Anchorage Flyer

Flying from Florence to LHR on Saturday the flight the flight was delayed 8 hours because the plane was too heavy to safely take off. For 3 hours the pilot and BA discussed how many passengers would have to travel by bus to Pisa then reboard the plane there. After 3 hours of deliberation 50 passengers were told they would have to travel by bus to Pisa with their luggage then check in, go through security then board the plane. Meanwhile the rest of the passengers flew to Pisa then waited for the rest of the passengers. After 2 hours the pilot informed the passengers on the plane that the bus had not yet Florence due to a problem with luggage. Another 3 hours passed before the bus arrived and passengers boarded the plane. The plane left Pisa 8 hours late.

The pilot called this event an “Absolute Shambles,” but apparently this has been happening at Florence airport a few times recently. Is theAirbus 320 too big a plane when full to fly out of Florence. Is the runway in Florence to small for such a plane. Why is BA doing such a disservice to its passengers? Many of the passengers had very young babies with them. One pregnant lady was taken off the plane in Pisa then retuned just before taking off.

Does BA owe some form of compensation to these passengers?

bisonrav

Everyone should be due EC261 if there was an 8 hour delay. This is an operational issue, the airline is supposed to manage the payload to be under the maximum allowable take off weight. There are standard calculations and tables for this, I expect Florence has a shortish runway and there are considerations for atmospheric pressure and temperature at runway level.

The solution seems reasonable to be honest in that everyone got home, but if 50 passengers were affected, it seems this wasn't just a marginal issue. A more sensible method might have been to offload bags and send the later, but hey ho. There was probably a reason for doing this.

bisonrav

Anyone interested in this, have a look at

/home/td_d570_pro_data_tmp/N000042618807-IMSDALI-AC20201125-N/24X/tmp/fopostpro-tmp.dvi (airbus.com) - the range/payload/take off weight calculations are 140 et seq. There are standard estimates for passenger plus baggage weight, and fuel is also taken into account. You can find information on Florence here

LIRQ/Florence Amerigo Vespucci Peretola (Firenze) General Airport Information (acukwik.com)

It is indeed an extremely short runway at 5118 feet. As a point of comparison, Southend, which is also a short one, is just over 6000. Heathrow is 13000

ScruttonStreet

It seems odd. I know there were problems earlier in the summer because the wind was from the wrong direction, but I'm here at the moment and the winds have been very light, and while it has been hot (33 degrees) it's not exactly that unusual.

Still, better safe than sorry.

South London Bon Viveur

BA may feel like they are between a rock and a hard place, but everyone was inconvenienced here, whereas they could have offloaded and re-booked the 50 or so passengers on other flights and taken off thereafter straight for London. At least that way, only the 50 or so off-loaded ones would have been inconvenienced. I believe that the operational challenges at FLR are well known, so I am not sure where the fault lies here. Should BA only book aircraft to 70% capacity, or are they right to book to full capacity in the knowledge that every now and then (is it only every now and then or is it actually quite frequently) they need to offload, or leave cargo behind? I don't have the answers, but it does seem as though FLR with the 320 should come with a health warning (and of course it doesn't) so I feel for those passengers.

BA or bust

As bisonrav has stated, there are a lot of considerations when an airport has a short runway. Florence’s is only marginally longer that LCY. Add in a heavy aircraft and high temperatures and (quite rightly) the pilot will have to make changes to reduce the weight of the a/c. Now a separate consideration is how well it was handled by BA. Sounds like not very well. I would have thought that, given the short runway, they would have established a plan for these sort of events. However, since BA clearly knows the amount of passengers (and luggage) booked on the flight, it should not have happened in the first place.

bisonrav

The criteria are set such that there is a safe takeoff with only one engine operational I believe. It's a safety issue so no wriggle room in the calculations.

lorcancoyle

Assuming they took fuel out as well (why would they need fuel to London if just flying to Pisa) that’s a massive miss…

1 hours worth of fuel would be 25+ passengers I’d guess

bisonrav

Definitely BA on the hook here I would think. If slightly overweight and only a few passengers offloaded then you could argue weather changes possibly. But 50 plus baggage is a major miscalculation, possibly on freight. Was this flight mentioned in the delay and cancellation thread?

bisonrav

Calculation here was likely that if you have 50 seats on a coach you might as well take 50 off and leave the fuel loaded, as presumably there are some safety risks during removal of fuel. Fascinating incident, glad I wasn't on it though!

zarp

Well known issue - you're generally better off flying to either Pisa or Bologna from Heathrow or fly to Florence from London City as BA CityFlyer use smaller planes.

Anchorage Flyer

When the plane finally landed there were no buses to transport everyone to the terminal! Another long wait.

c1223

See here https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/34886172-post42.html

Anchorage Flyer

The issue here is the total disregard for the passengers by BA. If this had been on an American flight I could foresee a lot of macho nasty behavior occurring. Instead the majority of the passengers were respectful to the cabin crew who probably wanted to be home too.

c1223

See here
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/34886172-post42.html
and here
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/35183669-post29.html