stevebintley

BA1396 LHR-MAN this afternoon was due to push back at 15:15. It was a full flight and everyone being encouraged to check bags in, but otherwise a drama free boarding process and everyone was boarded by around 15:05.

Lot of people in and out of the cockpit at that point and eventually we were told we were waiting for some connecting passengers.....twenty minutes later still waiting....and thirty minutes later the decision was clearly made to give up and we pushed back - no one else had boarded. Although no notice was given that we'd be setting off - people were out of their seats fiddling with luggage in the aisle and the passenger across the aisle to me didn't return to their seat from the toilet until the safety briefing was completing the life-jacket element.

We ended up landing about fifteen minutes late at MAN. While not as well travelled as the rest of you, I've never experienced a delay being caused for such a reason so I'm wondering if this is a new approach? Were they likely to be Prem customers? Or is this just normal? It seemed odd to wait so long given that it wasn't the last flight of the day to MAN, with BA1402 just a few hours later, so why hold a whole plane if you weren't certain they'd be making it in time?

corporate-wage-slave

It isn't unusual, though as you indicated, more usual on the final flight to somewhere, and domestic is in the frame for this more than other services. There again the final flight may have been full so the connecting passengers may have had to stay the night. An indicator is if the checked bags were at the aircraft side, it's possible they were loaded if the missing passengers had completed Ready to Fly, and there is the usual dilemma as to whether to wait 15 minutes or spend 20 minutes offloading the bags. This may have happened anyway and the bags kept by the aircraft awaiting the missing passengers. BA doesn't actually make a habit of this, timekeeping remains a high priority on the whole, but from time to time it's about balancing the options. Sometimes it works, sometimes not.

scottishpoet

will depend on the size of the group, and to some extent the space available on the next flight

it happens, one day when youa re a late connecting passenger you may be glad if they held the flight for 10 minutes for you

on one trip with czech air there was a large group connecting from my flight to EDI , a few of us to LHR

CZ held the EDI flight but not the LHR flight

HarryHolden68

Perhaps it was a large group that BA would have to get to MAN one way or another and with later flights busy, there were not sufficient seats on a later flight? The cost of providing over night accommodation, expenses and possibly all those EU261 claims made holding this flight the logical decision. Maybe a VIP or a Premier. You rarely do get to find the definitive reason for things like this. It just comes with flying.

ThatT1Feeling

This has happened a lot to me on the MAN route. It’s so frustrating as on time arrival is very important for me so I can be at my client on time. Not VIPs or Prems - just BA making the wrong prioritisations from my perspective.

orbitmic

Basically, the sum of all answers above is correct. It is neither new nor systematic, and largely a Captain decision, but basically depends on:

1) Is there an easy alternative for those passengers should they miss this flight (ie typically, is there another same day flight with seats left);
2) How many are we talking about and coming from how many different flights;
3) What is the expected delay (how far are they, would there be additional delay for either loading or offloading luggage in case of waiting for the passengers/offloading them);
4) Not the most important, but are there many high contribution pax affected/VIPs
5) What is the expected flight time (is the flight likely to catch up some of the delay anyway);
6) Are there generalised delays on the day (e.g. weather or strike issues that could lead to ripple effects either way)

It's not an exact science, but in short, if there are two passengers missing, their flight is very late and there will be another connection available two hours later: no way in hell anyone will wait; by contrast, if there are 30 F and J pax whose flight has already landed and should be there within minutes and there is no same day connection, and the flight is scheduled to be a short one, the plane will certainly wait a bit and spare BA from compensating those 30 people.

I'm sure I am forgetting some other possible criteria!

SpeedbirdLHR

The decision is made by the ops team and not the captain. They will look at a number of factors including the factors mentioned but also consider the impact of the return service and any customers connecting from that flight. Consideration would also be given to crew hours, slots, weather etc

South London Bon Viveur

That makes sense as the Captain presumably wouldn't have visibility on loads of other flights etc.- presumably enough on their plate with prep for their own flight. However, if ops ask Captain to stay put, presumably he/she can nevertheless make the call to leave, or is that something that would not happen in practice?

I've seen a few mini-delays for connecting passengers, on various airlines, so not new or unique to BA. With the block time on MAN being, I imagine, over an hour, you can usually leave a good 15-20 mins late and still be more or less on time. Same with AMS, where the schedule is padded to around 1hr 20 even though time in air is usually no more than 50mins.

NickB

Perhaps vulnerabilities/special needs taken into account too? Not on BA but on AF, I had a departure delayed by over 30 mins to allow UMs who were apparently delayed at passport control to get onboard.

Waterhorse

It is not a commanders decision in any way shape or form. The Captain has a wide range of power and authority but they still work for BA and, if Ops want the aircraft delayed for connecting passengers then that is what happens, unless there is a significant safety issue in waiting.

It used to be policy that we didn’t wait for connecting passengers as the cost was deemed to be greater in delaying than dealing with the delayed passengers. However, with reduced frequencies and other changes caused by the current Covid state of play, we quite often seem to be waiting for connecting passengers, particularly with domestic flights, and particularly with Manchester flights.

G_CIVV

You wouldn’t think so based on recent performance. Even during fine weather, recent punctuality out of LHR has been consistently abysmal, both short and long haul. The entire T5 operation is shambolic at times and needs to improve urgently.

corporate-wage-slave

Indeed, this has gotten a lot worse in recent weeks. For much of the last year, with empty skies and poor passenger loads, timekeeping improved markedly even with LHR down to 1 runway. Now it is a bit of a shocker, apparently due to staff shortages across the board in LHR.

LCY8737

Looks like there have been a lot of bad days since September...

https://speedbird.online/flight-stat...?view=delayhrs

sigma421

I was also on this flight. My theory at the time from a look at the schedule is that the gap to the next MAN flight being over 3 hours incentivised BA to hold this flight since those passengers may have been eligible for compensation has they missed it.

fripperies

This happened to me on the MAN route. I was on a delayed arrival from US and they announced the MAN flight was being held for connecting pax. Not VIPs or Prems - just BA making the right prioritisations from my perspective.