span2121

Judging by the number of times I was (incorrectly) assured my flight on 17/2 would be fine, and assuming that it must be unlikely that they were all telling me something they knew to be untrue, I concluded that somebody somewhere wasn't telling them either. I decided that I would have no certainty at all until I actually saw the plane, sat in it and took off (assuming a mid-atlantic turn to say whoops sorry no visas for the crew wasn't likely) and I really could do without the uncertainty. So I changed to MCO - completely arsed up my arrangements, hotels, hire car etc etc. Given all the other cancelled US flights (according to ba.com SFO / Washington are also affected) I think BA really does need to provide an explanation to its customers before they are customers no more. I certainly will be writing a letter of complaint.

Terminalator

I think you are right to be sceptical - this message is now on ba.com:

British Airways has announced the cancellations of a service from London Heathrow to San Francisco on 20 February and a cancellation of a service from San Francisco to London Heathrow on 22 February.
The cancelled services are listed below:

The BA285 on 20 February from London Heathrow to San Francisco.
The BA284 on 22 February from San Francisco to London Heathrow.

NickB

The regulations are neither here nor there. They only deal with DBC, cancellations and delays, not with aircraft substitution even if operated by a third rate operator. So, it is purely a commercial decision on the part of BA what compensation, if any, they offer pax.

obs

I have to say noone seems to know whats going on. I was also told yesterday that all the MCO flights had been operating normally for some time. Today the flight to MCO was on a charter plane.

DYKWIA

Oh no! Has the MCO flight been affected before? I'm travelling to MCO in J on 9/3/05, and returning 15/3/05. I will be really p*ssed off if it turns out to be a charter flight.

I had the choice of BA in NCW or Virgin Upper Class. Both were similarly priced.

If I were to turn up at LGW and find out it was a charter flight, would I have the right to cancel the whole trip and get a refund?

Cheers,
Rick

dnw

rkenyon, you should be ok... the last LGW 777 is currently under the knife in Cardiff being dusked but its due back (enhancements non-withstanding) at the end of the month- so there should be a bit more cover by then!

DYKWIA

Thanks. The flight is showing as the new 3-class service, so hopefully I'll be OK.

Cheers,
Rick

dnw

More on the MCO substitution... apparently BA failed to advise passengers that their flight was being changed to charter-crap before or during checkin at MCO and the first they knew of it was when it was pulled onto the gate. 'Mini-riot' followed and the Orlando P.D. had to be callled in!

Take it with a bit of a pinch of salt, but there's probably some truth in it:
http://www.airliners.net/discussions....main/1963354/

bealine

I have to apologise to you all twice - I helped to check in the Tampa service this morning:

1. Not one of the Y class passengers had any contact whatsoever from BA regarding the aircraft change. One lady noticed her family's pre-assigned seating had been changed when she checked the internet late last night, but the on-line seating plan still showed the 777 config. The first indicator anyone had was at check-in (and, of course, those using self-service kiosks would get no indications until they reached the boarding gate!)

2. Talking to passengers who had used this service on the inbound sectors it is clear that the check-in staff at both TPA and MCO have not given any warning that the aircraft has been substituted - leaving it until passengers find out for themselves. (Apparently, last night, the US police were used to enforce boarding, as some passengers were refusing and becoming disruptive. This has not yet been confirmed, however.)

I am not clear on whether the airline has any obligation to provide compensation. It certainly used to be the case that the "contract" was to carry a passenger from point "A" to point "B". There certainly was no legal binding to convey passengers in their booked class, as long as the fare differences are refunded (when Princess Margaret was returned from Barbados with a broken leg a few years ago, the aircraft was "borrowed" as the regular BGI didn't have a first class cabin and the LGW-IAH pax were "downgraded" from F to J and some from J to Y.) Whether today's new compensation tables allow for this situation is unclear.

Certainly, the aircraft being used, whilst in charter seating config with business class seating similar to BA's from about 15-20 years ago, is clean, seemingly well-maintained and obviously recently refitted. The issue of concern is whether or not a standard is being provided below that offered by British Airways (and a BA Cabin Services Manager - today my good friend Steve - is on board to ensure BA's service standards are adhered to!)

Those of you who are regulars on the Tampa route will remember the old "AML" contracts. A DC10 fitted with an abysmal 2-5-2 charter config flew the route in full BA colours with crew in BA uniforms, yet normal fares were charged. Whether or not Bob Ayling set a precedent or not, I don't know, but sharp practise it certainly was!!! (....and then, when the 777 was introduced, it had atrocious "AML" seating 3-4-3 as opposed to everyone else's 3-3-3 config).

[email protected]

How long is this situation likely to last? I'm flying to Tampa on the 19th and returning on the 30th of March (out in Economy, back in Club). Do I have any need to be worried that planes on these days will be substituted?

Regards

Rob

dnw

The new EU rules are quite clear on class downgrades in addition to cancellations. For everyones info (this is more of a concern to me than denied boarding), here is the relevent excerpt from the new law:


The questions is, as always, what constitutes a downgrade? in bealine's Princess Margaret example (I thought BGI has always had the F cabin ) the IAH passengers being downgraded from F>J and J>Y are entitled to compensation. The problem is on 'substitutions' - substituting BA J for charter crap J is not officially a downgrade but of course it is in practice. I suspect some more EU regs and clarification will be needed in the future...

jemetpl

I'm sorry but assuming that they are using the same plane they used last week (and Euro Atlantic only seem to have one 767), it had not clearly recently been refitted. I accept that it was clean and I do not know whether the engines etc were well maintained but the seats and the lighting were definately not up to scratch.

I have friends who are flying out on Sunday and they always use BA. Is it likely that this travesty of a service is going to be inflicted on them as well?

bealine

.....My mistake - I am informed it was ANU (Antigua). Memory's not as good as it was!

bealine

Right now, it's anybody's guess. However, the heat is definitely on for our managers to sort this mess out! As I type, G-VIIA and G-VIIB (two Gatwick based British Airways 777's) are due to operate tomorrow's MCO and TPA, but I will only believe it when both machines have pushed back!!!

phreegreens

I'm currently in Orlando and due MCO-LGW on the 2036 Saturday (19th) if anyone gets any update on the aircraft status could they pls. post.

I will reroute rather than fly on a crap charter aircraft, especially as I am full fare J class and banking on a sleeper bed and some comfort to get me through a busy Sunday. (MMB was showing this as a dusked aircraft.)

thanks...!!