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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 4:03 am
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Often1
3. It is far from "lecturing" for others to raise the travel insurance issue. First, OP may have travel insurance and be focused in the wrong place. Second, others gain valuable insight when problems repeat themselves. If OP does not have travel insurance, having had two recent tough experiences, perhaps he will obtain it. Others in OP's situation may choose to purchase it. Indeed this would have been easy if OP had travel insurance. Presuming relatively common terms (always worth reading carefully), he would have been reimbursed for his Qantas ticket and the insurance carrier would deal with CX.
It is "lecturing" because it is a moot point. How do you retroactively buy travel insurance? It is like telling someone who dropped the eggs that they should have bought a carrier for it.
And plus, travel insurance isn't always best. I've travelled loads without, and done fine. How much money have I saved?
It isn't quite so simple as the airlines' advertise (with that quote from Frommers that states travel insurance is always the best idea).
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 5:36 am
  #17  
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Originally Posted by phol
This (bolding) is the crux of the matter. It is on CX to accommodate the OP's request from the options provided by the CoC.

My interpretation of the original post is that the OP requested the options but never informed CX which they would like to take. By doing that they simply became a no show.
OP definitely has the right not to accept the alternate flight cx has arranged (if any) for him. This can hardly be treated as a no show.
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 7:46 am
  #18  
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Dear All,

Interesting and valuable feedback from everyone so thank you to everyone for their feedback. The recommendations for travel insurance, sure it would be valuable - however what really grates me is that Cathay wish to consume money for a product they failed to deliver or I actually utilized.

Please note again at the check in counter I was advised the flight was cancelled and then advised to go to the ticket counter to check for potential alternatives. Knowing there was 90 minutes till the Qantas flight departed and knowing that Cathay were unable to accommodate me to Manila the previous week I took the liberty of booking the Qantas flight.

Why couldn't Cathay at the check in counter offer me an alternative flight option / route if they had one ready to offer? At the Cathay lounge I updated the Cathay team with my flight details and even received one of their standard flight cancellation letters and even then Cathay refused to refund even with this generic signed letter.

Flyertalk team, thank you again for all your feedback. It is great to read everyone's different opinions and thoughts.
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 8:03 am
  #19  
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Originally Posted by percysmith
Not sure. OP tried (we don't know whether he really successfully raised such a claim to CX PVG) to get on the QF flight.

Obviously there's space given he subsequently was able to purchase a ticket out of revenue.

It's his option (per 10.2.2)

CX failing to honour the exercise of the option is a contractual breach, the liquidated damages being the reimbursement of OP's QF fare.
10.2.2.3 (refund) should be actionable at any time. But that won't reinstate the return leg of the ticket.

The other options, either on alternative CX services, or other carriers, must be at CX's organising or approval - as denoted by the words 'we shall' (and further emphasised by the words 'mutually agreed' later in the text).

This doesn't provide for the passenger to initiate their own actions or act unilaterally.
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 10:04 am
  #20  
 
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Originally Posted by DragonInTheAir
Dear All,

Please note again at the check in counter I was advised the flight was cancelled and then advised to go to the ticket counter to check for potential alternatives. Knowing there was 90 minutes till the Qantas flight departed and knowing that Cathay were unable to accommodate me to Manila the previous week I took the liberty of booking the Qantas flight.

Why couldn't Cathay at the check in counter offer me an alternative flight option / route if they had one ready to offer? At the Cathay lounge I updated the Cathay team with my flight details and even received one of their standard flight cancellation letters and even then Cathay refused to refund even with this generic signed letter.
It's more than just printing a new boarding pass for you... An airline need to check seat availability, check if there's agreed rate between them, re-ticket your ticket etc etc... If every check-in counters does so then the check-in queue will be even worse in such adverse situation... So check-in counter only needs to focus in getting passengers to Hong Kong. Foreseeable misconnection? Pass out to ticketing. Of course 1 counter is adequate or not is debatable, I don't see any problem of not handling your case at check-in counter

You can't expect every one there no matter what post/role he/she is in to help you resolve your problem... Else you risk yourself to be a DYKWIA guy...
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 10:36 am
  #21  
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Originally Posted by LchChester
OP definitely has the right not to accept the alternate flight cx has arranged (if any) for him. This can hardly be treated as a no show.
As the OP clarified down the page, he didn't even get as far as listening to the alternates, let alone accepting/denying them.

I really think he will struggle with this one.
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 10:47 am
  #22  
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Originally Posted by LchChester
OP definitely has the right not to accept the alternate flight cx has arranged (if any) for him. This can hardly be treated as a no show.
You are correct in the abstract. But, on the facts as OP posts them, he never asked for or obtained alternatives. He took it on himself to book new tickets.

Fully understand that the timing problems may have led OP to take this into his own hands and perhaps for good reason.

But, OP did so at his own risk and apparently without the benefit of insurance.

I still suggest that OP pay a visit to a CX office and present his paperwork in a cool, calm manner with no blame-laying or criticism whatsoever. With the right person, he may find some sympathy. Without that, he is done.
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 1:40 pm
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Often1
Quote:





Originally Posted by LchChester


OP definitely has the right not to accept the alternate flight cx has arranged (if any) for him. This can hardly be treated as a no show.




You are correct in the abstract. But, on the facts as OP posts them, he never asked for or obtained alternatives. He took it on himself to book new tickets.
It actually sounds to me like he did notify CX (at the lounge) of his refusal to accept any rebooking and his intention to seek a refund. Should be pretty straightforward, barring any desired reinstatement of the return segment.

I mean, I'm not familiar with the laws/regulations in HK/PRC, but if CX cancelled his flight, it seems logical that he should be entitled to a refund, period. With no regard for what may have happened in between the cancellation and the refund request. So what if he "no-showed" for a flight he did not agree to?
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 7:42 pm
  #24  
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Originally Posted by s0ssos
It is "lecturing" because it is a moot point. How do you retroactively buy travel insurance? It is like telling someone who dropped the eggs that they should have bought a carrier for it.
And plus, travel insurance isn't always best. I've travelled loads without, and done fine. How much money have I saved?
It isn't quite so simple as the airlines' advertise (with that quote from Frommers that states travel insurance is always the best idea).
Sometimes travel insurance is included in certain credit cards.
(I have claimed thousands over the years due to checked baggage loss/delay and flight delay, so I have done particularly well with it.)
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Old Jun 30, 2015 | 9:18 pm
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by ijgordon
It actually sounds to me like he did notify CX (at the lounge) of his refusal to accept any rebooking and his intention to seek a refund. Should be pretty straightforward, barring any desired reinstatement of the return segment.

I mean, I'm not familiar with the laws/regulations in HK/PRC, but if CX cancelled his flight, it seems logical that he should be entitled to a refund, period. With no regard for what may have happened in between the cancellation and the refund request. So what if he "no-showed" for a flight he did not agree to?
CX never had chance to offer any rebooking, so what for the OP to refuse?

For refund request, I would say telling the lounge entrance staff is the same as telling the custom officer that you want a refund... They are not in the position to handle it... What they can do would still be help you to call the reservation and let the reservation to handle it...

CX cancelled his first leg, not all subsequent. CX never had chance to offer alternative to OP. If everyone does so and CX or any airline entertains every such request, the rule that all sectors on a ticket must fly in sequence will be completely broken
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Old Jul 1, 2015 | 5:05 pm
  #26  
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Originally Posted by s0ssos
It is "lecturing" because it is a moot point. How do you retroactively buy travel insurance? It is like telling someone who dropped the eggs that they should have bought a carrier for it.
And plus, travel insurance isn't always best. I've travelled loads without, and done fine. How much money have I saved?
It isn't quite so simple as the airlines' advertise (with that quote from Frommers that states travel insurance is always the best idea).
There is certainly a point of serving as reference for others in the community when they plan their trips.

Insurance is risk transfer. You are carrying the risk yourself if you choose not to purchase insurance. You certainly saved money if nothing happened to your travels. But recognize that when there is an event of lost, like the OP's situation, the lost can wipe out all the "savings" from carrying the risk yourself.

Last edited by Ragnarok; Jul 1, 2015 at 5:24 pm
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Old Jul 1, 2015 | 9:51 pm
  #27  
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Originally Posted by phol
As the OP clarified down the page, he didn't even get as far as listening to the alternates, let alone accepting/denying them.

I really think he will struggle with this one.


Originally Posted by Often1
You are correct in the abstract. But, on the facts as OP posts them, he never asked for or obtained alternatives. He took it on himself to book new tickets.

Fully understand that the timing problems may have led OP to take this into his own hands and perhaps for good reason.

But, OP did so at his own risk and apparently without the benefit of insurance.

I still suggest that OP pay a visit to a CX office and present his paperwork in a cool, calm manner with no blame-laying or criticism whatsoever. With the right person, he may find some sympathy. Without that, he is done.
This is true that OP did not talk with CX for alternatives, but as the original flight was cancelled - there is no flight for OP to show up for - the rebooked flight, if any, does not count, as OP did not agree to any alternate flight. As such, the OP did not no-show.

OP has a choice to refund under 10.2.2.3, he is not bound to take the alternate flight offered by CX - but this is true only to the extent that if OP did not take the return leg on the same ticket.

By taking the return leg (which seems to be the case), OP actually complicated the matter - with hindsight, he should have purchased a RT with QF and refund the CX ticket in full.
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Old Jul 2, 2015 | 5:41 am
  #28  
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It is unclear how the OP could use the return leg of the ticket without using the outward leg. Strange that CX let him do that. In a sense, they have been quite accommodating. But it is hard to claim the reimbursement of part of that ticket once it has been half-used.

I fail to see why CX should reimburse the QF segment that the OP bought on his own will, without even considering alternative reroutings that CX would offer. Unfortunately long delays, even cancellations, are common from/to PVG and it is not uncommon that CX has to reroute pax with a connection in HKG. There are several daily CX/KA flights PVG-HKG and HKG-SYD. It is probable that the OP bought a cheap ticket on CX and that is the risk of misconnect.

On the topic of travel insurance, I think that the coverage of such an incident depends on the insurance contract. The question is whether the insurance on the purchased CX ticket would allow for the payment of the cost of the one-way QF ticket without the OP having even tried to be in touch with CX regarding alternative arrangements. But that is not the issue at hand anyway.
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Old Jul 2, 2015 | 4:58 pm
  #29  
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Originally Posted by brunos
Unfortunately long delays, even cancellations, are common from/to PVG and it is not uncommon that CX has to reroute pax with a connection in HKG. There are several daily CX/KA flights PVG-HKG and HKG-SYD. It is probable that the OP bought a cheap ticket on CX and that is the risk of misconnect.
Spot on. PVG is just a nightmare for delays, absolutely the worst in the CX/KA network. (Off topic slightly, I wonder if CX/KA would consider to stop issuing tickets where there is a sub 2 hour connection in HKG if the origination city is PVG. Discard the MCT for ex-PVG flights, particularly after 12noon. Or at least make the passenger insisting on the shorter connection sign some waiver of acknowledement that delays ex PVG are rampant and usually outside CX/KA control....remember the thread a few months ago when a poster proactively asked about his tight PVG-HKG-EWR connection? On our advice, i recall him/her being vigilant and showing up at PVG early, maybe snagging an earlier flight or something? I seem to recall he would've missed his connection had he not proactively made some changes.)

The PVG afternoon/evening staff must literally deal with freaked-out and angry passengers with onward connections every single day. They must have this act down by now. Which is why, in the context of this being PVG delay capital of the world (with also coincidentally is one of the top 3 outports for CX/KA daily frequencies), I bet CX/KA would've had a reasonable solution, although perhaps not precisely to the OPs liking in terms of timing. My point is, they must be very well versed in these problems at PVG.

To the OP: I would be curious what class and care bucket you bought, to Brunos point. Was either sector perhaps limited by the fare bucket? What was the cost? It doesn't make the situation right, but it would help provide some context. I've been following this thread earnestly....I know very little about all the issues brought up, and your unfortunate experience and all the back/forth on here has absolutely been a learning experience for me
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