Flight Disruption
Mar 15, 2001 | 5:29 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 6
Flight Disruption
To those who are thinking about flying CX in the near future, please reconsider.
http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/For...ML/001594.html
http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/For...ML/001594.html
Mar 20, 2001 | 8:20 pm
#2
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: LAX, HKG
Programs: AA EXPLT, BA Gold, Shang Elite
Posts: 2,228
it seems some (or most) of the posters are the bitter pilots who are the real causes for the disruption.
i, for one, as a consumer, do not support their action. i would have more sympathy for the F/A's, not only becasue they make a lot less, also for their excellent services -- not to mention they are also better looking.
(rumours has that some of those pilots are making 1.5x to 2.5x their counterparts in US)
[This message has been edited by pegasus8228 (edited 03-20-2001).]
i, for one, as a consumer, do not support their action. i would have more sympathy for the F/A's, not only becasue they make a lot less, also for their excellent services -- not to mention they are also better looking.
(rumours has that some of those pilots are making 1.5x to 2.5x their counterparts in US)
[This message has been edited by pegasus8228 (edited 03-20-2001).]
Mar 21, 2001 | 5:45 am
#4
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: LAX, HKG
Programs: AA EXPLT, BA Gold, Shang Elite
Posts: 2,228
i believe they also realized this now....
i do recognize the contributions of these pilots for the almost perfect safety record though.
and even within the expat pilots, the newly hired aussie/canadian are pretty okay. it is mostly the highly overpaid brits who made the biggest fuss
i do recognize the contributions of these pilots for the almost perfect safety record though.
and even within the expat pilots, the newly hired aussie/canadian are pretty okay. it is mostly the highly overpaid brits who made the biggest fuss
Mar 24, 2001 | 9:09 am
#5
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 6
pegasus8228:
It is quite the contrary. It was the senior pilots that first caved into management demands in cutting salaries. Canadians are the ones that made the most fuss during the last sick out. They all stood up to the management. The Aussies, on the other hand, did not!! That's why the CX management prefers to hire Aussies.
CX pilots are making less than the US counterparts and don't have any pension scheme like the pilots in the US enjoy. We went through this comparison before on pprune.org. If you would like more details, please follow the link below. BTW,
1st year Second Officer HK$ 31,275 pm. (Usually last 2 - 3 years)
1st year Junior First Officer HK$ 47,982 pm. (usually last 18 months)
1st year First Officer HK$ 62,393 pm. (It takes a pilot 4 years to reach this salary level)
http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/For...ML/001470.html
It is quite the contrary. It was the senior pilots that first caved into management demands in cutting salaries. Canadians are the ones that made the most fuss during the last sick out. They all stood up to the management. The Aussies, on the other hand, did not!! That's why the CX management prefers to hire Aussies.
CX pilots are making less than the US counterparts and don't have any pension scheme like the pilots in the US enjoy. We went through this comparison before on pprune.org. If you would like more details, please follow the link below. BTW,
1st year Second Officer HK$ 31,275 pm. (Usually last 2 - 3 years)
1st year Junior First Officer HK$ 47,982 pm. (usually last 18 months)
1st year First Officer HK$ 62,393 pm. (It takes a pilot 4 years to reach this salary level)
http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/For...ML/001470.html
Mar 25, 2001 | 12:12 am
#7
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: LAX, HKG
Programs: AA EXPLT, BA Gold, Shang Elite
Posts: 2,228
i flew LHR-HKG last summer,
the F seat were occupied a number of UK-based pilots.
what i then heard was their home base is UK, and they will take the F seats to HKG to start their job. But the trip to HKG also counted as flying hour. is this true?
HK media has senior pilot income at around 150k-250k HKD....including housing/etc.
it has probably came down already.
My view is, we, as passenger, will not be on the pilot's side if our travel plans are disrupted, for whatever reason.
and i tend to agree with terrenz that CX management is partially responsible for the mess they created.
the F seat were occupied a number of UK-based pilots.
what i then heard was their home base is UK, and they will take the F seats to HKG to start their job. But the trip to HKG also counted as flying hour. is this true?
HK media has senior pilot income at around 150k-250k HKD....including housing/etc.
it has probably came down already.
My view is, we, as passenger, will not be on the pilot's side if our travel plans are disrupted, for whatever reason.
and i tend to agree with terrenz that CX management is partially responsible for the mess they created.
Mar 29, 2001 | 8:55 am
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 6
pegasus8228:
Yes, there are quite a number of pilots based in the UK and they would normally operate flights originate from the European destinations. However, due to operational requirements, they might have to operate a flight out of HKG instead. So they would need to deadhead travel (D/T) to HKG. In that case, captains are entitled to travel on a confirmed ticket in Business Class but can be upgraded to First on a space available basis.
The salary level that you quoted are pretty close to the real figures. Pilots that are based outside HKG do not get housing allowance.
On your next CX flight, come visit the flight deck and talk to the pilots face to face. The best time to visit is after the meal service. Tell the flight attendant that you would like to visit the flight deck and she will be happy to arrange it for you.
Yes, there are quite a number of pilots based in the UK and they would normally operate flights originate from the European destinations. However, due to operational requirements, they might have to operate a flight out of HKG instead. So they would need to deadhead travel (D/T) to HKG. In that case, captains are entitled to travel on a confirmed ticket in Business Class but can be upgraded to First on a space available basis.
The salary level that you quoted are pretty close to the real figures. Pilots that are based outside HKG do not get housing allowance.
On your next CX flight, come visit the flight deck and talk to the pilots face to face. The best time to visit is after the meal service. Tell the flight attendant that you would like to visit the flight deck and she will be happy to arrange it for you.
Apr 3, 2001 | 8:47 pm
#10
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: HKG
Programs: BA GGL, CX DM, AA LT GO, Marriott LT Titanium, Shangri-La DM, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton DM
Posts: 2,030
an excerpt from a Dow Jones Newswires article today...not sure which 15 airlines they are benchmarking against though...
In an industry benchmark document of 15 airlines provided by Cockpit, Lufthansa's pilots are ranked as the second-lowest paid after Spanish airline Iberia SA (E.ILA), while working the third-highest number of flying hours.
Lufthansa's pilots earn an annual income, including benefits, of around EUR115,000, with fixed salaries accounting for up to EUR70,000. Pilots at Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. (H.CPA) rank as number one among the 15 airlines, with fixed salaries of around EUR240,000 making up the bulk of each pilot's income of EUR280,000.
Lufthansa's pilots earn an annual income, including benefits, of around EUR115,000, with fixed salaries accounting for up to EUR70,000. Pilots at Cathay Pacific Airways Ltd. (H.CPA) rank as number one among the 15 airlines, with fixed salaries of around EUR240,000 making up the bulk of each pilot's income of EUR280,000.