CX's own flights don't gain themselves any $ here at HKG.
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
So a very good scenario here... would CX want to get:
(i) the CX fare from the OWE (and granting them lounge access) or
(ii) the lounge access fee from the OWE flying BA?
But of course, people here think that OWE flying CX should not get access to the lounge at all...
Sep 14, 2017, 6:44 am
#143
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2016
Programs: Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Explorist, Marco Polo Gold
Posts: 1,084
No one thinks that. But airlines like BA that games the system by providing their own amazing lounge for their top elites only, and offers a disgraceful "First Class Lounge" to satisfy OW requirements, do make us wonder why Cathay can't do the same.
Sep 14, 2017, 6:46 am
#144
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2016
Programs: Marriott Titanium, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Explorist, Marco Polo Gold
Posts: 1,084
I'm not sure if that is the case. Sometimes I nosily peek at the iPads of the dragons, and further to a brief chat with them last week, the two AA and BA flights are huge 'culprits'. And CX loves them as technically CX's own flights don't gain themselves any $ here at HKG.
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
My anecdotal observation last night, I should add that I spotted many BAEC tags. They should just forget about extra Avios and switch to flying CX rather than BA to LHR if they are so committed to make the trek to Pier...
Sep 14, 2017, 8:59 pm
#145
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 5,797
BA is not providing their top level lounge for DM equivalents though, status access is for their DM+ equivalents of which only a few hundred exist. Cathay could (and imo should) do the same but the thousands of DMs would not have access.
Sep 15, 2017, 5:21 am
#146
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: ROC/NYC/MSP/LAX/HKG/SIN
Posts: 3,212
Yes, I know I could get GS....but then I would have to fly United regularly!
. Hell no. I don't think my spending patterns are too strange for HK-based DMs, to be honest. I can quickly think of 4 or 5 friends, each of whom are DM, each who spend similar amounts.
What is under appreciated is our "knowledge" that we are, indeed, getting screwed. We know it. We tolerate it. We're aware that we spend more than probably a lot of OWEs in the lounge, but that's the rules to the game and no hard feelings. (not to mention, I am fully in favor of CX's old style Y and PEY Diamonds getting access to whatever the nicest lounge is at HKG. I'm basically in favor of enhancing the value of MPC at the expense of partners, and that includes Y and PEY fliers in MPC. I think CX royally screwed up by taking a dump on its extremely loyal, albeit Y and PEY fare, passengers. Dumb in my book.) The same argument that gets regularly tossed around here - well, if you guys don't like CX MPC, just switch over to AA / BA / etc - can easily be extended to the following: why the hell doesn't CX just enhance the value of MPC? One obvious way to do that would be offer perks to loyal passengers...and in my book that includes Y and PEY loyalty too.
It's not an exaggeration that I (and many peers/colleagues) could earn BA GO multiple times over in a year if we only did that program. I guess everyone has different patterns but it looks pretty darn easy to me if you're regularly paying for long-haul premium cabins. Even on partners, not necessarily flying BA metal most of the time. But we stick with CX for the most part because it's easy, it's the home airline, it has a ton of frequencies, we know the routine, J class is a solid hard product and F is very good (even though F&B sucks), and by and large DMs are treated above and beyond. This is a huge selling point. Even though there are some bad experiences here or there.
Yes, I bought a 70k HKD round-trip to EWR, my 6th such ticket this year. And yes I know that probably 1, 2 or even 3 of the passengers flying on similarly-timed CX846 will be on a cheapo partner award ticket, perhaps even Alaska which can be purchased for cash!!!.
With many of us knowing full well half of these F tickets are guys buzzing around on these cheapo Alaska and other partner tickets, when we're the idiots who have been paying for the wrong side of the arbitrage opportunity, I think that's where the real grating issue is for me. Eventually you have to say enough. We know we are the higher end of CX's (weakening) yield, and if they give us the middle finger in favor of the absolute lowest-yielding F passengers, then I can do the same back to CX. And we can see whose argument holds more economic water.
In fact, if you get the UA PassPlus, you can be GS right away, and use the credits to fly all *A partners, including NH and LH and use UA GPUs to upgrade to J or F. You don't have to stick with UA at all with those 50k USD UA PassPlus credits, but I believe you and most other CX FTers mentioned it's the hub captive so you don't want to waste too much time connecting elsewhere. With that I totally agree. However, considering you are not going to do too much work anyway for the rest of the same traveling day, especially taking evening flights, then I believe it is better to think about HKG-NRT-JFK or similar routings. Not too ridiculous in my book.
I totally got where you were coming from, in terms of using specific currencies to get what you want in the final product. Unfortunately, this is being categorized in game theories of FFPs, so I don't fault anybody who is trying to do similar things. To me, I don't mind looking at all the aspects of different FFPs to try to find which one suits me the best. Currently I am looking at ANA, where you can fly two RTs HKG-JFK PE to get ANA Diamond. I look at FFPs that contain LT status, which is the real meaning of loyalty programs. AS folks have found so difficult to get the seats they wanted from CX recently, so I bet CX are trying to close the seat release to AS.
And outdated AM expiration policy (I personally don't care about the upgrade policy and think US airline upgrade is an exception to the rest of the world). But I don't think CX will remove DM/OWE access to F lounge.
As Marriott and SPG PLT (not by link) I had almost no luck in upgrading in domestic Marriott properties (property-dependent, there is no systemwide upgrade policy and it's always a mystery to me); but overseas stays are usually great, especially with SPG. The thing is since the merger, we've seen the poorer cancellation policy - I am not sure if that's the only change. It seems like hotel loyalty programs are just "catching up" with airlines (while IHG is struggling with account security by forcing a four digit number password hehe)
I agree with the final paragraph.
As Marriott and SPG PLT (not by link) I had almost no luck in upgrading in domestic Marriott properties (property-dependent, there is no systemwide upgrade policy and it's always a mystery to me); but overseas stays are usually great, especially with SPG. The thing is since the merger, we've seen the poorer cancellation policy - I am not sure if that's the only change. It seems like hotel loyalty programs are just "catching up" with airlines (while IHG is struggling with account security by forcing a four digit number password hehe)
I agree with the final paragraph.